Crimping Vs Mowning

[Rakman]

What is the reason folks are crimping a fall cover crop come spring vs mowing then no tilling thru either? Is there more soil benefit to a decaying crop that has been crimped vs mowed?

 

[yoderjac]

No more soil benefit. Crimping is typically used as a way to terminate an annual cover crop like Winter Rye. When the stem is crimped, the plant dies and lays down to form a mulch. No gly is needed for prep. This presumes the WR crop is thick enough to shade out most weeds. This is often done when a no-till drill is used to plant RR corn and beans. Any weeds that compete will be killed by the gly when the first spraying is done after the beans emerge. Farmers save on chemicals this way.

Mowing is done when there are a mix of cover crops that are not terminated by crimping. For example if you include crimson clover as part of a fall mix, it will often germinate before you terminate and crimping does not kill it. So, the clover would compete with the beans until they were sprayed. Here gly is needed anyway for prep. You can still roll the cover crop mix to make it easier to drill beans/corn or you can use throw and mow for other types of crops.

Thanks,

Jack

 

[Big Snow Man]

I have watched Grant Woods do his crimping and I must say I’m very interested in the system. I just wish there were several crimpers available for a UTV.

 

[chucker66]

I just use a yard roller with my ATV for the rye. It kills it plus I get some "free" seed. Then I usually plant my fall crop like brassicas and then plant more rye in late August or early September so it can grow and give me some early green in the spring. Let it grow and rinse and repeat.

Chuck

 

[j-bird]

Keep in mind an "advantage" ....especially on a small scale....can be very hard to quantify! This concept and the like is simply another adaptation from production farming, where advantages are measured in dollars and cents....and may or may not translate thru scope/scale of plotters. It's nice advertising for pushing a product.... I'm sure those things are not cheap....and I can buy a gallon of gly pretty cheap these days!

 

[Big Snow Man]

I here where your coming from but I’m in a area that is a huge sand pile with a little topsoil. Having some mulch on top of the soil is a great benefit in my area.

 

[yoderjac]

Keep in mind an "advantage" ....especially on a small scale....can be very hard to quantify! This concept and the like is simply another adaptation from production farming, where advantages are measured in dollars and cents....and may or may not translate thru scope/scale of plotters. It's nice advertising for pushing a product.... I'm sure those things are not cheap....and I can buy a gallon of gly pretty cheap these days!

Good point. I don't have a crimper because of the cost. Keep in mind that direct cost is not the only factor for a food plotter. Areas where gly resistance is a problem may encourage some problematic weeds with higher uses of gly. Mechanical termination of a crop like WR may be worth the cost to some.

Thanks,

Jack

 

[yoderjac]

I here where your coming from but I’m in a area that is a huge sand pile with a little topsoil. Having some mulch on top of the soil is a great benefit in my area.

I don't think it matters much in terms of much if the WR is mowed or crimped.

Thanks,

Jack

 

[Big Snow Man]

Jack
I mow now but really don’t keep that mulch layer that a crimper can do.

 

[yoderjac]

Jack
I mow now but really don’t keep that mulch layer that a crimper can do.

Where does it go? Do you hay it or something? Or do you simply plant before it gets to the stage crimpers need to be effective?

 

[Wild Thing]

Grant woods drills the seed right through the rye and then crimps the cover crop when the beans get up to 3-4 inches. It doesn't hurt the beans and they grow right up through the thatch. The thatch, of course, reduces weeds, provides moisture retention, keeps the soil cool, turns into organic matter, etc, etc. He calls it the Buffalo System.

https://www.growingdeer.tv/video/447

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=2&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwis54PRloziAhUEr54KHR0FCK0QFjABegQIARAB&url=https://www.growingdeer.tv/?s=buffalo+system&post_type=videos&season=2018&video_type=episodes&usg=AOvVaw3byzaSSlNJ5J2RfHlVUe23

I am struggling right now on whether I want to buy a bigger 3 pt sprayer for my tractor or buy a crimper. John at www.northwoodswhitetails.com is working with a fabricator now to produce a little less expensive model and has posted photos of a prototype on the Michigan Sportsman Forum. I am going to take a look at it some time soon.

