Mature buck summer home range issues

[Peplin Creek]

i am wondering if anyone can offer suggestions as to why I can't seem to have summer bucks (mature) use my property, I have 80 acres, in the middle of ag country, deer numbers for me are moderate, 5-10 deer a night in an evening sit sometimes more. I have food plots of clover, oats and brassicas each year. Water isn't and issue because I have a creek that splits the property right in half. Cover is something that is abundant, I would say about 30 acres is mature timber the rest is regenerated growth. Pines, popple, that kind of stuff. It seems like they should have everything they need. Year after year, it's always does and fawns. I have a soft heart so I don't shoot a lot of does especially if they have fawns with them but the neighbors do take a few off each year normally on the property line. During the rut, I have a lot of bucks and honestly it's fantastic to hunt... summer months are disheartening though. I am wondering if anyone can offer advice or thoughts.

 

[John-W-WI]

On my farm the does take over the best ground/food/cover. The bucks won't put up with the social pressure the does bring with them. And the bucks don't put up with people intrusion as well either. So they simply go deeper away from the roads and take what is left. They still visit me, but usually only at night and on the fringes of my farm (I'm basically surrounded by 1000's of acres of mostly wooded farm ground). I've never had a "summer pattern" on a buck in the 10+ years I've owned it.

The best I can do to encourage them to spend more time on my farm is we "lock all of the gates" in August. No more (or very very little) human pressure.

By the time fall comes around, the bucks are all over the place.

Just is what it is for me.

-John

 

[Peplin Creek]

I wonder if a guy could flip his property by taking out a certain percentage of doe. My fear would be taking too many though. I know I have some doe that have to be pushing 6-7 years old. I get the impression they only care to hang out with their fawns and yearlings.

 

[John-W-WI]

I wonder if a guy could flip his property by taking out a certain percentage of doe. My fear would be taking too many though. I know I have some doe that have to be pushing 6-7 years old. I get the impression they only care to hang out with their fawns and yearlings.

I'm not saying it won't work on other farms, but it sure didn't work on mine. We shot the crap out of does for several years. It didn't matter. There was always another "nanny" waiting to take the place of the one we shot.

We still try to take mature does whenever we can (they are worse than big bucks, they know every move we make). But we gave up on reducing doe numbers. It just never worked.

-John

 

[Natty Bumppo]

I'm not being snarky here with my question, but what's the issue? You've got food, cover, and does...and you've described the hunting as fantastic during the rut. What is your concern about not holding bucks during the summer? This is exactly what I have going on on my small 30. I don't have enough land or food to hold both does and bucks during the summer. So, I make it as safe and attractive for does and then during deer season the bucks show up on schedule. I just don't get why it's "disheartening" to not have summer bucks. To me, for small acreage, it sounds like you've got it nailed on your property.

 

[sandbur]

You need to ask where the most remote and thick cover is in the area. What is the biggest rack of cover with little man intrusion where this is feed, water, and plenty of cover without too much pressure from does.

I have seen it for years and the answer is corn. After about mid July, corn provides great cover. Throw in a ditch for water and an adjacent alfalfa or bean patch and you have got it all. I also think buck will use those little secluded patches of cover in acres of ag fields. I might have glimpsed one of those bucks last week. Laying in the bean field and he ran into a tiny patch of cover that can't be easily farmed due to a wetland. Look at areas where farmers lands border one and another, especially if one of the farmers can not access his back corner to farm it. Look at a rock pile, but enter it once and he bolts for the corn.

My two cents.

 

[bbcoach]

Come the end of October, to the middle of November those does you have will reel in the bucks! You have food, water, cover and does so the mature bucks will be there during the rut. Mature bucks only make about 1-2% of the total population so concentrate on having the best food you can to draw and hold the does and you will be successful. One other thing, in Wisconsin by the time of the rut, leaves have fallen, most Ag crops are harvested and devoured so food is the draw. You mentioned brassicas and clover as your main source of food in the fall, oats are probably dead due to the colder temps, have you thought about adding some additional food such as winter wheat or winter rye to get the deer through the winter into the spring. WW or WR will stay green, is a great draw and will feed through the winter when everything else is gone.

