Farm Welding

[yoderjac]

I've often thought that welding would be a good capability to have around the farm but I knew nothing about it. Years ago, I had a friend who said he would teach me. I ended up buying a cheap harbor freight Dual Mig 151 years ago. My friend moved away so it has just been sitting in the barn. I think it is a 230 volt unit and I haven't even set up a circuit for it. I'm sure like all Harbor Freight stuff, you get what you pay for. I think this thing was around or maybe under $200 back when I bought it. I think it can handle MIG and Flux Core. It has a gas port on the rear but I don't have gas or a regulator.

Well, last week I went to visit relatives for a week and my nephew graciously offered to teach me to weld. They have a Miller 211 with autofeed. He had me making reasonably good welds on 1/8" mild steel tubing and angle iron in no time with it. I think I know have a grasp of the general concepts; at least with MIG welding.

My plan is to play with the HF Dual MIG 151 over the next year. My guess is that I'll probably need to develop some welding skill to overcome the limitations of this welder so it may be a good one to learn on.

My nephew is a hobby welder that makes home projects. The one he was working on this week was a stainless steel bed. So, his welding is generally small welds that need to be sound but look good. I'm guessing the welding I do on the farm will have as great or greater structural requirement but not much in the way of aesthetic requirements. I'll probably be working with thicker steel and probably dirtier. I'm not sure if Flux Core or stick welding would be a better fit for me in the long run.

I probably won't be in the market for close to a year, so I'm just collecting information. I'd appreciate thoughts on what kind of welding would be best suited for the farm (Building racks, repairing equipment, modifying equipment, etc.)? Would I be better off with a multi-process welder like a Miller 215 or something similar? I'm sure in some ways welder brands are like Chevy, Ford, Dodge, etc. so if there is a particular brand/model you like be sure to tell me why you like it.

None of this will be for production work so as far as duty cycle goes, I just need enough to complete longer individual welds. I can let things cool down between welds if necessary.

Thanks,

Jack

 

[TreeDaddy]

Couldn't help but chuckle re:reference to harbor freight

Their tools are like Bic razors:disposable after one use

bill

 

[Rlsbowhunt]

We have both stick and a small miller mig.
For strength, dirty metal and most equipment repairs we use the stick.
For clean smaller projects the mig.

Get a Lincoln (tombstone) box. You can get them in AC or AC/DC. AC should be fine for what your doing and fairly cheap. 6011 and 7014 rods cover most things that need welded.

 

[Catscratch]

The HF will weld like crap compared to the Millermatic, but it will get the job done.
Flux core will be uglier than mig. But flux is a lot more handy outside of the shop, where winds can play hell with the shielding gas.
Like said above, stick can work great on dirty stuff where all you really need is to get it stuck together. With that said; I know some guys who can weld a pretty bead with stick... I'm just not one of them.

 

[John-W-WI]

I bought a Miller 215 this spring and LOVE it. (https://www.millerwelds.com/equipment/welders/multiprocess/multimatic-215-multiprocess-welder-m30090)

I was going to buy a 211 until I realized for a few more bucks I got a lot more machine.

You select the wire diameter you are using, the metal thickness you are welding, and it does the rest. You can tweak the settings if you want but I haven't had to do much tweaking.

I used to weld quite a bit, but hadn't for almost 20 years. I got right back to it in no time. I had a welding friend (CWI) stop by and make sure I was on the right track and have been playing ever since.

The HF welder is probably going to need a new liner, tip, and wire. I'm afraid you might struggle getting it going well. I hope not, but it might be tough.

 

[Jim Timber]

That looks like a sweet little rig, John.

I got a Hobart Handler 140 for use out in the woods, and it makes a nice bead with flux core, but my God is it slooooow compared to my industrial welder. I actually just bought a non-functioning Generac 15Kw generator yesterday (I'll either get it working or I have a 18Kw alternator that I can use the engine with) so I can run my big welder up North before we get power brought in. I could do the work with my little Hobart, but I'd rather run my big Miller.

 

[yoderjac]

Thanks for all the input! Good to know you have a 215 John. I'll check in with you t see how that is doing before I buy. Last year the rebate on the 215 was twice that on the 211 making them closer in price. Not sure where that will be when I buy. The comments above about stick and dirt are making me lean toward it (or equivalent) over the 211 mig/flux only.

