New fruit orchard

[Mattyq2402]

I located a group of pear on my old family farm in a location i had never been this past week. One small circular pear was bitter with a kick of sweet and the other was crunchy and sweet. I had three mature bucks visiting in daylight, one a monster 14 point. The trees are right against a non fenced property line and there is amazing cover on all ends minus a 1/2 acre field that connects to this small clearing with the pear trees via an hourglass runway.

Im thinking about adding a couple apple trees/crab extending into the property which would be in my shooting lanes. Neighbor is reasonable and allowed me to enter him for recovery of my buck.

I saw whitetail crabs has 30-6 available and crossbow. I also saw nativ nursery has crab and mex and american plum available. Would you guys reccomend these or should i wait to try and get some scion and graft one or two of yalls slam dunk trees in there? I plan on eventually buiilding a home on this property when I retire in 8 yrs and would like to have some more fruit available to really draw the deer to this hot spot.

 

[Tree Spud]

What is your USDA zone?

 

[Mattyq2402]

Zone 6

 

[cavey]

" Neighbor is reasonable and allowed me to enter him for recovery of my buck."

No deer is worth that ....


Sorry could not resist

 

[Mattyq2402]

No deer is worth that ....


Sorry could not resist

Haha, took me a sec.

 

[buckdeer1]

I would plant apples and pears,as pears are easier to take care of.Make sure apples are cedar apple rust resistant and pears are fire blight resistant

 

[cavey]

Toss in some crabs maybe too

 

[buckdeer1]

I think I only have 3 crabs left and 2 of those are junk trees.The other one at least produces fruit that a bird will eat since they hardly ever fall.The other 2 are nickel size fruit that never falls till they dry up.I would plant some if you have room,if not just plant the fruit tree that will pollinate the trees you plant.

 

[cavey]

Chestnut crab, Whitney, Dolgo crabs to name just a few are in many cases far better than most of the apple trees people choose:

- Crabs tend to be annual producers, super hardy cold and disease wise and are often long time span droppers. They are far better at cross pollinating than most apple trees due to their longer bloom times. Smaller less than standard sized crabs allow you to plant more trees in tighter spots as an added bonus. Those that hold tight/late(more ornamentalish) even if small sized provide a late winter food source for a mess a wildlife especially deer. A certain percentage of your crabs if you plant enough should be smaller sized fruit bearing ones - deer are snackers and nibblers for the most part... they eat tiny grain seeds so even 3/8" crabs are large tasty treats to them. As with all animals - wildlife coming and going from a popular multi use food source will attract even more wildlife - they know why other critters are going in. I believe it actually has a calming or at least distracting effect on the deer which is also a bonus. They maintain there fruit size even with a lack of pruning where as apples tend to crab down in size if not aggressively pruned constantly.

I have a wild crab variety I cut scion from that had masses of pea sized crabs - the ground under that tree is pounded to bare dirt every winter as the deer and turkey were gobbling up what ever rained down - I am more excited to see those dozen grafted trees bear than I am of some of my more exotic apple varieties

I would say crabs are more essential then non and should be blended into your plantings. The first fore mentioned crabs are large and are great to eat... which brings in an added added bonus for you.

Variety is the spice of life and I think you will find we all start out pushing apples apples apples then realize that they are ok - well better than ok but, you have pears which many of us would love to have established - keep the variety thing going. 25-30 percent crab to apples is a solid wildlife blend especially if your not going to harvest your apples.

I think if you specifically asked you would find a fair amount of the old time fruit guys here are adding more and more crabs to their wildlife orchards than in the past.

 

[4wanderingeyes]

I think I am about 50/50 crabs. But I have several Chestnut crabs, and they are my favorite crab to eat. So I don’t just consider them a wildlife apple, plus they work well for pollination.

 

[chickenlittle]

I'm one that doesn't focus on crabs. I don't plant crab seedlings to see what I'll get (fruit size, disease, drop time, etc). I have a few planted and mostly focused on named varieties, scab resistant ones like Puget Spice if possible. Some, like Chestnut crab, are called a crab but are really just a small common apple with pretty good genetics. Most of my tree losses have been crabs and some other crabs just don't wow me with growth and fruit output yet. I don't put a lot of value on having apples hanging until spring; I'd rather deer hang out browsing in the woods once I'm done hunting in January.