 

[Peplin Creek]

I'm not being snarky here with my question, but what's the issue? You've got food, cover, and does...and you've described the hunting as fantastic during the rut. What is your concern about not holding bucks during the summer? This is exactly what I have going on on my small 30. I don't have enough land or food to hold both does and bucks during the summer. So, I make it as safe and attractive for does and then during deer season the bucks show up on schedule. I just don't get why it's "disheartening" to not have summer bucks. To me, for small acreage, it sounds like you've got it nailed on your property.

It's really more of a preference than anything, I know in the back of my mind as along as there are doe, the bucks will show up for rut. It's just month after month pulling cards and never having any "shooters" on camera, seems like it's a sign that I am missing something. it also causes me to never have any history with a buck. Seems like each year, it's just a new set of bucks. On thing that has helped was last year I put a plot in down in the middle of thick cover just so the deer had food/water all inside their bedroom then never stepped foot in the area again. Once my first shooter buck showed up in oct, he took to the property and later was able to harvest him with a rifle sneaky back down to the area mid afternoon. I certainly think this had more to do with location of the plot than anything.

I could just be over analyzing this and should be happy with what I have already but I feel like I could still make improvements.

 

[Peplin Creek]

Come the end of October, to the middle of November those does you have will reel in the bucks! You have food, water, cover and does so the mature bucks will be there during the rut. Mature bucks only make about 1-2% of the total population so concentrate on having the best food you can to draw and hold the does and you will be successful. One other thing, in Wisconsin by the time of the rut, leaves have fallen, most Ag crops are harvested and devoured so food is the draw. You mentioned brassicas and clover as your main source of food in the fall, oats are probably dead due to the colder temps, have you thought about adding some additional food such as winter wheat or winter rye to get the deer through the winter into the spring. WW or WR will stay green, is a great draw and will feed through the winter when everything else is gone.

Yep, wheat and winter rye are added to my oats plots so they stay green. Sure helps later in the year like you said.

 

[bueller]

Maybe you have them and don't know. IMO travel patterns are less obvious during the summer, especially for bucks. I run a lot of cameras on my small acreage. It always amazes me that I can get a good buck on one camera, multiple times, but not on any others within the same general area. Also try moving a camera into a clearing but not food. I don't think velvet bucks like low thick branches messing with their prized rack in the making.

 

[yoderjac]

i am wondering if anyone can offer suggestions as to why I can't seem to have summer bucks (mature) use my property, I have 80 acres, in the middle of ag country, deer numbers for me are moderate, 5-10 deer a night in an evening sit sometimes more. I have food plots of clover, oats and brassicas each year. Water isn't and issue because I have a creek that splits the property right in half. Cover is something that is abundant, I would say about 30 acres is mature timber the rest is regenerated growth. Pines, popple, that kind of stuff. It seems like they should have everything they need. Year after year, it's always does and fawns. I have a soft heart so I don't shoot a lot of does especially if they have fawns with them but the neighbors do take a few off each year normally on the property line. During the rut, I have a lot of bucks and honestly it's fantastic to hunt... summer months are disheartening though. I am wondering if anyone can offer advice or thoughts.

How do you know you don't have summer bucks using your property?

 

[Peplin Creek]

How do you know you don't have summer bucks using your property?

I don't know for 100% certainly. But I am making an educated guess based on trail camera pics over food sources, trails, plus what I noticed for sign, tracks on trails etc. it's possible maybe they're there and I don't know it. Like others have stated. From what i can tell, it seems like does and fawns all over the place.

 

[yoderjac]

A typical home range can vary in size based on habitat and other factors, but 1,000 acres is a good average. So, if you own 80 acres and a mature buck evenly distributed his time across his home range (which they don't), only 8% of his time would be spent on your land. Assuming a 90 day summer he would spend about a week on your place.

