4wanderingeyes
5 year old buck +
With me, when planting radish and turnips, this is a good thing! I always plant to heavy, but when planting BOB seed, it seems to work out better, and I get bigger plants. Funny how less is more!
This is Why BOB Seed Companies Get a Bad Rap
- Thread starter Tree Spud
- Start date
With me, when planting radish and turnips, this is a good thing! I always plant to heavy, but when planting BOB seed, it seems to work out better, and I get bigger plants. Funny how less is more!
j-bird
Moderator
I just like knowing exactly what I am paying for if I can. I also prefer to help the local guy as well. If I buy 5 lbs of clover seed....I expect 5 pounds of seed....the coating/innoculant may be extra, but at least I know. For brassica there isn't any coating that I am aware of that would be "needed".....They don't require an innoculant....like clovers or peas can. I typically just plant cow food for the deer any way....living in ag country like I do...it's not a deal breaker. Deer go hungry here....it's their own fault!
I buy seed at the River Country Co-op on X across from the sewage treatment plant. Last year the WR bag said Elk Mound Seed on it.
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yoderjac
5 year old buck +
Actually, that is more is more...more sun, more nutrients, more water on a per plant basis. I find getting seeding rates right can be a challenge, and it can be unique to your situation. BOB companies tend to get rates in the right general ball park, but what works well in one situation may not work in another.
In general, BOB seed fills a niche. For folks who are planting tiny areas, the cost of seed is insignificant. The convenience of BOB seed, especially a mix, can be less expensive. Even with the right conditions, as seed ages the germination rates drop. So, buying seed in 50 lb bags and mixing it themselves is problematic. Even if you have the facilities to store the see properly, the seeding rates change from year to year. Some seed stores better than others. So, if you are planting a tiny amount of ground just for attraction and you find a BOB mix that works well for you, why not.
That is not to say the BOB mixes don't have big issues. The obvious one is hit in this thread, the cost on a per pound basis which really adds up of you are planting significant land for QDM purposes. Another is that most BOB seed is sold nationally or at least regionally. So, some seed in the mix may not even grow in your location and with your soils or perform very poorly. Not all BOB seed companies are created equal. Some simply charge you more per pound and are up front about it. Others play games like advertising a particular crop in the mix that is a high quality, high cost seed. When you look a the fine print on the seed tag, you find that only a tiny percentage of the seed in the mix is that seed, and most if the seed in the bag is a very inexpensive filler seed. This takes the cost/pound of your desired seed from very high to ridiculous. A third thing I've seen some companies do is to change the contents of their mix from year to year base on seed prices. The bag looks the same, the SuperMosnsterMegabuck mix name is the same. Unless folks are seasoned enough to look at the seed tag, they wouldn't know they are buying a different mix than they bought last year.
The bottom line is this:
BOB seed mixes are expensive on a per pound basis and have a number of issues, but fill an important niche in the market. Whether you use them or not, the more you know....the better you grow!
Thanks,
Jack
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Bassattackr
5 year old buck +
Agreed, no need to use BOB products, they don't do anything more for me. I do use them on occasion however if I find the exact mix I'm looking for. Otherwise, I prefer to buy or mix my own. No harm in going either direction.
cavey
5 year old buck +
Elk Mound seed up here is pretty decent but nothing can beat bin run seed - trick is finding someone who will sell you it, bin run round up ready soybeans is the bomb as well. I have gotten a pickup truck load of WR dump in for $25 bucks before - that was a good year. Used to be able to get bin run oats cheap but thats not as commonly planted anymore
cavey
5 year old buck +
ps... if you know a crop farmer thats hauling out contracts - not a bad time to work a cash or beer price out and follow in behind one of their trucks loading out. Not so much of a time hassle to them at that time. Same if they are taking it off the field and its dry enough. The combine can dump direct into your truck
roymunson
5 year old buck +
I learned that particularly when I bought folding saws to cut limbs and shooting lanes. The bushnell versions were plastic, cheap, and crappy, go into lowes in the garden section and get a better saw for about 1/2 price.
Hunters get marketed to just like fishermen. Have to differentiate what is and what isn't worth it.
Bill
Administrator
still didn’t do good. Pay “a lot” for a silky saw and love it forever.
And it’s half the work cutting stuff.
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roymunson
5 year old buck +
don't do that to me... Now I've gotta go shopping.still didn’t do good. Pay “a lot” for a silky saw and love it forever.
And it’s half the work cutting stuff.
Bill
Administrator
doesn’t fold but it’s a nice hand saw.
Silky Zubat Professional Arborist Edition Saw
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scott44
5 year old buck +
Get an extra blade too, blades last a long while but just in case.doesn’t fold but it’s a nice hand saw.