Before I decide what to add, I like to do some research on disease resistance and that can be harder to do for the home selected or proprietary varieties marketed for deer. Takes a bit for people to plant those then in different areas of the country and gather and report data like we've seen for the Franklin Cider. A loaded crabapple tree with no leaves in September is not a winner for me and I'd pass on grafting it. I don't want to add varieties that add to scab spore pressure on my other trees. But for any apple or crab, it can be a crapshoot to decide how much risk there is in planting it in your location as the information is almost always imperfect.. You can always regraft it to something else in the future.

 

[Apple Junkie]

Your comments are spot on in my view cavey. I started by planting common apple varieties with known characteristics, and I still really appreciate them. I graduated to planting crabs for the reason you so aptly pointed out and they are a welcome addition to the orchard. Now, I am getting picky and attempting to graft what seems to work on my ground and for my purposes (mixed success, I’m no tree surgeon for sure). In addition to the varieties you favor, I’d add the underappreciated Ida Red standard apple and Wickson crab. Next… pears?!

 

[buckdeer1]

That is true,I should have worded different.The crabs that i bought 10 years ago that were supposed to be for wildlife are getting replaced with fruit trees.I do have some doglo but they aren't producing yet.I just don't depend on them for pollinators

 

[BobinCt]

What gets my attention is you located the trees on part of the farm you never been before. If you plan on putting fruit trees there, they better get plenty of sun throughout the day. Lack of sunlight will be a dud. I’ve made the mistake before so I’d hate to see others do it.

 

[Mattyq2402]

What gets my attention is you located the trees on part of the farm you never been before. If you plan on putting fruit trees there, they better get plenty of sun throughout the day. Lack of sunlight will be a dud. I’ve made the mistake before so I’d hate to see others do it.

I always wrote this property off growing up, only hunted one time my entire life prior to last week, never scouted it. My cousin had a cam out and grabbed pics of the 2 giants, he doesn't archery hunt.. i was looking at cam pics and sun hits the location till about an hour before dark. There's also another corner of the other section of field where sun would hit good, im thinking about putting a couple there but don't want to steal the draw of what they already like. A lot more stand and blind opportunity if I plant the other part of the field.

 

[Bowsnbucks]

As Chickenlittle said above - as a start, planting a few disease-resistant varieties will save SOME headaches. If bugs are a problem, they still require spraying if you want flawless trees. But researching for disease-resistance (DR) is never a bad idea.

Every location is different. Minnesota / Wisconsin soil, climate, disease prevalence varies from N.Y. / Pa., Md. / Va., Tn. / Ky.

Maybe talk to local orchard owners to see what THEY view as easier trees to grow in your area. Research and planning saves crap later.

 

[buckdeer1]

I was looking around today while walking out,I have more crabs than I thought.Many were planted years ago and were supposed to be wildlife trees.I still do not like ones that do not feed either birds or animals so since I don't graft I usually dig the stumps up and replace with a different tree.Sometimes I just move a already producing fruit tree.I have a couple trees that produce what appears to be a red apple alittle bigger than a golf ball.I also have golden hornet but is still only couple years old.I have several that has fruit the size of a nickle and they just dry up on tree.I also I a couple that produce a bigger fruit but they also dry up on tree.These trees have thorns.

 

[homerj1]

These trees have thorns.

Sound like hawthorns

 

[Bowsnbucks]

FWIW, hawthorns are good food for birds of all sorts. Grouse and turkeys love those red berries, which are typically about 1/2" dia.

Also, the smaller "bird crabs" we have that make 3/8" to 1/2" dia. fruit get eaten by deer here. They'll eat what they can reach, plus any drops that hit the ground. We've had turkeys and grouse sitting in the "bird crab" trees, eating those smaller crab apples. Deer and birds all benefit from those smaller crabs. They're a plus for us.