What should I convert Fescue into?

[Oleo]

I recently bought some land in eastern KS. I have a mix of hardwoods, eastern red cedars, and fescue/brome grass.

There are some nice deer around, but it feels like I have a lot of pass-through areas rather than good feeding or bedding habitat.

I plan to thin out some cedars to create some bedding areas and I probably need to do some TSI to get some more ground cover in the hardwoods, but I haven’t decided what to do with the grass areas.

I think I’m going to put alfalfa in the 4 acres below the pond dam because I have a farmer that’ll help with that, and there’s very little alfalfa around (just ag and hay). That’ll get me a little food other than acorns. With the other 10 acres of grass up top, would you put it into ag rotation, more alfalfa, or something like switchgrass for cover?

Pictures for reference.
Red=eastern red cedar
Blue=hardwoods
Light Blue=Pond
Big Green Area=grass planned for alfalfa
Little Green Area=food plot? Bedding?
Yellow=area in question

Other context - I have hay fields to the south and ag fields to the west and north. I have the most timber in the immediate area.

Is my best bet to create the bedding and cover in the timber areas and use the current grass areas for food? Or should I try to get some more cover in the grassy areas?

I’m new to habitat management, so any suggestions are welcome.

Thanks!

 

[Telemark]

If you are trying to turn it into a deer property, I would do the north field in an annual food plot rotation and the southern field in switch and shrubs. Then put in staging plots in between the bedding and the food. This will give a relatively clear travel pattern from bedding in the South to food in the North, with your hunting access near your house. And I would screen the fields from the road and your driveway.

 

[Mortenson]

Do they bed in the timber? That looks like a really good farm. Better than a pass through.

 

[Telemark]

Green is the Staging Plots with a stripe of red where fruit trees can go. (North side of each plot)
Black is screening to hide everything from interlopers.
Yellow is switchgrass for bedding/cover/birds. *
Pink is a variety of shrubs for browse and staging.
Purple is TSI and general bedding.

The North field I would do in a rotation of corn/beans/cover crop blend, in order to make sure there was at least a couple acres of high energy food to hit on their way North to the ag fields.

 

[Angus 1895]

Fescue has abrasive barbs on the leaves.

I like brome grass. The deer love the seed heads.

 

[Catscratch]

Anything! Covert it to anything other than fescue.

 

[Oleo]

Thanks for the replies! Some more thoughts:

Do they bed in the timber? That looks like a really good farm. Better than a pass through.

Yeah - this place certainly has some potential, but I also think it needs some work. There were two 4+ year old bucks that would come through on occasion, but it seemed like they spent more time on the neighbors and would just visit occasionally. Found one of those deer dead on my neighbors place while blood trailing the other one that I had hit in the shoulder (he survived). Pictures of those deer attached for kicks. There isn't great ground cover in the hardwood stuff and there is no ground cover in the cedars, so there's probably a few places they bed, but not great cover. Without better cover and some food, I think this place would get more visitors than residents.

Green is the Staging Plots with a stripe of red where fruit trees can go. (North side of each plot)
Black is screening to hide everything from interlopers.
Yellow is switchgrass for bedding/cover/birds. *
Pink is a variety of shrubs for browse and staging.
Purple is TSI and general bedding.

The North field I would do in a rotation of corn/beans/cover crop blend, in order to make sure there was at least a couple acres of high energy food to hit on their way North to the ag fields.

Thanks for putting some time into this! I have some follow up thoughts/questions.

My thought was to put alfalfa in that lower field because it might keep deer from moving toward the neighbors and have bedding on the south edge. Part of the thought there is that these cedars are overrunning everything and keeping anything else from growing. I thought I could clear some out along the south for a bedding area, and catch them traveling from the south bedding to the alfalfa. I was thinking alfalfa for a couple reasons - there's not much of it around so it's something different than the neighbors and that bottom field is big enough that it's intimidating for me with no equipment but doesn't have access for big farm equipment. I have a farmer that can drill, spray, and bale alfalfa in that area, but I don't think there's much else I could get "free" help with for that area. With those thoughts, do you think I could get enough good bedding/cover in the woods to run this in alfalfa, or do you think I should just get to work making that 4 acres into more bedding?

