end all, be all, clover discussion... Keying on Longevity of the stand.

[mikmaze]

As we scratch our way through another spring I know many of us will be planing to plant clover at some point, most likely during the fall. I have planted a lot of clover over the years, from the bags of pure seed at tractor supply, to the bags you can get from NWTF, to jumbo ladino, crimson ( annual ) and right now I am being stunned by a stand of clover I planted last fall, bought 15 lbs at a seed supply store and I'll be danged that I did not write down the name of the clover. But I tell you what, it is 18 inches tall right now and getting hit HARD by the deer. I have a one acre plot of it and am flat out amazed at what it is becoming. I only hope it is not a biennial mammoth red that will do its thing and be gone after this season.

What my perfect world clover would be:
grow from seeding and be able to compete against grasses and weeds.
last as a pure stand for 4 to more years
shrug off the maybe once a year hit with gly at about an oz per gallon to knock out things it can't compete with
not need a moving
forgiving as for soil types as I have some clay, and only one sandy plot on the 300 acres I manage


so what do you folks say? I've tried alfalfa, and that was a bust, so clovers, lets hear the ideas, input, success/ failure.
sources are always a bonus!
thanks, mike

 

[Bill]

I have had very good luck with Lickcreeks suggested blend.

Per Paul "4 way mix of Alice, KopuII, Jumbo Ladino and Alta-Swede Mammouth Red Clover from Welter Seed and 2#'s of each is more then enough to sow an acre."

These plots always seem to meet your 4 year requirement for me. I do mow above the flowers a few time a summer.

 

[bbcoach]

For me it's Durana all the way. I've tried Dutch White and Red Clover but they don't hold a candle to Durana. I've had 2 plots in Durana and they both took off. The latest, I started in the fall of 2015 and it is awesome right now. It is about a half acre and the deer and turkeys keep it eat down to within a 1/2 inch through the winter months. Once this clover is established, durana stolons will run every where choking out most weeds and grasses. The avatar to the left is the latest plot. Here's a few PICS I took in May of 2016 of the durana. I'll try and get some current PICS and post them.

 

[mikmaze]

thanks guys so far, Bill I appreciate the input, but I forget what hardiness zone you plot in at your MO property? I am plotting here in NJ, still no time to plot at the NY plcae, just not there enough.

 

[Bill]

I'm in 5A and we do seem to have naturally high Ph lots of clay in my soil and for some reason stuff likes to grow in it if we can get some moisture.

 

[yoderjac]

I'm a durana guy too. I'll sometimes mix faster establishing short-lived clover like crimson or medium red. I always plant in the fall with a nurse crop of winter rye. Durana is slow to establish. The key for me to get a clean plot is timely spring mowing of the WR to release it the first spring. After it is established, I pretty much ignore weeds. After a year or two it can look ugly in the summer, but I mow before the season and when the rain and cool nights favor clover, it takes over the field again. I typically get 5 years before I mess with herbicides. I use the 1 qt/ac gly method as well but I drill GHR and WR into the suppressed clover. This adds some attraction while the clover is bouncing back and uses up some of the excess N. The radish also provides some organic tillage.

I'm sure you've seen the picture I've posted with the clover bouncing back filling in around the GHR. I'm in 7a. I like Durana because of the persistence and drought tolerance.

Thanks,

Jack

 

[SwampCat]

I like durana on decent soil that is not south facing and arrowleaf on those areas that just dry up in the summer. I have a two acre plot of arrowleaf that volunteered when I cleared the plot in an overgrown pasture. At the end of every summer, I spray gly, bush hog, top seed with wheat, and lightly disk. The clover has come back strong every year for six years. Not sure if it would come back if I didnt disk it. I have planted several perennial clovers in that plot and none have come back after their first summer. It is a dey ridgetop, red clay. For more foregiving ground, durana has been best for me. It will not survive prolonged flooding.

 

[Tree Spud]

Mikmaze ... I am in 4b and my soils are average at best leaning towards the loamy sand. I have several clover stands that are 4-5 years old and doing well. Have never sprayed or cut them. I seeded with ladino & red clover, occasionally every couples of years frost seeding them in the spring with seed I buy at the local feed mill. The one thing I consistently do every fall is over seed with winter rye. That has helped with keeping the weeds and other grasses in check.

 

[mikmaze]

I see a lot of DUrana being mentioned, sounds like a winner, time to do some more reading, and time to start looking at suppliers.

 

[Boll Weevil]

Another vote for Durana...7 years and counting on my oldest clover stands. Not really sure that I'll ever have need to plant any other variety.

 

[marlin]

Yoderjac I agree with you. Plant in the fall with nurse crop of winter rye seems to be the key.

 

[davidhelmly]

Another vote here for Durana but I put Alice right there with and considerably less money.

 

[Someday isle]

One and a half year old mix of ladino and Kopu 2. So far so good but I don’t have any long term results to offer. Mine started as part of Lickcreeks fall mix.

 

[mikmaze]

That looks awesome, I have had stands like that with jumbo ladino, but they just don't last long. I should have taken a pic of the plot that is growing like mad to see if anyone could figure which clover it is, sad to say I probably got a short lived variety, but man does it look good right now.

 

[Boll Weevil]

Someday,
Just curious and might simply be the angle of the photo but is the height of the clover the same outside as inside the enclosure? That looks like a strong growing stand...what's your deer density like?

Just got to thinking about if there might be a variety preference. Anyone done any comparisons on their property?

 

[j-bird]

I planted Ladino a few years ago and simply mow and try to fight the weeds. I hit mine with gly annually and it bounces back. Sometimes so do the weeds.....
However sometimes the deer eat the "weeds" too. Right now this plot has just about every bad weed you can think of. Canada thistle, nut sedge, dock weed, whatever the thing is in the picture and come summertime it will have smartweed and grasses as well. I don't worry about a clean plot any more. My plots provide more food than the deer I have can eat so why worry about it. Keep weeds from going to seed and a shot of gly while the clover is fairly dormant and it will bounce back in the fall...... I think too much activity in plots with mowing and the like can be counter productive to their use by the deer and other critters.

 

[yoderjac]

I see a lot of DUrana being mentioned, sounds like a winner, time to do some more reading, and time to start looking at suppliers.

I couldn't find a better price locally than from Harvey Nail at Poudre Valley Coop even with shipping.

 

[Someday isle]

Someday,
Just curious and might simply be the angle of the photo but is the height of the clover the same outside as inside the enclosure? That looks like a strong growing stand...what's your deer density like?

Just got to thinking about if there might be a variety preference. Anyone done any comparisons on their property?

It is the same inside and outside of the enclosure. i mowed two weeks ago and moved the exclusion cage to see the difference in the growth moving forward. We are not too far away from our annual high heat and drought conditions so i want to see how it holds up to use as it slows down with the summer weather.

 

[Someday isle]

Forgot to answer the deer density question. We have decent numbers. I only have 36 acres with about an acre and a half total in plots. I'm working towards a half acre total of clover and an acre of cereal grain mix. Right now i have six to eight different regulars on camera. There are six does and a couple bucks. Last year i had two doe groups and four or five bucks off and on again throughout the hunting season.

 

[bbcoach]

Sportsman Guide has 5 lb bags for 29.99. 5 lbs will plant 1 acre