Chestnut seedlings?
- Thread starter Yarg
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chickenlittle
5 year old buck +
Dunstan's are just a large nut branded chinese chestnut. I would not pay a premium for Dunstan but fine to plant.
yoderjac
5 year old buck +
Dunstan has some nice characteristics but as Chickenlittle says, I would not pay a premium for them. I grew my own from nuts so the cost was about the same and I selected Dunstan for my primary chestnut. One characteristic I like is that the nuts tend to fall from the burs making them more accessible. A lot of Chinese tend to drop the bur with the nut in it. Deer seen to get them out anyway. I'm using a several other trees from the chestnut family including Chinese chestnuts, Allegheny Chinquapins, and Seguins.
There is no right answer. Since all of your trees are seed grown, they will all have unique qualities to some degree. As for soils, I have heavy clay. My Dunstan seedlings do just fine, but I have a unique planting technique for my rootmaker trees that keeps them from getting wet feet.
Thanks,
Jack
There is no right answer. Since all of your trees are seed grown, they will all have unique qualities to some degree. As for soils, I have heavy clay. My Dunstan seedlings do just fine, but I have a unique planting technique for my rootmaker trees that keeps them from getting wet feet.
Thanks,
Jack
yoderjac
5 year old buck +
I'm not sure if I follow the question completely. By "gap of drop time" do you mean a large variability in when the nuts drop from tree to tree? In general, I'd say in my zone, most Chinese chestnuts are dropping in September before our archery season begins. I'm not sure how that translates to zone 5B. Auburn patented a couple Chinese chestnuts for wildlife. One is called AU Buck III and Au Buck IV. The patent is exclusively licensed to the Wildlife Group if you are interested in later drop times. I believe III drops into October and IV drops into Nov. I believe that they are fully Chinese.
As for volume and spacing, it really depends on your purpose and situation in terms of "too much". As for spacing, there are a couple approaches. One approach is to plant them far enough apart that they will not compete for resources when mature. I assume the 20x20 is spacing since 20x20 in count would be 400 trees. That is a bit too close for this approach. The second approach is to plant them closer together. They are wind pollinated, not insect pollinated, and the close spacing improves nut production when young. Some orchards when then go in and cull trees when that get large enough to compete for resources. 20'x20' is ok spacing fir this second approach.
In my personal experience, there are lots of things that can keep chestnuts from reaching maturity. Perhaps in a commercial nursery setting where there is a profit motive for a high level of caretaking, things are different. In a wildlife setting, planting in high volume usually means cutting back care taking. They need to be protected unless you deer numbers are very low. Tubes will benefit some trees and be problematic for others. It is pretty expensive to cage 200 trees. A Gallagher-style e-fence for the entire area may be a reasonable protection solution. Some seedlings just won't be vigorous growers. Others will take off like gang busters. Voles can be an issue. Japanese beetles can defoliate young trees.
My point is, in most cases, if you plant 200 seedlings in a wildlife setting, you won't end up with 200 trees. I like the idea of the closer spacing because of this. As for "too much", you have to define that. A 10 year old tree might produce 10 to 25 lbs of nuts. At maturity it could produce 20 to 100 lbs of nuts.
Good luck,
Jack
chickenlittle
5 year old buck +
For mature chinese chestnuts, 30 to 40ft spacing is right. But it will take a long time to get to that size, not everyone will survive and not all will drop productively when you want.
With my seedlings, i planted at 6-8' spacing with 15-20' between the rows. I expect to remove most as they mature and i can choose those that are productive and later dropping. In the meantime, i get more chestnuts than if I had planted that same area with fewer trees on the final spacing.
With my seedlings, i planted at 6-8' spacing with 15-20' between the rows. I expect to remove most as they mature and i can choose those that are productive and later dropping. In the meantime, i get more chestnuts than if I had planted that same area with fewer trees on the final spacing.
A lot of my 1 year old seedlings that have already been cut back AR whips. But a lot of them have branching.. I understand that more leaves mean more photosynthesis means more growth but I read a source that I should cut back the branching when using tree tubes so that the tree can get up and out that faster all the energy would be directed to the main stem. So to trim branching or not is the question... Also the black roots = death so is it necessary to trim them as well.. thank you
Another question for you to experience guys that have planted Chinese seedlings I have extra beyond what I ordered so obviously I'm planting the larger better rooted ones then I have sorted them out to medium ones.. which I'm going to plant.. and then real small ones so do I bother planting the small ones in tubes or should I plant them out and see if they grow.. I just don't know if these are genetic runts or if they were disadvantaged in The Growbeds
NorthPotter
5 year old buck +
Regarding zone 5b. About 5 years ago I transplanted some dunstan seedlings in my 5a at elevation.(some years its a 4b). The few that survived were sheltered from the cold(behind the shed, protected by wind, etc). Of those remaining, they leafed out slightly earlier than other local trees were hit with a May frost and did not regrow. They did not, NOT do well in the cold winter and were very susceptible to overnight low temps in May and late season frosts. Both of which are understandable since back then they originated from Northern Florida...which is an 8b. IMO, my 5a was just too much of a zone adjustment from the original zone for them to survive.
Of the 3 options you presented, I would consider choosing the seedling who's mother was grown in a zone closer to a 5b.
Good recent article about how nuts/embryos inherit germination time/dormancy duration from their mother and then turn it off after germination:
https://m.phys.org/news/2019-03-seeds-inherit-memories-mother.html
Of the 3 options you presented, I would consider choosing the seedling who's mother was grown in a zone closer to a 5b.
Good recent article about how nuts/embryos inherit germination time/dormancy duration from their mother and then turn it off after germination:
https://m.phys.org/news/2019-03-seeds-inherit-memories-mother.html
Thank you great information I was able to get dust... seedlings or Chinese and in line with what you said Chinese would fare better in my 5B and that is why that's what I'm putting in.
yoderjac
5 year old buck +
As far ranking them by roots, I cant really help since mine have all be grown by nuts in rootmakers and all have good root structures. I found that larger the trees when I planted them the better they faired. By larger I mean a combination of height and caliper. Since I grew mine from nuts, I was able to prune them as they grew. I found that if the tree was already out of the tube in height, they did better than those that were not out of the tube when planted. You are right about more photosynthesis, more growth, but trees need to be balanced between roots and top. By pruning mine during the growing season as soon as branching formed, the tree did not waste much energy on producing a branch and then loosing all the energy the leaves on that branch would produce. As soon as a branch would start, I'd clip it. The tree responds by putting more energy into what is left, the central leader.
Thanks,
Jack
Thanks,
Jack
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