What does TSI look like for a monoculture of eastern red cedars? When I look at historical satellite images, they've just taken over these chunks in the last 20-30 years, and it seems like they aren't providing much wildlife value. I'm tempted to cut out 1 acre chunks and see what pops up from the ground naturally. I attached a picture from 1996 to show how much those cedars have expanded since then (picture is oriented sideways).

Side note - one of those staging plots you have marked is the top of my pond dam, and I'll probably keep that as driving access for mower and side by side.

I don't think it matters much to this conversation, but there is about 100 feet of elevation change from the NW to SE of this property with some ups and downs through the woods.

 

[Telemark]

My thought was to put alfalfa in that lower field because it might keep deer from moving toward the neighbors and have bedding on the south edge. Part of the thought there is that these cedars are overrunning everything and keeping anything else from growing. I thought I could clear some out along the south for a bedding area, and catch them traveling from the south bedding to the alfalfa. I was thinking alfalfa for a couple reasons - there's not much of it around so it's something different than the neighbors and that bottom field is big enough that it's intimidating for me with no equipment but doesn't have access for big farm equipment. I have a farmer that can drill, spray, and bale alfalfa in that area, but I don't think there's much else I could get "free" help with for that area. With those thoughts, do you think I could get enough good bedding/cover in the woods to run this in alfalfa, or do you think I should just get to work making that 4 acres into more bedding?

I just don't have experience with alfalfa, except setting out small bales of it in winter in big timber in Ontario to give the deer something other than twigs and bark to eat. It's certainly worth a try. If it doesn't work out, you can always convert it to something else in a few years. And you really should be looking long-term on these things. I can't think of a reason not to try it.

 

[Telemark]

What does TSI look like for a monoculture of eastern red cedars? When I look at historical satellite images, they've just taken over these chunks in the last 20-30 years, and it seems like they aren't providing much wildlife value. I'm tempted to cut out 1 acre chunks and see what pops up from the ground naturally. I attached a picture from 1996 to show how much those cedars have expanded since then (picture is oriented sideways).

You're likely to get more ERC popping up naturally in the areas you clear. I would keep going in there every couple years and lopping out the new ERC growth. Additionally, I would take at least one of those clearings and amend the soil and plant a low rate of switchgrass. A few posters on here have had amazing results with that technique. Another thing to consider is to take an acre or so and remove about half to two thirds of the ERC trees, but just kill the rest and leave them standing. That will leave it with good horizontal cover but allow things to grow up in between. You might get better regen that way, especially if you plant a few desirable shrubs in there. The idea being that the desirable shrubs will produce berries and seeds that birds will eat, and then excrete into the semi-cleared area when they flit around among the dead ERC trees.

 

[SwampCat]

After six or seven years of battling fescue, I had it gone - I thought. Three years later, this year - it looks like I have never done anything to it. As thick as it was when I bought the place. Gonna start all over this winter

 

[Brian662]

First off, awesome looking property! I'd say your potential is nearly unlimited if you have the most cover in your area. If you hunt it smart and don't put pressure on the deer, meaning don't let them know they're being hunted, you should be in control of the neighborhood herd. That will only intensify if you start offering high quality food in addition to that cover.

Not knowing what your resources are, if it was me I would look into a cost share program to thing those ERC. Getting those controlled and some diversity added to those stands will be huge. Is there any value in your hardwoods? Probably not a great deal of timber companies in your area, but may be worth having a logger try to thin the woods and add some money to your pocket, which will also increase ground cover dramatically.

If you focus your southern side of the property on bedding, the movement from bedding to food (north side) should be predictable and should give you adjacent access to stand locations on the east and west sides of your property depending on wind.

Having 100' of elevation change is huge in another otherwise mostly flat landscape. Topo features and cover will lead deer to their bedding locations. I would spend a considerable amount of time this January/February combing over the property and figuring out which bedding elevations they want to bed at, then enhance those areas the best you can with habitat. Understand why they are bedding there and with which winds they bed where they do. "Room with a view" is my favorite expression for deer bedding. They want to see the danger in front of them and have the wind at their back to alert them of danger behind them, which is why they're always changing locations.

When you're doing the TSI and ERC removal, you can focus on creating pinch points for rut funnels. Is the water big enough you could safely blow your scent over? Water makes a great pinch point and stand location.