 

[yoderjac]

That is not a Grant Woods technique. It is a pretty standard no-till farming technique.

 

[Catscratch]

I don't have a crimper but would like to have one to lessen my use of herbicides. With that said I know that not all plants terminate when crimped, and it has to be done at the right time for it to work on those that it does work with. I've often thought a sickle bar mower would be a great tool for putting down thatch, but I don't have one of those either.

 

[Wild Thing]

That is not a Grant Woods technique. It is a pretty standard no-till farming technique.

True...but unlike the average no-till farmer, Grant Woods is posting weekly videos in an effort to help out food plotters so he has a following from the folks that inhabit forums like this. He has been doing it for many years and I have found a lot of very useful information from his program. I have a lot of friends that are farmers as well, but there isn't a single crimper in my entire county.

 

[Big Snow Man]

That is not a Grant Woods technique. It is a pretty standard no-till farming technique.

Correct but Grant has dummied it up for food plotters and has shown it works. He continues to refine it for plotting such as planting soybeans and then crimping a few weeks later in a effort to keep the deer from eating the beans.

 

[Baker]

I have a roller crimper and in this spring planting season there are fields I crimped and drilled as well as mowed and planted.Without question I find the crimper the better way to go. However, there is a technique to managing fields required for using the crimper vs simply mowing so its not for everyone . Nonetheless the advantages of following the technique are significant including using less or eliminating herbicide { a key driver for me } improving soil thus reducing inputs which in the long run save money....and besides, its just plain cool!.

I will post video later today showing fields I crimped vs mowed.

 

[Wild Thing]

I have a roller crimper and in this spring planting season there are fields I crimped and drilled as well as mowed and planted.Without question I find the crimper the better way to go. However, there is a technique to managing fields required for using the crimper vs simply mowing so its not for everyone . Nonetheless the advantages of following the technique are significant including using less or eliminating herbicide { a key driver for me } improving soil thus reducing inputs which in the long run save money....and besides, its just plain cool!.

I will post video later today showing fields I crimped vs mowed.

Looking forward to seeing your video Baker. Also looking forward to reducing inputs and herbicide use on my dirt. This will be my 4th year of no-till drilling my food plots but I am still spraying and fertilizing. Grant woods has not spread any fertilizer on many of his food plots for 5+ years...and he's got pretty much gravel for soil. I attended one of his Field Days events a few years ago and really got an eye-opener.

 

[Baker]

Here's the video that shows fields both crimped as well as mowed explaining the difference .

 

[yoderjac]

Good video Baker. Another source for farmer oriented no-till videos is "Ray the soil guy". I recall one farmer that hooked up sprayer and roller in tandem. I've often thought of taking a small 25 gal sprayer and mounting it on my little kasco no-till versadrill. My thought would be to put the nozzles right over each row sow the only sprayed about a 4" width each. I would then use the drill to drill warm season annuals directly into a lush low growing perennial clover field. My theory is that with 1 qt/ac gly would be enough to suppress only the clover 2" on either side of the row. The rest of the clover stays actively growing providing food. The suppressed clover along each row would bounce back but only after the warm season annuals grew above it.

My thinking is that the clover would act as a weed barrier while also providing food. It would feed some level of N to the warm season annuals drilled in. I'm thinking of this for non-RR crops. Sunflowers, Corn, Sorghum, etc would all be candidate Warm Season Annuals.

No-tilling into suppressed clover works well for me. This would be a variant technique that would minimize the amount of gly used and only put it where it is needed. I have not had time to hook up a sprayer to the seed drill this way yet. It is not an original idea. I think I saw it done somewhere years ago as an experiment. I did not see the outcome. If anyone tries something like this, please post about it.

Thanks,

jack

 

[Big Snow Man]

Great video !