I don't know how many trail cameras you are using or what kind, but unless you are using bait in an area that has poor native foods, trail camera data can be quite biased against mature bucks. Young deer acclimate quickly to a camera flash but mature bucks don't. I learned a lot about this when BEC made the transition from red blob to true black flash. I noticed when I was using the red blob cameras I'd get 1 or 2 pictures of a mature buck and then never again. At one point, I was digitally enhancing a picture triggered by a young deer and was then able to one of the same mature bucks that had "left" on the very fringe of the flash range. I started going though old pictures looking for this and found it was common. Mature bucks didn't leave, they just were suspicious of the camera flash and learned where the trigger range was. After that, they kept their distance from the camera and that "safe distance" seems to be just outside flash range. This issue eventually resolved once I transitioned to black flash. Keep in mind that not all trail cameras advertised as invisible flash are truly invisible to deer. There are a combination of factors in visibility, wavelength, intensity, and duration. I would call many of these cameras more as low-emission flash and they don't resolve the flash avoidance issue.

My guess is that your fall observations are also biased in the opposite direction. During the rut when deer throw caution the wind, they are much more observable, both by hunters and trail cameras. So, while it may seem that mature bucks are using your property significantly more in the fall, it may simply be that they are less observable in the summer.

Of course, many deer do adjust home ranges on a seasonal basis as the food sources, cover, and human activity change and it may be that there are somewhat fewer deer using your place in the summer. However, I doubt the difference is as large as it seems.

Thanks,

Jack

 

[Peplin Creek]

A typical home range can vary in size based on habitat and other factors, but 1,000 acres is a good average. So, if you own 80 acres and a mature buck evenly distributed his time across his home range (which they don't), only 8% of his time would be spent on your land. Assuming a 90 day summer he would spend about a week on your place.

I don't know how many trail cameras you are using or what kind, but unless you are using bait in an area that has poor native foods, trail camera data can be quite biased against mature bucks. Young deer acclimate quickly to a camera flash but mature bucks don't. I learned a lot about this when BEC made the transition from red blob to true black flash. I noticed when I was using the red blob cameras I'd get 1 or 2 pictures of a mature buck and then never again. At one point, I was digitally enhancing a picture triggered by a young deer and was then able to one of the same mature bucks that had "left" on the very fringe of the flash range. I started going though old pictures looking for this and found it was common. Mature bucks didn't leave, they just were suspicious of the camera flash and learned where the trigger range was. After that, they kept their distance from the camera and that "safe distance" seems to be just outside flash range. This issue eventually resolved once I transitioned to black flash. Keep in mind that not all trail cameras advertised as invisible flash are truly invisible to deer. There are a combination of factors in visibility, wavelength, intensity, and duration. I would call many of these cameras more as low-emission flash and they don't resolve the flash avoidance issue.

My guess is that your fall observations are also biased in the opposite direction. During the rut when deer throw caution the wind, they are much more observable, both by hunters and trail cameras. So, while it may seem that mature bucks are using your property significantly more in the fall, it may simply be that they are less observable in the summer.

Of course, many deer do adjust home ranges on a seasonal basis as the food sources, cover, and human activity change and it may be that there are somewhat fewer deer using your place in the summer. However, I doubt the difference is as large as it seems.

Thanks,

Jack

I do run anywhere between 10 - 14 trail cameras at a given time. I have been transitioning to black flash cameras because I have noticed the same things as you. This helps with repeat pictures. I think your theory on the fall being a little bit easier to get pictures makes a lot of sense, for one they're out of their bachelor groups so really that probably helps. More deer spread out over the home range. Scrapes are pretty much a big neon sign to get deer in front of a camera.

Appreciate the break down in numbers... makes sense. Thanks

 

[Native Hunter]

On my 100, the does and fawns take the west side, and the bucks take the east side. My main blind is on the main trail between east and west.