Make changes slowly in your timber and see how the deer adjust to them. It'll be a fun ride figuring that place out. Having the best/most cover in the area is huge, if you also have the best food, it won't be long and your neighbors will complain they aren't seeing many deer. Good luck.

 

[Angus 1895]

elevation will give you thermals for still hunting.

hunt going up In morning/ evening.

hunt down middle of day..

 

[Angus 1895]

Have you considered sanfoin?

 

[omicron1792]

I would do a native grass and forb mix in the south instead of straight switch. Many have been disappointed with mono switch stands that look pretty but don’t get used. Mix a bunch of native grasses and forbs.

Otherwise I think @Telemark nailed it.

Welcome!

 

[Oleo]

You're likely to get more ERC popping up naturally in the areas you clear. I would keep going in there every couple years and lopping out the new ERC growth. Additionally, I would take at least one of those clearings and amend the soil and plant a low rate of switchgrass. A few posters on here have had amazing results with that technique. Another thing to consider is to take an acre or so and remove about half to two thirds of the ERC trees, but just kill the rest and leave them standing. That will leave it with good horizontal cover but allow things to grow up in between. You might get better regen that way, especially if you plant a few desirable shrubs in there. The idea being that the desirable shrubs will produce berries and seeds that birds will eat, and then excrete into the semi-cleared area when they flit around among the dead ERC trees.

Thanks for the ideas - I'll try the switchgrass or shrubs idea on a small scale somewhere soon.

 

[Oleo]

I would do a native grass and forb mix in the south instead of straight switch. Many have been disappointed with mono switch stands that look pretty but don’t get used. Mix a bunch of native grasses and forbs.

Otherwise I think @Telemark nailed it.

Welcome!

Good clarification - makes sense.

 

[Oleo]

elevation will give you thermals for still hunting.

hunt going up In morning/ evening.

hunt down middle of day..

You aren't kidding about this. Unfortunately, I haven't found these thermals to be as predictable as the thermals in the mountains. Seems like they create more swirling than consistent up or down breeze. I don't think it's bit me too bad yet, but adds an extra element for sure.

 

[Oleo]

Not knowing what your resources are, if it was me I would look into a cost share program to thing those ERC. Getting those controlled and some diversity added to those stands will be huge. Is there any value in your hardwoods? Probably not a great deal of timber companies in your area, but may be worth having a logger try to thin the woods and add some money to your pocket, which will also increase ground cover dramatically.

I haven't seen much logging activity around here, but I haven't looked into it much - I think it would probably be worth it just to have some help clearing out ERC even if it didn't bring much money.

If you focus your southern side of the property on bedding, the movement from bedding to food (north side) should be predictable and should give you adjacent access to stand locations on the east and west sides of your property depending on wind.

The north/south layout of this place has made it tricky to hunt this year. Seems like the deer have been working the edges and have forced me to go in deep - my access hasn't been very good. Hoping I can get some consistent movement like this so I don't have to go in so deep.

Having 100' of elevation change is huge in another otherwise mostly flat landscape. Topo features and cover will lead deer to their bedding locations. I would spend a considerable amount of time this January/February combing over the property and figuring out which bedding elevations they want to bed at, then enhance those areas the best you can with habitat. Understand why they are bedding there and with which winds they bed where they do. "Room with a view" is my favorite expression for deer bedding. They want to see the danger in front of them and have the wind at their back to alert them of danger behind them, which is why they're always changing locations.

It will be interesting to see if I can find some of the beds. I'm thinking there are some points they might bed on. If there's an elevation band, I should have a few places as the terrain goes up and down a fair bit.

Is the water big enough you could safely blow your scent over? Water makes a great pinch point and stand location.

That pond is a couple acres and would be good for this, but I need a west wind. It happens somewhat regularly, but as Angus pointed out, the thermals make it tricky next to the pond.

 

[Oleo]

I think my setup is mostly good for bedding around the south, west, and maybe east edge with food in the middle and north. Is there any cautions regarding having bedding near the perimeter rather than in the middle?

 

[Turkey Creek]

Great looking piece of property. Depending on visibility from the road that runs the north side of the property I wouldnt intentionally draw deer closer to the road presently. Screening takes time. Native grass blocks are way better than fescue. Nothing uses fescue from a wildlife perspective.