You guys are certain right about Harbor Freight. I generally don't buy tools from them that I expect to use regularly. They are great for something I need for one-off project. Just like the Chinese trail cams, real poor QC. It is funny, every now and then I'll get an HF tool that lasts as long or longer than then name brands. The problem is that it is a crap shoot. It is not uncommon to return a tool right out of the box. I do kind of consider them disposable.

As for the HF welder, I'm just hoping it is functional and holds up long enough to give me some practice before I buy a real one.

Thanks,

Jack

 

[Jim Timber]

HF has some stuff that's above their reputation - like their Predator gas engines. They're exact Honda clones, so the engineering is good and they seem to have at least decent manufacturers making them. Their tool cabinets are actually nicer than Craftsman's and cheaper too.

There's a lot that's not worth bringing home as well. Just gotta do your research online before you get too excited or spend more than you're comfortable losing.

 

[BC Buck]

These guys are giving some good advice. My Lincoln 150 amp stick welder runs off gas. Nice for remote work but to heavy. Bought the 211 and can run off two 2000 watt Honda generators. Easily carried any ware needed.

 

[bueller]

Am I the only one who finds it amusing that the guy who questions Cuddeback and countless others on the quality of their products and prides himself on data and research purchases a welder from Harbor Freight?

 

[swat1018]

Am I the only one who finds it amusing that the guy who questions Cuddeback and countless others on the quality of their products and prides himself on data and research purchases a welder from Harbor Freight?

He probably wasn't planning on using it in his deer research...

 

[Catscratch]

Am I the only one who finds it amusing that the guy who questions Cuddeback and countless others on the quality of their products and prides himself on data and research purchases a welder from Harbor Freight?

Lol. You're not the only one, I had the same thought.

Sent from my SM-N910V using Tapatalk

 

[yoderjac]

Am I the only one who finds it amusing that the guy who questions Cuddeback and countless others on the quality of their products and prides himself on data and research purchases a welder from Harbor Freight?

Bueller,

If you look at the total context of my trail camera posts, you will see that I'm just calling 'em as I sees 'em. The key is matching the product with the application. While the best fit for my current camera application is the higher end camera, I've often recommend to others that low-end cameras are a better fit for their applications. Reliability, fast trigger, and capture assurance with low false alarm rate are not important in many application of cameras.

Inexpensive low quality products are not "bad" products. They may be a great fit for some applications. The HF welder is a good example. It was the perfect fit for me at the time, but it isn't any more. The reason that it was the perfect fit at the time is because the guy who was original going to teach me how to weld was familiar with it. His view was that it has significant limitations and it takes more welding skill to overcome those limitations. Basically, if you can weld with this, you can weld with anything... It was purchased as a cheap learning welder, not because I even thought at the time it would be a good long-term fit.

Well, it didn't work out in that the guy who was going to teach me moved before he could. So, it has just been sitting in the barn. I think it will still serve a purpose. It will give me something to play with while I am doing research to find out what the best fit for me is. The welding lessons I had last week and this thread are the first steps in that process. As I said in the original post, I probably won't be in the market for a year.

I understand how you and others think I'm criticizing a company when I say they are selling a lower quality product or has poor quality control, but I'm not. I'm just providing my opinion based on my experience with the product or product line. Whether quality in a particular area is important in a particular application or not and whether any cost differential is important is up to the end user. A good example is the BEC cameras I have. They have very poor quality pictures compared to the low end Chinese produced cameras. Even those of similar vintage. Why? The use older technology that is well proven in reliability. Moore's law moves so fast that by the time you've done enough testing on a complex system to have confidence in its reliability at least one new generation of technology is available and maybe two. I was trading off picture quality for reliability.

You will never hear me say to someone they are stupid for buying product XYZ. What you will see is me saying something like: XYZ has these shortcomings...you have to decide how much they matter in your application.

Thanks,

Jack

 

[Tree Spud]

Am I the only one who finds it amusing that the guy who questions Cuddeback and countless others on the quality of their products and prides himself on data and research purchases a welder from Harbor Freight?

