Hungry deer

[ruskbucks]

Here in central Minnesota a few years back the DNR was asking for people to put out feed that the DNR provided to the land owners to help the deer get through the bad winter. Lots of things to consider and sometimes mistakes are made even though the intentions are good. Hay that killed off 6 deer was probably the exact WRONG kind of hay to be feeding if I had to guess. Obviously it wasn't the right kind that was beneficial.

hmmm, not what I see. Must of really flipped there stance.

https://www.dnr.state.mn.us/wildlife/research/health/feeding/deer.html

 

[jsasker007]

I doubt they flipped anything. Like everything else that exists the government will tell you one thing while they do another. I know it was taking place because I was getting almost daily updates from my one buddy who was feeding deer on his 800 acres as per the DNR. My buddy said that he wanted to stop doing it because it turned into a hell of a lot of work but the DNR told him "you can't stop now". He said he would never do it again. They had pictures of over a hundred deer at one time feeding on the PURINA deer pellets.

 

[Bowsnbucks]

Do you really consider putting out a automatic deer feeder as a habitat improvement?

NO. ----- I don't put out automatic feeders. Here in Pa. (after the deer seasons) - if we get a really bad winter, deep snow, and especially with a thick, hard crust on the snow - we put out shelled corn to help the deer get through. We've never found dead deer later from it. We DO plant things for browse - but until it grows to a certain point / size to be useful, we aren't going to let the deer starve if we get a winter like I described.

Unless you own the land, you can't just go onto someone else's property and start planting things. You can't on state land here either, despite having good intentions & even good scientific backing. So just saying plant better habitat (though it's a smart, sound idea), it isn't always possible. In the meantime, we want to keep our deer from dying in a bad winter. Thankfully - we don't have too many bad winters here. Right now it's about 54 degrees here, and no snow cover at all. Natural goodies are available.

 

[H20fwler]

This is like discussing politics. I guess I just see it totally different than you. If you believe feeding works out so great in Ohio why wouldn't you suggest that other members on here to go and buy corn feeders? Your own state of Ohio's own stance on feeding wildlife is that they discourage it! Although not illegal like your neighbor Illinois.( for good reasons)They discourage it! WHY? BECAUSE IT IS NOT GOOD FOR THE WILDLIFE. Please find me a state dnr that encourages feeding deer with corn feeders. The way I see it, you won't find one that does. The reason, the experts/ biologist know its not good and should be discouraged. There is a reason it is banned in so many states. You can add the spread of disease to this debate also why feeding is discouraged. All I had to do is read the title of the story you posted. " Wildlife refuge tries to wean feeding elk". Don't you read that headline and ask WHY do they want to stop/ wean the feeding there. The way I read it, because it is not good! They admit they messed up feeding these elk and basically making them pets and a tourist trap. What was meant to "help" them could easily be their downfall. Reading about the majestic rocky mountain elk chasing down a farmer on his tractor because they think he has feed for them is downright pathetic to me. We need to stop trying to make wild animals pets by being their friends and feeding them. It is causing far more damage to them then good. You ever go to Yellowstone and see the signs that say it is illegal to feed the animals there? They state that besides the danger it will encourage them to become dependent on humans and they wont find food naturally like a wild animal should do. It doesn't matter if you are in Yellowstone, Wisconsin, oe even Ohio feeding is discouraged. The refuge wants these elk to find different wintering grounds and not depend on humans altering their natural migration. Which is the reason why the debacle started in the first place. Now they are in so deep by feeding they don't know if they can even get it back to the way it should be.

It must be awesome to be you!

I’m heading out to my garbage dump to kill some deer by feeding them shelled corn that they eat every day.

 

[ruskbucks]

I doubt they flipped anything. Like everything else that exists the government will tell you one thing while they do another. I know it was taking place because I was getting almost daily updates from my one buddy who was feeding deer on his 800 acres as per the DNR. My buddy said that he wanted to stop doing it because it turned into a hell of a lot of work but the DNR told him "you can't stop now". He said he would never do it again. They had pictures of over a hundred deer at one time feeding on the PURINA deer pellets.
. I'm not doubting you. That is just messed up they would do that . On their website they are very stern on not to deed deer, then list 7 reasons why not to feed deer. Don't see a single thing about them promoting feeding them

It must be awesome to be you!

I’m heading out to my garbage dump to kill some deer by feeding them shelled corn that they eat every day.

It's not bad. I'm glad I'm not arrogant enough to think i know better than my own states biologist, wardens , and dnr that tells everyone that feeding is not recommended. Maybe my friends, family, and I are spoiled up here that we don't have to resort to having corn feeders to have healthy, great looking deer to hunt. I didn't think it was that tuff to hunt in Ohio. Carry on your great feeding program at your dump. I hope you can get your pet deer patterned to your feeder and you get that 160. Maybe if switch to high protein Purina pellets instead of 9 percent protein corn.That has to be way better for them.Those booners will be flooding into that big boss feeder. Have you thought what your deer are going to do when Ohio catches up and bans feeding there also. Any good high fence game farms that have feeders set up to hunt to some ag deer?They will probably be able to get around the ban.