You have great hunting during season, so I wouldn't worry about a lack of summer bucks. Honestly, it wouldn't bother me at all. In fact - it might be better. You can do tons of habitat work in the spring and summer and not worry about spooking them away.

Best wishes.

 

[FarmerDan]

I don't how or if this applies to your situation ... or any situation. But, it's really cool! I'm fascinated by how animals move, when, and where!

http://ecosystems.psu.edu/research/projects/deer/news/2015/the-life-and-times-of-buck-8917

http://ecosystems.psu.edu/research/projects/deer/news/2014/those-cunning-bucks

 

[Bill]

I don't how or if this applies to your situation ... or any situation. But, it's really cool! I'm fascinated by how animals move, when, and where!

http://ecosystems.psu.edu/research/projects/deer/news/2015/the-life-and-times-of-buck-8917

http://ecosystems.psu.edu/research/projects/deer/news/2014/those-cunning-bucks

The first one is really cool.

 

[Peplin Creek]

Very cool articles.

 

[Tree Spud]

I do run anywhere between 10 - 14 trail cameras at a given time. I have been transitioning to black flash cameras because I have noticed the same things as you. This helps with repeat pictures. I think your theory on the fall being a little bit easier to get pictures makes a lot of sense, for one they're out of their bachelor groups so really that probably helps. More deer spread out over the home range. Scrapes are pretty much a big neon sign to get deer in front of a camera.

Appreciate the break down in numbers... makes sense. Thanks

That is 1 camera for every 5.7 acres ... if it took you 15 minutes between checking & resetting each camera, that is 3.5 hours on your property. That is an incredible amount of pressure and intrusion.

A mature buck could be spooked by 1, most certainly 2, cameras for every 40-60 acres. I can understand why at your camera concentration you are seeing almost no bucks.

If you want bucks on your property, spend less time on your property. Does will tolerate a fair amount of pressure, even 1.5 - 2.5 year olds are still dumb enough that they value the social group and stick around.

A mature buck, 3.5 - 4.5 years or older, is a completely different social animal. The older they get, the less tolerant they are of any contact with other deer or humans. They have learned to survive by avoiding every idiot with a bow or gun, cars on roads, fighting with younger bucks avoiding injury and exertion, and all the other risks out there. An older buck will get lazy and find an area that they get everything they need. Their home range will shrink to the smallest area that fills their needs. The most disruptive influence on this comfort/safe zone is human pressure. The old saying if you bump an old buck once, he might come back. bump him twice, he is gone is very true.

keep in mind you may never hold a mature buck on your property. But the critical phase is the start of the rut. When the stupid period starts, you could set your property up to intercept the boys who are looking for the girls.

If you want a mature buck to visit and feel comfortable on your property, forget what your property looks like from late May till early October. 80 acres is small relative to a potential home range. Find a travel corridor between connecting food sources or bedding, and set-up to intercept. Do all your work before May and leave it alone.

I can guarantee one thing, the more you check your cameras, the fewer bucks you will see. Sure you may see the small young ones, but the older ones will make whatever adjustment to move, based on the pressure they experience.

 

[BuckSutherland]

On my farm the does take over the best ground/food/cover. The bucks won't put up with the social pressure the does bring with them. And the bucks don't put up with people intrusion as well either. So they simply go deeper away from the roads and take what is left. They still visit me, but usually only at night and on the fringes of my farm (I'm basically surrounded by 1000's of acres of mostly wooded farm ground). I've never had a "summer pattern" on a buck in the 10+ years I've owned it.

The best I can do to encourage them to spend more time on my farm is we "lock all of the gates" in August. No more (or very very little) human pressure.

By the time fall comes around, the bucks are all over the place.

Just is what it is for me.

-John

I would agree with this 100%. Since we started doing habitat work on our land up north all the nice bucks we used to get on camera left. Now we are just left with a bunch of mean nasty does that chase away all competition, but come rut time the bucks move back in. Been about 4 years since we had a good summer buck on camera.