Cuddeback ... are they still business?

 

[UFi911]

My example of Harbor Freight tools is when you have the last tile on the floor you are installing break and your friend with the tile saw just left. Go to HF and buy a saw. If it lasts more than that one tile it's a bonus. They are so cheap it kind of doesn't matter.

Actually some of their stuff with lots of weight (think breaker bars, etc.) are a pretty good value.

Like JT said; some of their stuff is great some isn't.

 

[bueller]

Bueller,

If you look at the total context of my trail camera posts, you will see that I'm just calling 'em as I sees 'em. The key is matching the product with the application. While the best fit for my current camera application is the higher end camera, I've often recommend to others that low-end cameras are a better fit for their applications. Reliability, fast trigger, and capture assurance with low false alarm rate are not important in many application of cameras.

Inexpensive low quality products are not "bad" products. They may be a great fit for some applications. The HF welder is a good example. It was the perfect fit for me at the time, but it isn't any more. The reason that it was the perfect fit at the time is because the guy who was original going to teach me how to weld was familiar with it. His view was that it has significant limitations and it takes more welding skill to overcome those limitations. Basically, if you can weld with this, you can weld with anything... It was purchased as a cheap learning welder, not because I even thought at the time it would be a good long-term fit.

Well, it didn't work out in that the guy who was going to teach me moved before he could. So, it has just been sitting in the barn. I think it will still serve a purpose. It will give me something to play with while I am doing research to find out what the best fit for me is. The welding lessons I had last week and this thread are the first steps in that process. As I said in the original post, I probably won't be in the market for a year.

I understand how you and others think I'm criticizing a company when I say they are selling a lower quality product or has poor quality control, but I'm not. I'm just providing my opinion based on my experience with the product or product line. Whether quality in a particular area is important in a particular application or not and whether any cost differential is important is up to the end user. A good example is the BEC cameras I have. They have very poor quality pictures compared to the low end Chinese produced cameras. Even those of similar vintage. Why? The use older technology that is well proven in reliability. Moore's law moves so fast that by the time you've done enough testing on a complex system to have confidence in its reliability at least one new generation of technology is available and maybe two. I was trading off picture quality for reliability.

You will never hear me say to someone they are stupid for buying product XYZ. What you will see is me saying something like: XYZ has these shortcomings...you have to decide how much they matter in your application.

Thanks,

Jack

Hey we all need to laugh at ourselves and each other from time to time .

 

[Bill]

HF has some stuff that's above their reputation - like their Predator gas engines. They're exact Honda clones, so the engineering is good and they seem to have at least decent manufacturers making them. Their tool cabinets are actually nicer than Craftsman's and cheaper too.

There's a lot that's not worth bringing home as well. Just gotta do your research online before you get too excited or spend more than you're comfortable losing.

I have a shop full of HF stuff, some is junk but when it breaks a new one is cheap. Some is good stuff. I'm running a 60 gal 5 hp air compressor for over 10 years now. Sanders, glass beader and lots of air tools later and it's still running.
The new Hercules 20V cordless drill is only 6 weeks old but I'm impressed. Seems just as good as my dewalt.

Like you said read the reviews and read between the lines, some people are clueless and post reviews.

 

[Jim Timber]

I'm running a 60 gal 5 hp air compressor for over 10 years now. Sanders, glass beader and lots of air tools later and it's still running.

That's cute. My IR T30 was made in 1984. Came out of industrial service in 2007 when I bought it at auction for $300.

Maybe I should change the oil?

 

[yoderjac]

Hey we all need to laugh at ourselves and each other from time to time .

No sweat! I got it. But there were folks on the Cuddeback thread that took some of my comments thinking I was negative on Cuddeback. On the contrary, they have done well to stay in business in a very challenging market place with some competition from the Chinese that is probably unfair.

Like most folks I buy products at the high end, low end, and middle of the market. Even though I try to do plenty of up front research, I often get it wrong. There are a few areas where I may have some specific competence, but I rely a lot on others like those kindly sharing their experience on this thread with welders and welding.

Thanks,

Jack

 

[Bill]

Maybe I should change the oil?

Na it would probably run with no oil. I don't need anything that big for weekend warrior work.