Hunter Managed Herds

[bat man]

WHIPS pics do a good job of showing hunters things they have never seen. Most hunters of MN don't know how bad it is in places compared to other parts of the country. Most will never leave the state or the camp they hunt.

The picture has to be painted that it can be better or nobody bites.

How do we show them it can be better and this is how we get there.?

 

[wiscwhip]

WOW! That's a stark contrast. Great pics

The masses want to see the train wrecks, so supply them with their "dirty laundry"!;)

 

[sandbur]

I use the term loosely. But Art committed to all of Morrison County as President of MCCMDHA.

We will gladly take members from outside of the county.
I would like to see some change at upper levels in the organization. Not sure how to do it, but membership numbers count.

We need more habitat information in the organization, and I don't mean just planting a few trees on a wildlife area. The state tends to take the trees out anyway.

 

[*Hawaii5joe*]

I would think a series of you tube videos would be beneficial to get things going and the word out there. E-mail them, share them on FB (all the deer group pages) advertise in the outdoor news, whatever. People need to see this stuff with their own eyes. "What do you mean I should clear cut that mixed hardwood/aspen stand? The deer like acorns!" Here watch this video of these 12 deer browsing these stump shoots and young aspen all winter long. They'll be here for many winters to come too.

 

[*Hawaii5joe*]

Hate to say it, but MDHA chapters could take some lessons from the "better" QDMA chapters. Put on some field days, make associations with seed/tree dealers (free giveaways, cheap seed deals, chapter association with Bailey's for group tree buys, etc.), get some outside biologists to come and speak, etc. etc. etc.

For too long MDHA has had a sick, symbiotic relationship with the MN DNR. Its time for HQ to start helping private landowners improve their properties rather than giving the DNR more money to buy land for prairie chicken and song bird management.

This is very true.

 

[*Hawaii5joe*]

Need some success story's. For the Mille Lacs Whitetails bunch, some are starting to see the difference we have been waiting for. More would be seeing the difference if we wouldn't have been set back with the deer number issue.

 

[West Branch]

I think that the sight visits, youtube videos, websites with info all sound like great ideas. The hard part is going to be getting the info out there with enough people seeing it, which is why it would be great to get MDHA or other orgs on board.

A website with a section that has a local contact by county or similar areas in MN would be one way to do it. For example I could be listed as the contact for Carlton County. Like Stu just posted - it would be a loose association of coops.

Starting out contacts would probably be lucky if 1 person contacted them in a year. This would have to be a long term thing, and keeping people interested would be tough. And how would we get people to the website without help from MDHA?

 

[West Branch]

Like J-bird and others posted QDMAs example of coops is something to look at. But I know I do not want involvement of a national organization. Even a statewide org would be tough to work with. The minute we start talking about having to host annual banquets and fundraising I am out. BUT I could easily get a group of neighbors together to grill brats and burgers and host a bunch of folks that want to talk deer and habitat management. I'll even buy a stack of these to hand out: https://www.qdma.com/shop/a-basic-guide-to-quality-deer-management-booklet

 

[*Hawaii5joe*]

I think some kind of partnership with MDHA would be good if possible.

 

[bat man]

Need some success story's. For the Mille Lacs Whitetails bunch, some are starting to see the difference we have been waiting for. More would be seeing the difference if we wouldn't have been set back with the deer number issue.

Typical story in our chapter is 'Our bunch stopped shooting does in the last few years, and now we see deer every single sit. Neighboring landowners who kill every deer they see often go days without seeing any deer, and many spend the whole season and never see a deer.'

I would dare say our branch has made more progress since we were disbanded by corporate than we did when we ran banquets.

 

[bueller]

I've seen you guys mention posters of some sort to display at county fairs, etc... Have you considered having a mass amount of flyers printed. The cost really isn't that bad and this would give your target audience something to take with them rather than just read as they pass by. Stacks of these flyers could also be left on the counters of hardware stores and other locations were deer hunters frequent or purchase their licenses from.

 

[bat man]

I do too, as well as QDMA, MBI, MWA, BWA....anyone and everyone
We'll need as many contacts as possible to get the word out

I have thousands of email contacts I used for MDDI. And we have rapport with those emails and with the states deer groups. People know we get things done.

 

[wiscwhip]

I have thousands of email contacts I used for MDDI. And we have rapport with those emails and with the states deer groups. People know we get things done.

