Most turkeys killed by predators are yote victims

[Bill]

Had an interesting discussion with a guy working for MDC today. He's heading up a turkey study and wanted to trap, tag, and radio coller turkeys on my farm and in the neighborhood.

He said when a turkey stops moving for 8 hours the sensor sends out a death signal and they try to locate the remains and establish cause of death. I jokingly said that's easy a coyote killed it. He said that's true in about 90% of the time.

They even asked if I had any rules they needed to follow. He made a note that they must call me between Sept and Nov before heading for any remains. He wasn't real concerned as most birds are taken in the spring when thier sitting on eggs.

I thought the whole thing was interesting and thought I'd share. I doubt they'll do it but I asked him to set the net cannon up in front of one of my trail cams. :)

 

[sandbur]

Sounds like another good reason to keep coyote hunters out of my woods.

I would much rather have the coyotes than the turkeys.

 

[bueller]

Sounds like another good reason to keep coyote hunters out of my woods.

I would much rather have the coyotes than the turkeys.

This thought process seems flawed coming from someone managing for deer. I've seen deer traveling with and feeding with turkeys on many occassions. Can anyone say the same for deer and coyotes?

 

[Catscratch]

Can anyone say the same for deer and coyotes?

Watched deer and coyotes in the same area/field many times, never seen a coyote mess with a deer even once. I have seen does and young bucks chase a coyote off a food plot before but never the other way around. I really think critters act different in different locations. There's lots of evidence that coyotes kill deer (on the internet) but I've never found or seen evidence of it locally.

 

[sandbur]

I have found a deer kill on glare ice that was made by coyotes.

If I am on a deer stand in the woods and I see turkeys, I might just as well pack up and head home as I never see a deer. Most deer hunters in my area feel the same way. I am talking about thick cover and the deer on my place are still very skiddish and almost totally nocturnal. They have been that way for three years.

I have not seen a turkey on my farm for about 8 months and am very happy with that.
I prefer to have grouse and pheasants and really wish turkeys had never moved into this area.

In a location about 70 miles away, deer and turkeys can be on the same field at the same time. What is the difference, I do not know, except that the deer are totally nocturnal on my farm and the other area is a doe lottery area where deer often are seen in fields during daylight.

As you can see, I have no love for turkeys and would like to get rid of the d.... things.

 

[Bill]

If there are not many turkeys around maybe it's the racket they produce when they do show up that the deer don't like.

Deer are used to them around me. I hate turkeys nearby when I'm hunting. You can't hear yourself think let alone hear a deer.

 

[Reagan]

I have found a deer kill on glare ice that was made by coyotes.

If I am on a deer stand in the woods and I see turkeys, I might just as well pack up and head home as I never see a deer. Most deer hunters in my area feel the same way. I am talking about thick cover and the deer on my place are still very skiddish and almost totally nocturnal. They have been that way for three years.

I have not seen a turkey on my farm for about 8 months and am very happy with that.
I prefer to have grouse and pheasants and really wish turkeys had never moved into this area.

In a location about 70 miles away, deer and turkeys can be on the same field at the same time. What is the difference, I do not know, except that the deer are totally nocturnal on my farm and the other area is a doe lottery area where deer often are seen in fields during daylight.

As you can see, I have no love for turkeys and would like to get rid of the d.... things.

Your deer are nocturnal and the turkeys are not. That may explain why you never see them together.

My dad's property has a lot of turkeys. You see some every time you are on a stand. Deer and turkeys usually ignore each other but if one becomes alert, the other takes notice.

On the flip side, we had a doe and two fawns suspicious of our blind when I was hunting with my daughter. They stayed away and just watched us. When a flock of turkeys started feeding right in front of us, the deer relaxed and walked right in.

My daughter put a bolt through a fawns shoulder right after. She then killed a turkey that still hung around. I think the deer and turkey may have to work out some trust issues after that event.


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[MN Slick]

Doubt this little one made it. More and more I see mature does without fawns during hunting season in Missouri. Back in my Wisconsin days I rarely saw does without fawns but there were no coyotes. Coyotes do a number on fawn recruitment.

