Tree stand cables to chains

I have heard of cable fails exactly where you are taking about. Especially the cable that is covered with a plastic or rubber sheath. Water gets in there and it corrodes quicker and is usually not visible. It got me thinking about some of my older stands manufactured that way. I have been contemplating replacing them with chain. I have a couple of the old screaming eagle stands, they were a well built stand.
 
How to test the chain and connector? Strap the stand on a straight tree in the yard about 4 or 5 feet above the ground. Get the chain and connectors in place.

Attach weigh equal to your body weight on each front corner where your toes could step when facing away from the tree. Leave that weight on the stand over night. Come back the next day and inspect the situation.

That is a large load but it is risk free in this test. If your stand can't handle that stress - guess what is on the line? Your welfare and way of life.

I appreciate Tap saying be careful and he is sincere. Just do a simple test. The D links are work the cost.

It is the job of each of us to get ourselves into the woods safely and home safely. Any hard heads - would you put your son or daughter in a dangerous tree stand?

Wayne
 
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I considered this after my little scare this past season when I had a cable fail. Hindsight 20/20 you know!

I am sure cable is used today simply as a cost control measure. Todays business world is very competitive and companies are pushed to minimize inputs while maximizing output. As such the cost and weight all favor the use of cables. I see it at my job in the automotive biz everyday. Also consider that our consumer mindset has changed as well in most cases. Things simply are not built or expected to last forever anymore - everything now has a lifespan. Products today are designed and made to meet the requirement and that is all and to spend as little as possible in the process.
I completely agree with this statement. I have had cables fail on me as well and have very little faith in mass produced stands anymore. How many would trust the 1/4" bolt and 1/8" steel on these stands? I like the idea of using the chain to replace cables. Thanks for sharing.
 
How to test the chain and connector? Strap the stand on a straight tree in the yard about 4 or 5 feet above the ground. Get the chain and connectors in place.

Attach weigh equal to your body weight on each front corner where your toes could step when facing away from the tree. Leave that weight on the stand over night. Come back the next day and inspect the situation.

The old ad from Screaming Eagle showed them hanging a Volkswagon bug hoisted from the stand.
Prior to that ad, they had a couple elk hanging from it in their 1st ad.
Speaking of Screaming Eagle...does anyone out there have any of their old catalogs? I wish I would have saved a couple...great catalogs and cool stuff.

SW Pa
 
Tap,

I have an old screaming eagle stand. I have the Boss print of the Buck that they never killed. But I don't have the old catalog. I have been Wensel fans forever. Got Gene Wensel's first two books.

Wayne
 
Tap,

I have an old screaming eagle stand. I have the Boss print of the Buck that they never killed. But I don't have the old catalog. I have been Wensel fans forever. Got Gene Wensel's first two books.

Wayne
There could be a whole new thread on Wensel discussion. But I don't want to morph my own thread (like I often do...sorry guys...bad habit).
Maybe I'll PM you Wayne. We can discuss our man crush on Gene and Barry

SW Pa
 
Good idea Tap. Thanks for sharing. One recommendation if it has not been mentioned. I would use a lock nut with that bolt and a nice thick washer.
 
There could be a whole new thread on Wensel discussion. But I don't want to morph my own thread (like I often do...sorry guys...bad habit).
Maybe I'll PM you Wayne. We can discuss our man crush on Gene and Barry

SW Pa
Hey I had one of those stands. I also use those mittens that Gene and Barry used. They were called wolly buggers. Work great and they had some other good stuff they used to test and if it was good enough for them they would sell it.
 
One thing that hasn't been pointed out is that the chain is at an angle and not vertical. That will cause more pull on the chain/connections than the weight supported. It's been a while since I've done that kind of math but I would go way stronger than your weight.
 
I completely agree with this statement. I have had cables fail on me as well and have very little faith in mass produced stands anymore. How many would trust the 1/4" bolt and 1/8" steel on these stands? I like the idea of using the chain to replace cables. Thanks for sharing.

But you are willing to use mass produced chain & connectors to replace the same cable?
 
Beautiful idea that I will be implementing on my stands, just need some refining. I use a 5000lb+ fall restraint approved locking "carabiner" for my safety harness to "clip" onto all the safety straps that go around the tree above the stand.

You should look into those D rings there talking about.

180lbs a piece for a rating is not nearly enough to get me to stand on it, and I'm 180 pounds. Think about when you step onto a scale, the scale tends to read more than one weighs because of gravity/Newtons laws ......... until it's balanced out. Force =Mass * Acceleration

When you move from sitting to standing you exert more force than you weigh, because you are accelerating mass. I've seen a few sources where the g-force multiples by half a factor when one moves from sitting to standing. That means just that activity of sitting to standing multiplies your weight by 1.5 times, and this is based off of bad math and science practices as I type this on my iPhone lol.

180lb person * 1.5G = 270lbs is approximately the force a 180lb person exerts to lift themselves from sitting to standing at an average rate, and this is obviously not as accurate as it can be.

Those stands MAY be built with safety factors such as this, and I would check to see if those carabiners you have attached are as well.

