What to do with aspen trees?
- Thread starter Telemark
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j-bird
Moderator
Can you describe the situation better? Are the trees in question in a wooded area or more in the open? Are they young trees, pole size trees, or even larger? Is the area in need of browse or ground level cover?
My thinking.....oak is prefered (at least to me) from a habitat and timber value perspective. So I want to promote the oak. As such how I do that will depend on the above questions. If I recall properly norther guys like young aspen re-growth for browse and cover for deer and other critters. I think cutting the aspen would give you more of that aspect. However, if this is going to make this oak stand out like a sore thumb and possibly attract rubbing then I will be more likely to hinge and use the hinged trees as a natural barrier. I also may or may not cut all the aspen. Depending on the situation you may want a few aspen to help drive the oak skyward. Removing all the competition may cause the oak to become "bushy" or even expose it to more wind than it is ready for. I don't have much aspen in my area so even depending on what sort of red-oak you have I may be inclined to even leave some of the aspen just for diversity sake. These are the things that come to my mind if it was my place.
My thinking.....oak is prefered (at least to me) from a habitat and timber value perspective. So I want to promote the oak. As such how I do that will depend on the above questions. If I recall properly norther guys like young aspen re-growth for browse and cover for deer and other critters. I think cutting the aspen would give you more of that aspect. However, if this is going to make this oak stand out like a sore thumb and possibly attract rubbing then I will be more likely to hinge and use the hinged trees as a natural barrier. I also may or may not cut all the aspen. Depending on the situation you may want a few aspen to help drive the oak skyward. Removing all the competition may cause the oak to become "bushy" or even expose it to more wind than it is ready for. I don't have much aspen in my area so even depending on what sort of red-oak you have I may be inclined to even leave some of the aspen just for diversity sake. These are the things that come to my mind if it was my place.
wiscwhip
5 year old buck +
Assuming you have them(since your location is not listed), ask yourself..."Do I like grouse?" I you like having ruffed grouse around your property, keep those aspen stands as long as they are not totally messing with your mast trees. The buds in the upper branches are prime winter food for ruffed grouse throughout their range. That's not to say they don't have other benefits and aren't used by other critters, but grouse is my primary reason for keeping them.
I have 7 smaller groves of aspen (popple) trees on my land. I do like grouse and have a small population of them on my land. I do not hunt the grouse. My aspens are about 25 years old and quite tall. My goal the past two winters has been to clear cut one half of the aspen groves each winter to get a regeneration of younger trees. The aspen also increase the size of their grove with each clear cut provided there is room for them to expand. The cut trees provide a food source for the grouse and deer after they are cut down.
I had a Ruffed Grouse Society director out on my land with a machine to cut down black locust trees. We discussed my aspen groves at this time and came up with the above plan. One of the great things I enjoy is hearing the grouse "drumming'' each spring if I am lucky to be there on the right day.
I had a Ruffed Grouse Society director out on my land with a machine to cut down black locust trees. We discussed my aspen groves at this time and came up with the above plan. One of the great things I enjoy is hearing the grouse "drumming'' each spring if I am lucky to be there on the right day.
Telemark
5 year old buck +
I will go out tomorrow and note the size details you are asking about.
The area is woods, and it needs both browse and cover.
Telemark
5 year old buck +
This place is in Ontario. I have grouse, and I want more grouse. I didn't realize aspen were so important to them. Will smaller trees produce buds if i cut the aspens?
Unfortunately i haven't seen any aspens in groves. They tend to be mixed in among other trees, especially oak and maple
Telemark
5 year old buck +
So if i fell a few of them, it will help the grouse?
I have a pamphlet somewhere on grouse habitat from Minnesota dnr. As I recall,they suggest clear cutting 25% of your aspen every ten years or so depending on your aspen stand age. Cut in 1 to 2 acres blocks scattered through your forest. Grouse need a mixed age aspen forest for best populations. Deer also love this. You need to cleaŕ cut an area so aspen will regenerate.
wiscwhip
5 year old buck +
AS NT stated, there is a lot of information out there for improving aspen for grouse habitat. The pamphlet he mentioned I have seen before and should be somewhere on the MN DNR website. There are also resources on the WI DNR website(as well as other states wildlife agency sites) and The Ruffed Grouse Society has some great resources and links as well. My advice would be to research as much as you can and then get a "plan" in your head that suits your needs and wants as far as deer, grouse, and any other critters on your land are concerned before I started just randomly cutting the aspen. Mixed age stands, as mentioned previously are the best option, how you get that on your place will need some thought and knowledge. Good Luck!
Wild Thing
5 year old buck +
Great input provided by everyone above. One thing you should know is that Aspen, once cut, regenerates itself by root suckering...However, it does this much better if cut during winter. I would not cut them now if you are looking for regen. A few trees can produce hundreds of new ones.
