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[chummer]

I agree with some of that. I do see Trump as outside mainstream politics and like that particular characteristic. I don't see him as having any insight into elections. I see him more as an opportunist than a Republican. He was and supported Democrats when they held all to power in New York. He ran as a Republican because is was an opportunity for self-promotion. He skillfully manipulated the press, made them an enemy that always gave him air-time because of his outrageous comments. This only served to emphasize how much of an outsider to the political norm. He legitimately won the election using the same system where he legitimately lost. Of course every interest group tries to manipulate elections as much as they can, bot domestic and foreign. That does not constitute a fraudulent election.

I didn't mean to twist your words at all. Personally, I tend toward a Regan Republican with a libertarian streak. I agreed with many but not all of the policies under the Trump administration but found the rhetoric highly divicine and toxic. By far the best thing that came from that administration was the outsourcing of supreme court appointments. They worked out quite well and will keep the far left in check for many years.

As far as the election system goes, it is kind of like the dollar. It only has as much value as we have trust in it. Undermining only serves anarchists. Reforming it is a different story. One problem is that there is a federal/state tension when it comes to elections. The constitution gives a lot of power to state legislatures when it comes to elections. There is a lot of good in that in terms of states rights. A federalized system cedes more power to the federal government. The more power in general that is ceded to the federal government the less local control we have over our own lives. One of the best concepts Regan held was deregulation. We need the federal government for many things like the common defense and for interstate commerce, but the interstate commerce clause have been well over used to justify legislation.

I certainly don't have the answers, but the fantasies pushed by the far left and right don't help us solve these problems. Of course our election system could be better than it is, but many seem to make the perfect the enemy of the good...

Thanks,

jack

So as a supposed republican you had no problem mailing ballots to everyone and not verifying signatures when they came back?

 

[b116757]

It's not hard for anyone to understand but it's how they won the election so they have to keep the mail-in ballots to ensure we never have another Republican president. They thought they had it rigged for Hillary but somehow it failed that time around. The last election worked for them. Republicans are the responsible adults and the Dems are trying to force things on the people that fail miserably every time and are only good for the crooked politicians pushing things through. If everyone carried a gun you would be hard pressed to find crimes that are present everyday now and have become acceptable as dialy life without a second thought. New green deal=IMPOSSIBLE. Kamala Harris couldn't manage a library.

We will still have establishment Republican presidents they have to at least maintain the allusion of elections if they never let it flip ever there would most likely be a genuine civil war.

 

[Bill Loser]

The WEC was created by republicans, it's bipartisan three dems and three republicans. Now that the republicans didn't get what they want in the election they want to do away with the WEC.

Why won't any judges take on the stolen election lawsuits? Maybe they're all on the payroll too?

I'm guessing you have a shrine to Trump, Walker, Vos, and Fitzgerald in your house.

Yep, you just verified what i thought...
Wec is most deffinately not bipartisan any longer, 3 dems, 1 rep that is in the pocket of the demsand 2 that are affraid of being canceled by the dems, yep thats honorable group. Republicans made a mistake not purging the 3 currently there.
No judges will not take it for the same reason no lawyers will, because the dems will destroy anyone who tries to get in the way. Why do you think the ohio lawyers dropped trump? Not because of the law , but because the dems threatened to destroy them and their practices.
You need to get out and see something not on cnn once in a while!
For the record again, i personally cant stand trump, but he did a great job as president and is exactly what the forefathers envisioned when they stsrted this, not the career politicians we have now.

 

[b116757]

My wife likes to say her grandfather before he passed was always going on about the communists taking over this country her family thought he was crazy. As I get older and hopefully wiser I understand the slow incremental march we are on towards communism in this country only a free thinking person of enough life experience would see it happening in slow motion before their eyes. I seriously doubt he was crazy just forward thinking enough to see where we are headed. Anybody that doubts this need look no farther than Bernie Sanders he nearly won the Democrat nomination for president. We’ve moved so far left as a country that a straight up communist is running for president with a real shot at winning. This wouldn’t have even been conceivable in this country 30 years ago.