Silky Zubat Professional Arborist Edition Saw
The New Zubat Professional Arborist Edition cuts on average 15-20% faster than a standard Silky Zubat (Product # 27033). This improved cutting efficiency results from Silky increasing the tooth size from 6.4 teeth per Inch (TPI) to 4.7 TPI. That means fewer strokes and less fatigue - your...www.amleo.com
tynimiller
5 year old buck +
I use a combination at my place. It takes me an incredibly long time to trust a company however, and for years I searched and used multiple - BUT we also always go to our local seed ag store and buy bushels of Cereal Rye and Forage Oats and sometimes grab some PTT or Radishes as well.
Having discussed and even gotten to know some of the guys behind some high quality seed companies (would be considered BOB) there is something to be said for the few that commit to ensuring quality over profit margins. A TON of crap out on the market is laced with unnecessary levels of coatings...insane levels of inert matter and don't get me started on ryegrass included. However, for a guy that wants a mix especially, if they do their research or ask enough questions on places like here or to some companies BOB mixes that are high quality are PERFECT for the guys planting acre or so at most plots.
By doing so they get the ratio they want of seed. They get fresh high quality, should be well tested seed germination wise and no wasted filler seed that their paying for despite not wanting to.
That is just a small way they fill a niche in a way that I don't think is a bad thing.
However, where some truly shine is in items like corn and soybeans. The amount of testing some of these companies go through and continued testing to enhance qualities or traits as best they can is incredible if you get blessed to meet some of the guys that do this part of the things.
I encourage guys first to go to local seed stores if they have the knowledge to build their own, put the cost savings into fertilizer or another stand.....or trust a reputable company with high quality mixes (read the tags!!!).
SD51555
5 year old buck +
I'm replacing my first silky after about 7 years. I'm not throwing out the first one, just trying a second one to see if it cuts easier new. That first one has done an insane amount of work. It deserves a posh retirement mounted on the cabin wall.still didn’t do good. Pay “a lot” for a silky saw and love it forever.
And it’s half the work cutting stuff.
yoderjac
5 year old buck +
I agree with about 90% of that. The exception is on corn and beans. Deer are attracted to corn, especially as we go into winter, because of the high carb content and sugars. They need carbs going into winter. This is even more true the further north you go as winters become the primary stress period. This is true of about any corn you buy. It is more important to plant corn that has the right maturity for your area than other characteristics. The other attractive thing about corn to deer is food in cover. They can get good nutritional food without exposing themselves in standing corn.
Soybeans come in two basic types, ag beans and forage beans. Forage beans put most of their energy into forage growth and are great for areas where summer is the major stress period. Because most of their energy is directed into forage, they resist browsing pressure more than ag beans. Ag beans put more energy into pod production which can be more important in the north where pods are an important winter food source. All soybeans have great nutritional benefit in the summer. Again, the most important thing is choosing beans that are well suited for your situation. Choosing the right type for your area and conditions is important.
Most of the testing is done by seed production companies for farmers, not the BOB companies that package and re-sell them. The seed production companies develop seed with certain characteristics for farmers and test and rate them for things like shatter resistance. Most BOB companies simply select the characteristics they think will benefit deer and market them to food plotters.
Again, if you are only planting an acre or two, the only thing that really matters is attraction as you don't have scale to impact the herd. There are many more factors than the specific mix that are more important for attraction. The best reason to buy BOB seed from a sound company is the convenience.
Thanks,
Jack
tynimiller
5 year old buck +
@yoderjac I don't disagree, and I don't believe I stated anything contrary to what you described. I merely touched on it is more evident however, when you get into some companies that their beans or their corn when tissue samplings are conducted illustrate "better" (if one feels the attribute a positive) results in certain things. Oil content or fat content being of course on pivotal one in the winter months of stress as you discussed.
You are right though, most seed companies merely buy whatever they can get their hands on, slap an image on the packaging and roll...however I know at least 3 companies that do testing themselves and/or in direct connection with the seed production companies.
Your last paragraph is so incredibly true!!!
You are right though, most seed companies merely buy whatever they can get their hands on, slap an image on the packaging and roll...however I know at least 3 companies that do testing themselves and/or in direct connection with the seed production companies.
Your last paragraph is so incredibly true!!!
4wanderingeyes
5 year old buck +
Dont hold back, share your secret top notch BOB seed companies with the rest of us. I am one of the small food plotters that do use a mix from BOB bags. But I also look at the ingredients hard to see what is all in it. I dont do research on what quality the seed is, and if there is someone that has, I think that is useful information we could all benefit from.
tynimiller
5 year old buck +
I hate stating companies as so many then begin to rip one to shreds or accuse someone as having their opinion paid for. I will stress I get ZERO money from any one of these companies. I do not use all of these companies HOWEVER I do place them as the top of the heap when it comes to quality:
Grandpa Ray's
RealWorld
Drop-Tine Seed
I will say no further, as where I lean for various reasons would get into personal opinions and such.