Here are a couple of photos of aspen regen on our property only 3 years after a winter timber harvest. The stand that was cut was largely conifers with some aspen mixed in:
Here are a couple of photos of aspen regen on our property only 3 years after a winter timber harvest. The stand that was cut was largely conifers with some aspen mixed in:
NWWI
5 year old buck +
Be happy you have oaks and aspen. There is very little better for cover than a young stand of aspen for every game animal. Do your research to figure out what you really want. One thing I’ve been taught is if you cut them and have any kind of deer population is go big and overwhelm the deer with browse or they will wipe out a small area quickly. Seed the logging roads in clover and the grouse will flourish.
Bowsnbucks
5 year old buck +
I can offer results I saw first-hand on state game land here in Pa.
2 areas separated by a thin strip of hemlocks and pines were logged. They were mixed aspen, oak and pine. As said above by Wildthing, the root systems of the aspen sent up thousands of whips / saplings and the whole area looked like gray hair from 200 yds. away. Very thick. Deer and grouse moved in there like flies. Deer were browsing the young shoots and using the area for cover. I never saw so much deer sign - rubs everywhere. For 15 years it was a deer magnet, then they got too tall to be in reach for browse or good cover, but the grouse still ate the buds in winter. Periodic cutting is the best tool to manage aspen, in my view. I wish we had more aspen at our camp.
2 areas separated by a thin strip of hemlocks and pines were logged. They were mixed aspen, oak and pine. As said above by Wildthing, the root systems of the aspen sent up thousands of whips / saplings and the whole area looked like gray hair from 200 yds. away. Very thick. Deer and grouse moved in there like flies. Deer were browsing the young shoots and using the area for cover. I never saw so much deer sign - rubs everywhere. For 15 years it was a deer magnet, then they got too tall to be in reach for browse or good cover, but the grouse still ate the buds in winter. Periodic cutting is the best tool to manage aspen, in my view. I wish we had more aspen at our camp.
Wildthing, I observed similar results when I did my clear cuts of aspen groves in the winter. My trees had reached the age and height where a winter clear cut of them was the best management option. I did not get to the second batch of clear cuts this winter, which is okay by me. By staggering the cuts, it will give me a slightly different age structure of my groves when I do cut them this winter.
My aspen areas are not huge, some being only 1/4 to 1/2 acre in size. I do consider myself lucky to have them at all on my land as it is mostly an oak/cherry mix of hardwoods other than the pines I have planted. This is my second go round on clear cuts of aspens with the last one being about 25 years ago.
My aspen areas are not huge, some being only 1/4 to 1/2 acre in size. I do consider myself lucky to have them at all on my land as it is mostly an oak/cherry mix of hardwoods other than the pines I have planted. This is my second go round on clear cuts of aspens with the last one being about 25 years ago.
Wild Thing
5 year old buck +
You've got the right idea JFK. Stagger the cuttings every 5-10 years and you can have multiple aged stands indefinitely.
S.T.Fanatic
5 year old buck +
The most attractive "food plot" was one that took me a couple of years to clear and plant. I think it got the most use the year before I planted it. It grew up in black berry and had tons of little browse trees shoot up. Everything was browsed. FF to today. The soil in the plot sucks, I can only get a decent crop on half the plot, and It seems as if the utilization is about the same as it was before I planted anything.
Telemark
5 year old buck +
Thanks for all the info. I had no idea they were so useful to the wildlife.
I did a bit more searching today and found a grove of about 20 trees (4"-12" DBH) mixed in with cedar, birch, ash, and basswood. I will cut everything out around the aspens and cut down two or three of them down to see if i get regeneration. winter isn't really an option for me this year, but I could cut a few down after deer season next time i hunt here. Or maybe i could get a friend to cut a few down this winter.
The other aspens are about 5-8 inches in diameter and spread out among mostly maple and oak. I don't mind sacrificing a few of the smaller oaks if it means i can grow more aspen. I need a few skinny oak trees anyway to start my mushroom farm.
I did a bit more searching today and found a grove of about 20 trees (4"-12" DBH) mixed in with cedar, birch, ash, and basswood. I will cut everything out around the aspens and cut down two or three of them down to see if i get regeneration. winter isn't really an option for me this year, but I could cut a few down after deer season next time i hunt here. Or maybe i could get a friend to cut a few down this winter.
The other aspens are about 5-8 inches in diameter and spread out among mostly maple and oak. I don't mind sacrificing a few of the smaller oaks if it means i can grow more aspen. I need a few skinny oak trees anyway to start my mushroom farm.
Do you have white cedar?I would leave them uncut as they are great thermal cover and browse in the winter. Cutting the aspens,basswood,ash,etc would be great browse with the cedar as thermal cover. They also reducè snow cover at ground level. Conifers boughs can hold a lot of snow and a lot of it can evaporate on bright sunny days,never making it to the ground.
Telemark
5 year old buck +
I have a massive patch of white cedar, but the deer don't seem to yard up in it. The cedars I plan to cut are interspersed with deciduous trees and don't have any green growth within 20 feet of the ground. I can put up a map a bit later. It's a big piece of property, with some decent diversity.