 

[yoderjac]

So as a supposed republican you had no problem mailing ballots to everyone and not verifying signatures when they came back?

I'm not registered with either party. I'm registered as an independent that has largely voted Republican

 

[chummer]

I'm not registered with either party. I'm registered as an independent that has largely voted Republican

Answer the question.

 

[Bill Loser]

If only Regan and Trump are non-establishment presidents, and all the elections were fraudulent, then both sides must have conspired for the rest of the presidencies...

Just keep repeating the same stuff ..

Yes ,i guess you have no other argument than to keep repeating yourself. I was 10 when Reagan was elected so no idea how that election went.
Not sure how you went from saying that election fraud is entirely debunked to election fraud is rampant in every election to Trump and Reagan are the only 2 to ever win with cheating..... somehow thats normal to you?
For a guy who claims hes a republican you sure talk and argue like a liberal.

 

[Bill Loser]

It was simply a case of saying, If I win one year, elections were legitimate, but if I lose 4 years late

So your people screaming for 4 years that Trump didn't win and russian collusion is what the norm should be? Even though everything you and the rest screamed for 4 years WAS totally debunked ?Then in the next election you double, no triple down on the cheating and literally steal an election and thats ok to you?
Or are you going to go back and say election fraud doesnt exist? Im not sure where your argument will go from here.
Maybe you want to talk about the Roosevelt election next?

 

[yoderjac]

Answer the question.

I think I stated quite clearly that our elections are not perfect and there is plenty of room for improvement. That is a far cry from any indication of fraud. They did check my ID when I voted, but did not test my DNA... Having election procedures that are less than perfect does not a fraudulent election make.

While I hear the election fraud argument used, we all know many republicans believe the harder it is to vote, the fewer democrat voters will turn out which it the real reason they want to increase voter burden. The democrats believe the same thing which is why they want to ease voter burden. Personally, I think they are both wrong and tighter voter scrutiny will have no impact on turnout. Personally, I think tighter voter ID laws do improve our system whether there is sufficient voter fraud or not. Of course, there are bounds. At some point everyone is wearing 666 on their forehead standing in line to vote. Like most things there is a balance to be had. I think every state should decide for themselves what that balance is.

Both sides will push the limits as far as they can when they are in power in a direction that maximizes their chances of holding power.

 

[Bill Loser]

While I hear the election fraud argument used, we all know many republicans believe the harder it is to vote, the fewer democrat voters will turn out which it the real reason they want to increase voter burden

This may be the dumbest statement on the internet today. Congratulations!

 

[yoderjac]

So your people screaming for 4 years that Trump didn't win and russian collusion is what the norm should be? Even though everything you and the rest screamed for 4 years WAS totally debunked ?Then in the next election you double, no triple down on the cheating and literally steal an election and thats ok to you?
Or are you going to go back and say election fraud doesnt exist? Im not sure where your argument will go from here.
Maybe you want to talk about the Roosevelt election next?

Not my people...My people accepted both the legitimate election of Trump and Biden and will accept the results of the mid-term and next presidential election no matter who wins. Hopefully we will get back to an honest concession from the loser regardless of how tight the election is.

We have a great legal system in this country and the top of it is dominated by Trump and other Republican appointees. When we believe there is wrong doing, we use the rule of law and court system to resolve it against the laws at the time and the constitution.

 

[yoderjac]

This may be the dumbest statement on the internet today. Congratulations!

If your right, I'm proud to be dumb!

 

[chummer]

I think I stated quite clearly that our elections are not perfect and there is plenty of room for improvement. That is a far cry from any indication of fraud. They did check my ID when I voted, but did not test my DNA... Having election procedures that are less than perfect does not a fraudulent election make.