That is huge for a starting point Brooks. Would the effort hold more clout if you had an actual "scientist" on your side? Is there any one of the groups listed above(other than QDMA:mad:) that could afford a wildlife/deer biologist on the payroll, even as a part-time gig? It may give the "movement" more traction? Then again, I'm not sure the Fudd's would know the difference either way? Getting things done with the science to back it all up may make guys on the fence more willing to commit, but who knows, it may not be worth the money spent?

 

[wiscwhip]

Maybe you guys need a DMAP program similar to WI and some of the other states. Then the farmers with issues could get extra tags on an individual, as needed basis to keep the deer out of their feed stores. The only drawback I see to that is that it would be run by YOUR DNR, which at this point I would want to keep out of the equation completely. Essentially it is what you are proposing doing on your own, minus the ability to get the extra tags for problem areas. You would be educating(possibly with individual site visits) landowners on how to "read" the number of deer on their property and how to improve it to make it better, and then helping them determine how many antlerless to harvest(if any) to achieve their goals.

 

[bat man]

Maybe you guys need a DMAP program similar to WI and some of the other states. Then the farmers with issues could get extra tags on an individual, as needed basis to keep the deer out of their feed stores. The only drawback I see to that is that it would be run by YOUR DNR, which at this point I would want to keep out of the equation completely. Essentially it is what you are proposing doing on your own, minus the ability to get the extra tags for problem areas. You would be educating(possibly with individual site visits) landowners on how to "read" the number of deer on their property and how to improve it to make it better, and then helping them determine how many antlerless to harvest(if any) to achieve their goals.

Purportedly we have a similar program (DMAP) that was a pilot in SE expanding statewide this fall. That was what we were told in the stakeholder meetings. We shall see.

 

[wiscwhip]

I'm sure MDHA could afford one if they so desired. My guess is most of the state's deer groups would say we already have a bunch of paid deer biologists in the DNR...why hire one ourselves?

Because they are hacks!

 

[bat man]

Has anyone ever taken the land steward course through QDMA. They have an online version for $200. Says if you have levels one and two you can do surveys, mgmt plans etc. I think they whole QDMA site is down right now.

Thought this was a nice graphic from CT to help drive some of the points we are discussing home. It shows how the deer were spread out in a helicopter count of 1 mile squares. Add lines to make it sixteen 40 acre parcels. Kill all the does in your area and you may wait days for one of the others to come drifting through.... If you are lucky enough to house some deer you best not scare them into the dead zones where anything brown gets shot.

Above graphic could be a great tool for MNF'rs exponential growth scenario. Show the same pic in a 3 year progression. Some groups lets does walk and watch numbers grow. Some get to wait on the fringes and kill the occasional straggler.

 

[wiscwhip]

View attachment 6084 Has anyone ever taken the land steward course through QDMA. They have an online version for $200. Says if you have levels one and two you can do surveys, mgmt plans etc. I think they whole QDMA site is down right now.

I have considered it myself and never pulled the trigger. I likely wouldn't given the current status of QDMA and their ranking on my sh!t list. I'm pretty sure many guys on here could do a darn good job of putting together a property management plan without the QDMA classes or endorsements and some likely have. It's not rocket surgery after all.

 

[bat man]

Currently the deer find refuge from the wolves by going to Duluth where they offer 5 bonus tags per hunter.

On a serious note the MDHA hunter observation surveys from that area for 400 hunting days showed 82 antlered bucks spotted and 53 wolves spotted while on stand. oops.

 

[wiscwhip]

Please help me out here.....As a lot of you already know, I'm almost clueless about deer management but I do know a little about fish ponds. And I see a lot of similarities between the two with regards to population dynamics. For example, if I have a pond full of large mouth bass (top line predator) and I want to get a population of bluegills (prey) established, I simply stock bluegills large enough that the bass can't eat or I remove a lot of the bass before stocking the bluegills. If I simply put small bluegills into the pond, all I did was feed the bass....My question is this:

In the wolf areas of MN, the MN DNR has depleted the whitetail population like the rest of the state. And the wolves are now very plentiful along with being federally protected. What strategies or how do we help land owners get recruitment of young deer in those areas?

Teach them the intricacies of the SSS system of improving deer populations in wolf zones.;)