 

[ruskbucks]

I doubt they flipped anything. Like everything else that exists the government will tell you one thing while they do another. I know it was taking place because I was getting almost daily updates from my one buddy who was feeding deer on his 800 acres as per the DNR. My buddy said that he wanted to stop doing it because it turned into a hell of a lot of work but the DNR told him "you can't stop now". He said he would never do it again. They had pictures of over a hundred deer at one time feeding on the PURINA deer pellets.

I believe you, must of been a unique situation. They probably think if they can monitor it, they can do it in a safer manner than the average citizen. That's funny that on that link they are very stern on DO NOT FEED DEER and then list seven reasons not to. Only about half the state has a feeding ban also. Most likely trying to slow cwd. I saw the ban is mostly middle of state south to north. I wasn't aware cwd was that widespread in MN if that is the reason.

 

[jsasker007]

DNR was and I think still is discussing making food plots illegal here. Really hope that doesn't happen.

 

[Mortenson]

DNR was and I think still is discussing making food plots illegal here. Really hope that doesn't happen.

It's just cover crops. I thought govt and climate crowds are promoting green ag. Might wanna get some apple trees planted just in case! Of course I'm sure an orchard can mysteriously wind up dead too.

 

[Troubles Trees]

It's just cover crops. I thought govt and climate crowds are promoting green ag. Might wanna get some apple trees planted just in case! Of course I'm sure an orchard can mysteriously wind up dead too.

Your comments always put a smile on my face Mort!

 

[Brian662]

It's just cover crops. I thought govt and climate crowds are promoting green ag. Might wanna get some apple trees planted just in case! Of course I'm sure an orchard can mysteriously wind up dead too.

If MN does outlaw food plots, that would be my strategy...fenced beans with a brassica cover crop that I wasn't able to get into for the harvest.

 

[PatinPA]

I used to put out mineral blocks only. Before I was in a CWD area anyway. I figured that the minerals would help the buck recover and the does be healthy for fawning. I used to feed corn too but not that much. I built a big tripod feeder with a timer and could only use it for one year before the damn raccoons chewed it apart. Then we ended up being in a CWD area anyway so it was illegal to do.

 

[Maddog66]

This year, I’m benefiting from the misfortune of the farmer who rents my tillable 30 acres in Zone 3a.

This past year it was corn and for our area it was nice…..maybe 125 bu / acre…..but we got BIG snow before it was even close to dry enough to pick. When he finally got around to trying, his combine was sliding sideways on my hillsides so bad he was wiping out everything. So he stopped. Tons of waste grain leftover.

Then we got even more snow and he tried again. This time he got everything picked but about 5 acres in my hidden field. He’s leaving it until spring now.

Last winter on my land(without standing corn), I walked the entire thing in 3.5’ of snow and saw zero deer tracks. This winter, with corn and the same amount of snow, every deer and Turkey in the area has my place beat down like concrete on the runways.

Every few years I get reminded that in the North Country, corn is and always will be king.

If you can leave enough corn standing to last the winter, lactic acidosis isn’t an issue, is it?

 

[ruskbucks]

This year, I’m benefiting from the misfortune of the farmer who rents my tillable 30 acres in Zone 3a.

This past year it was corn and for our area it was nice…..maybe 125 bu / acre…..but we got BIG snow before it was even close to dry enough to pick. When he finally got around to trying, his combine was sliding sideways on my hillsides so bad he was wiping out everything. So he stopped. Tons of waste grain leftover.

Then we got even more snow and he tried again. This time he got everything picked but about 5 acres in my hidden field. He’s leaving it until spring now.

Last winter on my land(without standing corn), I walked the entire thing in 3.5’ of snow and saw zero deer tracks. This winter, with corn and the same amount of snow, every deer and Turkey in the area has my place beat down like concrete on the runways.

Every few years I get reminded that in the North Country, corn is and always will be king.

If you can leave enough corn standing to last the winter, lactic acidosis isn’t an issue, is it?

It won't be a problem. The deer have been eating eating corn occasionally along with other browse most likely since fall.The problem comes into play when they have been eating browse exclusively and are exposed to a large amount corn all of a sudden. It is a shock to their system they usually can't handle. With you having a field of corn is far better than a large pile or something like a gravity wagon feeder full of corn. The deer won't gorge themselves. They will have to walk around and find cobbs/ loose kernels and most likely go back to eat a mix of browse back in the woods.