While I hear the election fraud argument used, we all know many republicans believe the harder it is to vote, the fewer democrat voters will turn out which it the real reason they want to increase voter burden. The democrats believe the same thing which is why they want to ease voter burden. Personally, I think they are both wrong and tighter voter scrutiny will have no impact on turnout. Personally, I think tighter voter ID laws do improve our system whether there is sufficient voter fraud or not. Of course, there are bounds. At some point everyone is wearing 666 on their forehead standing in line to vote. Like most things there is a balance to be had. I think every state should decide for themselves what that balance is.

Both sides will push the limits as far as they can when they are in power in a direction that maximizes their chances of holding power.

You are never clear. For the third time, should they mail ballots to everyone and not check signatures when they come back? I don’t give a rats ass that they checked your ID when you voted. There were millions of mail in ballots that no ID was needed to get the ballot or checked when it was counted. Does an ID make it harder to vote? Who doesn’t have an ID. You want me to believe someone went to the trouble of registering to vote but does not have an ID? I know you won’t answer the question because it is admitting there was fraud. Go ahead and give us another ramble.

 

[yoderjac]

You are never clear. For the third time, should they mail ballots to everyone and not check signatures when they come back? I don’t give a rats ass that they checked your ID when you voted. There were millions of mail in ballots that no ID was needed to get the ballot or checked when it was counted. Does an ID make it harder to vote? Who doesn’t have an ID. You want me to believe someone went to the trouble of registering to vote but does not have an ID? I know you won’t answer the question because it is admitting there was fraud. Go ahead and give us another ramble.

I was very clear on my position. I think each state should decide their own election rules. If and when those rules are violated, the court system should be used to resolve any dispute. So, it depends on which state, the election laws in that state, and who "they" is in your question. I don't know the election laws in other states and don't much care about them.

 

[hillrunner]

 

[Bill Loser]

Not my people...My people accepted both the legitimate election of Trump and Biden and will accept the results of the mid-term and next presidential election no matter who wins. Hopefully we will get back to an honest concession from the loser regardless of how tight the election is.

We have a great legal system in this country and the top of it is dominated by Trump and other Republican appointees. When we believe there is wrong doing, we use the rule of law and court system to resolve it against the laws at the time and the constitution.

I think you're a lot closer to "those" people than you're admitting.
Actually do a little research but go past cnn and msnbc and see all the fraud that went on in the last election. I know,i know you will expand that to try to say im talking about every election ever so i want to make it clear, I'm only talking about the LAST election. I want to make that very clear to you, as you seem to have a hard time with this.
To say we are calling foul on this election simply because we lost is disingenuous at best. If it was a legitimate election i would accept it. It most certainly was not. Largest number of votes to the lowest approval ratings ? Really?

 

[yoderjac]

I think you're a lot closer to "those" people than you're admitting.
Actually do a little research but go past cnn and msnbc and see all the fraud that went on in the last election. I know,i know you will expand that to try to say im talking about every election ever so i want to make it clear, I'm only talking about the LAST election. I want to make that very clear to you, as you seem to have a hard time with this.
To say we are calling foul on this election simply because we lost is disingenuous at best. If it was a legitimate election i would accept it. It most certainly was not. Largest number of votes to the lowest approval ratings ? Really?

Never watched msnbc or cnn. You evidently know me better than I do. I've said nothing that is disingenuous. I can't imagine you arguing that the election was illegitimate had Trump won but maybe you would. Who knows.

 

[Bill Loser]

Never watched msnbc or cnn. You evidently know me better than I do. I've said nothing that is disingenuous. I can't imagine you arguing that the election was illegitimate had Trump won but maybe you would. Who knows.

Any legitimate election should be honored. This one is not legitimate and the vast majority of Americans knows it.
If you dont watch those you must listen to npr!
I will give you this, you are confident in your blind belief in the msm and democrats.

 

[yoderjac]

Any legitimate election should be honored. This one is not legitimate and the vast majority of Americans knows it.
If you dont watch those you must listen to npr!
I will give you this, you are confident in your blind belief in the msm and democrats.

Well, you sure "know" it. And I have no belief in the democrats blind or otherwise just as I have no belief in your delusionary chatter.

 

[Kooch]

This thread sucks.


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