Cleth mowing question

[Peplin Creek]

how long does one wait to mow after spraying cleth?

 

[FarmerDan]

This is a trap question because there's no good answer except to say, when the grass is dead. Weather, your cleth rate, the use of crop oil and at what rate, height of the target grass when you applied it all affect the problem.

It scares me a little when you ask about mowing grass you just sprayed with cleth. Is it (too) tall? You can knock it down with a hot enough mix, but the best weed control in all cases occurs when sprays are applied when the weeds are small(er).

There's research that indicates the target species are absorbing (not quite the right word - translocating would be) cleth 80 to 90 hours after application. That's under lab conditions. As an aside, absorption is generally complete at about the one-hour mark (rainfast).

Back to the question - how long can you wait?

 

[Peplin Creek]

i sprayed this weekend in my clover plot, the clover is doing really well other than spots of grass However I expect it to head out in the next or two. I was wondering if when it flowers, if I mow, would the grass eventually die or should I wait until it's wilting away.

 

[FarmerDan]

i sprayed this weekend in my clover plot, the clover is doing really well other than spots of grass However I expect it to head out in the next or two. I was wondering if when it flowers, if I mow, would the grass eventually die or should I wait until it's wilting away.

Ok. I guess I'd not mow it. But, if you must, then wait 3-days.

 

[Bill]

I'm with Dan. After its rain safe it should have kind of done its job even though dead grass may not be evident for 2 weeks or more. But if you sprayed to kill the grass in your clover and that objective is complete why mow?

Let the the dead grass act as mulch and let the clover go to seed. Win-win.

 

[Peplin Creek]

I'm with Dan. After its rain safe it should have kind of done its job even though dead grass may not be evident for 2 weeks or more. But if you sprayed to kill the grass in your clover and that objective is complete why mow?

Let the the dead grass act as mulch and let the clover go to seed. Win-win.

I normally will clip it once it goes to seed to try and get some new growth. Plus the thought of spraying a chemical on it that smells somewhat of fuel leads me to think that the plant could "taste" funny... idk it's probably all in my imagination... haha... either way I feel like mowing is the right choice... it should help control some of the broadleaf weeds as well.

 

[yoderjac]

I normally will clip it once it goes to seed to try and get some new growth. Plus the thought of spraying a chemical on it that smells somewhat of fuel leads me to think that the plant could "taste" funny... idk it's probably all in my imagination... haha... either way I feel like mowing is the right choice... it should help control some of the broadleaf weeds as well.

One thing to keep in mind is that you don't want to overstress clover. Drought, herbicides (even clover safe), and mowing all stress clover. Also keep in mind that many of the broadleaf "weeds" that are controlled by mowing are only weeds for farmers, not deer managers. Many of them are as good or better food than we are planting. If you do decide to mow, make sure you don't end up with the combination of herbicides followed by mowing low followed by no rain for several weeks.

Thanks,

Jack

 

[Ben Glantz]

One thing to keep in mind is that you don't want to overstress clover. Drought, herbicides (even clover safe), and mowing all stress clover. Also keep in mind that many of the broadleaf "weeds" that are controlled by mowing are only weeds for farmers, not deer managers. Many of them are as good or better food than we are planting. If you do decide to mow, make sure you don't end up with the combination of herbicides followed by mowing low followed by no rain for several weeks.

Thanks,

Jack

Jack, you bring up a good point in regards to weeds and I have to keep remind g my self of it. Several years ago I sat in my stand over looking my clover plot and I was amazed as I watched deer eat clover AND weeds in my plot. It was a ahha moment. I still work to remove weeds but I'm not as concerned with some weeds in the plot. I wonder if there is info out there on deers preferred weeds?

 

[yoderjac]

There is lots of information on what weeds deer prefer. The problem I have is that there are hundreds of thousands of weeds and I can only identify a handful. I have sort of come to my position on weeds from a different perspective and deer use is only one factor in the equation for me. I've become much more aware of soil health and nutrient cycling over the years. Ray the soil guy has some great videos. Nature doesn't plant monocultures for a reason. Next, I look at it from a deer behavioral perspective. Deer are browsers by nature, not grazers. They move as the feed taking a bite here and there. Unless one is planting very tiny plots of highly attractive foods, deer (if numbers are kept in balance) will have a balanced relationship with vegetation. Then from a management perspective I look at the main purpose for my food plots. I want them to provide quality food during times when nature is not. If they accomplish that they have met the goal. Deer also need physical distribution. A 1/2 acre field of a lush clover monoculture may have more clover plants than 3 acres of weedy clover but the 3 acres of weedy clover will support more deer. Another thing to consider is what happens when you kill a "weed". Something else will grow in its place. Most food plotter presume that will be clover, but that usually is not the case. Clover is fixing N and over the years that makes the field more and more attractive to N seeking plants. Nature want diversity for a reason.

Clover fields are not static in my area. During our cool rainy season clover is advantaged and most weeds can't compete. During hot summer weeds are advantaged. But clover is not my primary for covering the summer stress period, RR beans are. I have fields that you wouldn't think were clover fields when looking at them from a distance in the summer. I mow right before our season, and in a month there is a miraculous transformation to an abundance of clover as the season changes.

My general approach with clover has evolved. Clover is the anchor of my program because it provides more months of deer food than anything else I plant for the lowest cost. I plant more clover distributed over a wider area on the farm than anything else. I use best practices planting a well suited clover from my area (Durana) only in the fall with Winter Rye and regularly mowing that WR in the first spring to release the slow establishing Durana. I generally start with very nice clean monocultures of clover the following fall. From there I don't do much except mowing right before the season in the fall. Each year more and more summer weeds move into the clover. I'm good with that. Finally somewhere around 5-7 years or so, the fields get too weedy. I generally use the 1 qt/ac gly approach with good timing. This is inexpensive and done only once in a 10 year time. I will generally get another 3 or 4 years out of the field. I then rotate into an N seeking crop for a season or two and then go back to clover.

All in all, this approach requires less effort (allowing more time for other improvements), costs less, and provides as much or more value to my deer management. Having said that, there are some truly problematic and invasive weeds that some folks need to deal with. This works for me but may not work for everyone. On occasion when I have had to deal with a problematic weed, I use a wicking bar. This allows me to use any herbicide I need to deal with that particular weed without impacting the clover. It only works for weeds that are taller than my low growing Durana.

Thanks,

Jack