 

[Jerry-B-WI]

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Deer Digest - Mission Impossible: Winter Survival​ The whitetail deer is a formidable opponent against the grueling elements of mother nature. Despite bundling up from head to toe, our hands, feet and eventually body still succumb to the cold. So, how do deer survive the harsh winter season? Physiology Deer have learned to pack on the pounds prior to snow fall to ensure they have as much fat as possible. This fat provides both energy and insulation for deer and is especially important as they can lose 20-30 percent of their body weight during the winter months. To account for this, they undergo several physiological changes. First, the lessening daylight signals the thyroid gland to slow down. This slows their metabolism and triggers a shift in their diet and behavior. During winter, deer consume less, and different, food and reduce movements. In fact, some research shows that deer only consume around 70 percent of their normal daily amount during winter and change their diets from predominately lush green vegetation to woody browse. To help maintain their energy levels, they've also been known to cut their activity and movements in half by sleeping more. James Bond’s Jacket A whitetail maintains a 104-degree Fahrenheit internal temperature year-round. While they sport a lighter coat all summer, deer transition to a thicker, more insulated coat in winter. Their winter coat has 2 types of hairs: hollow guard hairs and wool-like inner hairs. The wool-like inner hairs are dense at 5,000 hairs per square inch and serve as insulation, while the guard hairs trap air and provide waterproofing through specialized sebaceous glands. These specialized glands are why you see deer with snow on their coats. What does this mean for habitat management? As mentioned earlier, deer reduce their movements and food intake in the winter. In turn, they often have to consider the trade-offs between maintaining their energy reserves and obtaining high-quality forage. When thinking about creating the best winter habitat for deer, think with your chainsaw. Remember, the closer you can have food and known bedding areas, the better! Let us know if you get out and try this tactic for yourself, and remember to hang a trail camera nearby to monitor your success! This might give some insight why the deer are acting the way they are and how to help them out. Looks like you're doing the right thing with cutting trees and letting them eat the tops.

 

[jsasker007]

I guess where I live we really don't have too many deer for the capacity of the land. I have never seen browse lines from the deer eating everything as high as they can reach. Plenty of brush everywhere around me. How many deer per square mile does it take to wipe out available/reachable food sources in wooded areas? Deep snow and ice covering food is probably the biggest problem "my" deer have during the winter months.

 

[Maddog66]

I’m not sure that number is knowable in areas with deep, long winters. If there is food they can get to available, I think wildlife numbers increase until the food is exhausted or spring comes. Right now on mine with standing corn, that’s what seems to be happening. I think the turkeys are getting more than the deer right now.

I went into winter with 4 acres of nice brassicas still standing. Thousands of big turnips. Then we got 20” of snow, with more showing up every few days for weeks, coupled with bitter cold. The deer haven’t touch any of that buried food since late December. The only tracks in it at all are the concrete-like runways heading for the corn.

One other data point. I’ve hunted for years in NW Ontario where the deer population is said to be about 5 deer per square mile. Even there, if you look, you can see a browse line in the regenerating aspens and low hanging Cedar.

 

[jsasker007]

I’m not sure that number is knowable in areas with deep, long winters. If there is food they can get to available, I think wildlife numbers increase until the food is exhausted or spring comes. Right now on mine with standing corn, that’s what seems to be happening. I think the turkeys are getting more than the deer right now.

I went into winter with 4 acres of nice brassicas still standing. Thousands of big turnips. Then we got 20” of snow, with more showing up every few days for weeks, coupled with bitter cold. The deer haven’t touch any of that buried food since late December. The only tracks in it at all are the concrete-like runways heading for the corn.

One other data point. I’ve hunted for years in NW Ontario where the deer population is said to be about 5 deer per square mile. Even there, if you look, you can see a browse line in the regenerating aspens and low hanging Cedar.

The deer here must be getting plenty somewhere. Odd. Still seeing deer almost daily so don't think they've all herded up for winter somewhere else---weird.

 

[homerj]

Almost every lake with any amount of unbuilt woods left I've ever been on in the upper midwest has a browse line

 

[Ruffdude]

The best way to feed Winter deer is develop a rotational timber harvest plan.
Keeping early succesional forests on the landscape will provide deer with all they need nutritionally to survive. We try to cut 2% of our aspen/birch forest types annually. This puts us in a 50 year rotation. If you want healthy deer in your area lobby your county/region/state to harvest more timber.

 

[ruskbucks]

The best way to feed Winter deer is develop a rotational timber harvest plan.
Keeping early succesional forests on the landscape will provide deer with all they need nutritionally to survive. We try to cut 2% of our aspen/birch forest types annually. This puts us in a 50 year rotation. If you want healthy deer in your area lobby your county/region/state to harvest more timber.

That's awesome. I read in some articles where they said aspen leaves can make up to 70 percent of a whitetails summer diet. So your mostly likely feed them all year long with that rotation. I wish I had enough aspen to do this. Every area that had aspen my forester marked it to be clear cut. They grew back so thick.These turned out phenomenal. I see some browsing on the aspen but they seem to really prefer the red maple.