You can see a good example of this by stepping on the bath scale and moving the body up and down.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
I want to slowly start doing this to all of my older stands, great and amazing way to breathe long life spans into the hang ons...sure to get solid high grade chains and D rings and such might exceed the cost many want to throw into a $50 or $90 hang on (some of mine are the Guide gear variety) but it's either that or they are gonna fail and fail quicker rather than longer.
 
Bringing this to the top in hopes its saves a life.
Today I stood on and old hang on at a friends place and installed a lifeline system then snapped in. I sat down. He text me tbat there was a doe on a far ridge. I stood up to screw my go pro into the tree overhead and BOOM the cables broke. The stand was flat straight down and my harness caught me. I was back on the sticks in a few seconds. Other than a sore finger I am fine.

That stand could have fallen in the first 3 minutes i stood there. Thank god it didnt. Check your cables. Throw out old stands. Maintain your stuff. My daughter is very happy I had that harness on and am now trying to figure out how to never leave the ground without20181112_152850.jpg one on again.
 
Wow!
Glad you're ok!!!
 
Holy cow bluecollar! Glad you're harness caught you. A poignant reminder!
 
Someone was watching out for ya.

Glad you brought this up. Looks like I have some work to do this winter.

Have some old stands that dad made with cable way back in the day that need some updating.
 
Thank you for this and Im glad to hear you're ok. It seems obvious to replace for leveling, cant believe i never thought of this. Maybe nice stands have this option? My broke ass only ever buys the el' cheepos. I will without a doubt be taking all of my stands down after seeing this. I just started using a harness this year after hunting for 20 years without.

Again, glad you are ok and thanks for the reminder and looking out for the rest of us.
 
Yikes Bluecollar!! I'm glad you were using fall restraint. Also glad you didn't suffer any substantial injuries or pain from the fall arrest. I've always wondered what types of injuries could happen from even the shortest of falls. We are in trees with guns or broad heads, and we have sticks or steps and other metal objects to get ripped-open on. Then there is always the scary thought of having testicles smashed by the leg straps.

One thing that is seldom discussed, and a lot of hunters have never even heard of, is suspension trauma. Having the harness save you from the fall is only half the battle. You MUST be able to get back on the steps (or platform) asap. It's a fallacy to believe that you can hang in a safety harness with feet dangling for an extended time (until help comes). Suspension trauma is a very real threat and it can kill you. Legs hanging with no muscle tension allows blood to pool in the legs and it will eventually kill you, and it doesn't take very long to happen. Even after rescuing someone that has been suspended has severe risks when blood then rushes back from the legs. Do not remain suspended in a harness!!

My chain conversions have served me well. I've had no issues with the strength of the chain or the carabiners that I chose. But if anyone has the slightest doubt about using a carabiner (in order to allow leveling of the stand), then go with just chain and no beener...the stand won't be adjustable without tools, but quality chain is still better than cables.

Amsteel rope (AKA Dyneema rope) is another option for replacing cables. Amsteel is used to replace steel cable in winches, so it's extremely strong. If I remember correctly, 1/4" Amsteel has something like a 7,500 lb break strength. There are some very easy-to-make splices for Amsteel that will allow it to be adjusted safely in order to level stands. My only question about using Amsteel is, will varmints ever chew it? I've used Amsteel on sticks and never had squirrel damage, so take that for what it's worth.

All that being said, I will admit that, for 90% of my tree sits, I've changed my method from a traditional platform to a tree saddle. Saddles, when properly used, are the safest way to be elevated. They also allow for a greater variety of tree selection. The older generation of saddles (Trophy Line brand) IMO, left a lot to be desired. They were uncomfortable, bulky to wear and terrible to walk in. But there are newer designs on the market that are much more user-friendly, comfortable and wearing while walking is a non-issue. I am in the midst of my 1st, fully-dedicated season of saddle hunting and I am absolutely sold on them. There is a bit of a learning curve and practice needed to develop a system, but once those are accomplished, a saddle is comfortable, extremely mobile, and very safe. With a saddle, your stand will never be stollen or hunted by unauthorized hunters. Nobody will realize your stand locations, ether.
And saddles beat the crap out of climbers...hands down.

Saddles can also be used while hunting from traditional platforms or ladders. They allow 360 degree shooting in many cases because of mobility around the tree.
But one of my favorite uses for saddles is for just hanging stands. Setting a stand while attached to the tree via a tether is MUCH easier that doing it with a lineman belt.
There's a lot of info out there about saddles. There is a forum dedicated to saddles and also quite a few Youtube vids on the entire subject.

No matter what type of platform I use, I will always be in a saddle as opposed to an old school harness.
 
Glad you're OK, Bluecollar !! Very lucky. I agree someone was watching out for you.

For anyone replacing bolts, nuts, & washers on hang-on tree stands or ladder stands - go with stainless steel. No rust worries.
 
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As a former marine rigger and government inspector. Chain is only as good as the weakest link. The reason riggers use cable is because it is made of many strands and the damage can be seen. Never use cable that is covered. Gerenally, wire rope has a safety factor of 7 but anything to do with people should have a safety factor of 20. Stay safe. General Motors learnt their lesson for using a chain that was fabricated with out inspection. The 3 inch bed plate went 10 feet through the cement and ruined 3 locomotives. A few million in damage.
 
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