 

[chummer]

I see more mature does without fawns then with fawns. We are lucky to have two does with fawns a year. Most years it is one. We see coyotes chasing adult deer all year. I often get plot pics of a running deer and a coyote a few seconds behind it. 11 months out of the year chasing adult deer is probably nothing more than a nuisance, but mid February to mid March they put a big time hurting on the deer. We do have some turkeys wich amazes me. Along with the yotes we also have fox, coons, and fishers. I think the fishers may take more turkeys than the rest combined. They are very active during nesting season.

 

[sandbur]

Nearly every mature doe has twins where I live. I can't remember seeing one without at least one fawn.

 

[Bowsnbucks]

Deer and turkeys get along fine around camp. Deer have the noses and turkeys have the eyes. When together, it's a tough combo to beat. They feed together in our plots pretty regularly. I'm sure it's different in various locations. Deer bolt when yotes are around - same with bears. If a bear comes strolling thru - pack up, no deer coming thru after that.:mad: I think the yotes are harder on fawns than adult deer.

 

[Bill]

Doubt this little one made it. More and more I see mature does without fawns during hunting season in Missouri. Back in my Wisconsin days I rarely saw does without fawns but there were no coyotes. Coyotes do a number on fawn recruitment.

View attachment 8349

That's would piss me off. I know it happens my way. Lots of does with no little ones. Gonna try and find a trustworthy trapper.

 

[sandbur]

That's would piss me off. I know it happens my way. Lots of does with no little ones. Gonna try and find a trustworthy trapper.

Could this high fawn kill be a result of very high deer populations where there is not enough good cover for the fawns from all of the does?

When our deer numbers were higher I found a fawn in a 40 year old pine plantation, where there was absolutely no cover.

 

[Bill]

Could this high fawn kill be a result of very high deer populations where there is not enough good cover for the fawns from all of the does?

When our deer numbers were higher I found a fawn in a 40 year old pine plantation, where there was absolutely no cover.

That could very well be the case. There is not a lot of, what I would call, thick timber in the area.
Overall though, I don't think the deer numbers are super high. They're concentrated at my place now for food but they'll thin out after green up.
Looking at 10 out the kitchen window now. I still have lots of beans hanging on and all 10 are plump as ticks, so they ain't starving.

Our rabbit population exploded during 2014 spring and summer. I think that had a lot to do with high yote numbers also.

 

[sandbur]

Please explain how high yote numbers allowed rabbits to increase?
More yotes means less fox?

I see cycles in our rabbits, coons, ground hogs, chipmonks,squirrels.

 

[Catscratch]

Look up "predator prey relationship" on Google images and it will show plenty of grafts showing a direct correlation between the two. That doesn't necessarily mean that high predator populations "cause" high prey populations, but they have a direct correlation.
When I was trapping a lot you never caught fox where you caught yotes. Presumably the yotes are the dominant of the two canines and won't tolerate fox in their territory. When I wanted to target fox I set close to (or in) town where yotes didn't venture.

 

[sandbur]

And when you have wolves you have few coyotes.
They say there might be more fox in wolf areas since they compete less than coyotes/fox.

 

[Bill]

Please explain how high yote numbers allowed rabbits to increase?
More yotes means less fox?

I see cycles in our rabbits, coons, ground hogs, chipmonks,squirrels.

Just figured an easy food source made it easier for Mom to care for pups.

 

[JackTerp]

we have experienced an invasion of coyotes on our property in SW PA in the past three or four years. we have also seen a marked increase in the turkey population. While I agree with the assumption that the yotes take a fair number of adults and especially new poults, I think they do a service in eliminating a lot of the nest robbing critters. We have a young fella that traps coon and fox every year on our land and he is telling us his harvest numbers are way down the past two years and they don't look very good this year either. He has caught several yotes this year though. Our sightings of bobcat, coons and possums is way down on all our trail and plot cameras. I believe it's a natural cycle. When the food source becomes more scarce, the yotes will move on. Larger hatches on more nests is what we are seeing. Fawn survival is our biggest concern. We saw far fewer twins and more lone does this year than ever before.