Graft below ground level?

[TWalter91]

Received my apple/crabs from bluehill today. Took a quick look at his planting instructions and noticed on the last paragraph he said to plant the tree so the graft is at or below ground level. Every apple tree I have planted in the past I had it so that the graft is a couple of inches above the ground. But that was with m111/b118 rootstock.

Is it different with dolgo rootstock? Would the tree be just as good if I planted it couple of inches above? Thanks!

 

[Native Hunter]

When he says "just below" I think he means an inch or two. At that depth there would not be enough dirt for natural roots to form above the graft. In my opinion, a two or three inch range above or below groundline doesn't matter for his trees.

If you plant MM111 too shallow, you will get bur knots above ground. I like to put those an inch or two below grade. I’ve done this with a bunch of trees and it works fine.

B118 trees in my area are notorious for blowing over in a storm. I would never plant another one, but if I did, I would put the graft at least 12 inches below grade - hoping that it would form natural roots or die. Either outcome would be better than what I've seen with B118.

Bottom line - Ryan knows what he is talking about. I would always do what he suggests.

 

[TWalter91]

Thanks @Native Hunter . Just started to dabble more into fruit trees last year. Hopefully my trees from Wtc's do good in the future on my ground. Definitely will follow ryans advice! Was just curious to hear other peoples opinions.

 

[Native Hunter]

Thanks @Native Hunter . Just started to dabble more into fruit trees last year. Hopefully my trees from Wtc's do good in the future on my ground. Definitely will follow ryans advice! Was just curious to hear other peoples opinions.

Good luck with your trees.

 

[Teeder]

I did what Ryan said and my trees look great!

 

[Pine Lake]

I decided to make an account to support the sentiment regarding planting graft unions below soil line when dealing with full sized rootstock or cold zones.

This is exactly how it works for many varieties planted in cold Canadian locations Z2, Z3.

Dr. Ieuan Evans outlines the practice, and proof of concept. He has performed this for decades on hundreds of fruit trees.

Books such as Growing Fruit in Northern Gardens also outline this practice for stone fruits. In the plum section, Dr. Bob Bors references this.

Many times rootstock usage in Canada is because it is the fastest way to get a growing tree set in a nursery, and in some cases can result in earlier fruit set.

It is absolutely true that in warmer areas, or those that are using root stock for a specific genetic reason (dwarfing, resistance, etc) you would risk nulling the effect by burying the rootstock, as the scion could root and take over - resulting in a loss of desireable traits. However, this is generally not the goal with wildlife/habitat plantings. There can also be concerns if you are trying to plant a more mature tree with the graft below soil level, as it is less likely to root from the scion at an older age.

 

[H20fwler]

I decided to make an account to support the sentiment regarding planting graft unions below soil line when dealing with full sized rootstock or cold zones.

This is exactly how it works for many varieties planted in cold Canadian locations Z2, Z3.

Dr. Ieuan Evans outlines the practice, and proof of concept. He has performed this for decades on hundreds of fruit trees.

Books such as Growing Fruit in Northern Gardens also outline this practice for stone fruits. In the plum section, Dr. Bob Bors references this.

Many times rootstock usage in Canada is because it is the fastest way to get a growing tree set in a nursery, and in some cases can result in earlier fruit set.

It is absolutely true that in warmer areas, or those that are using root stock for a specific genetic reason (dwarfing, resistance, etc) you would risk nulling the effect by burying the rootstock, as the scion could root and take over - resulting in a loss of desireable traits. However, this is generally not the goal with wildlife/habitat plantings. There can also be concerns if you are trying to plant a more mature tree with the graft below soil level, as it is less likely to root from the scion at an older age.

Interesting concept on that, sounds good.
Welcome to the forum.

Where are you located? What zone.

 

[Pine Lake]

Interesting concept on that, sounds good.
Welcome to the forum.

Where are you located? What zone.

Zone 3a, Manitoba

 

[bigboreblr]

I have read that too in cold areas. some warm not to have the union more than 2 or 3 inches above ground.

I'm new to planting trees in zone 3, but all of mine survived -38 deg F with the graft union above ground like most do. That cold snap did not have much snow on the ground either, like 4 inches or so.

Dolgo, antonovka, and B118 are considered particuarly cold hardy.

Pine lake, any rootstocks you prefer to use in what kind of soil? Any specific experience with novamac or novaezgro? University of Minnesota offerings, or any trees from saint lawrence nursery.

An interesting thing I noticed this year. I was digging up 2 or 3 trees mid march or so. Ground at zone 5/6 home was thawed out. The top 2-3 inches under about 1.5 inches of wood mulch was still frozen. Area is in the wide open. Hopefully I didn't damage those trees too bad.

 

[Pine Lake]

My apples are either on siberian crab or ranetka rootstock. I have a few planted with grafts above the soil line that did fine, however they had about 3ft of snow cover to insulate them.

I haven't tried either of those apples as of yet. I have a rosybloom gladiator, red wonder, prairie sensation, trailman, and lee 17 in the ground. A sweet sixteen and M360 on the way, alongside 50-60 other fruiting trees and shrubs for this spring. These apples will be planted with the graft below soil line (especially the sweet sixteen, as I may be pushing my luck on hardiness).

I haven't dealt with those nursery locations specifically, as I am in Canada, but I assume there is similar availability on a number of varieties. I have definitely seen a number of Minnesota origin apples offered at the nurseries I use.

Generally I stick to Canadian origin apples, as I am always concerned about hardiness. The sweet sixteen might be my only non-Canadian origin apple.