Sacrifice Short Term for Future Gains?

[trampledbyturtles]

As land managers I often ponder this question.

With all the projects an improvements we seek to achieve.
Could our efforts be impacting our season goals?

Example:
I planted 5 Hazels in an area that needed some attention, next spring plans include adding 10 more shrubs in the same general area for browse. These 5 plants are a little further off the trail so I have to walk 5 gallon pails of water to them when needed. The plan is to water them for the first 2 yrs. then after that they are on their own. Stopping all watering a month before season starts. Ideally I would like to stop sooner. But the past few years have been unseasonably hot in Sept Oct, unless of course we get timely fall rains.

-By adding these shrubs I will increase the draw of an already semi-popular staging area right to the north of a prime bedding zone.
-accordingly it opened my eyes to a new tree I found that I can hang a stand that allows for a SE wind.

The downfall
The area is only 50 yards west of where I stuck my biggest buck to date. That stand requires strictly a SW wind to hunt.

So in hindsight, I am walking almost directly on top of the trails the deer use daily on the Northern edge of the property (160A).

Will this impact this season and the few years after sightings in this core area? Not sure but I will be finding out cause the area is just to well positioned not to make a few key enhancements.

Maybe my approach is different to management than some not sure. But when I show up to work. I don't try to hide the fact that I am there. No scent prevent, just walk in do what I need to get the job done an get out.

Still getting pics off the trail cams in the immediate area. But most are of yearling bucks or less and does an fawns. Noticeably a bachelor group of three bucks has not been photographed since the third week the hazel project got under way.

Could site a few more examples, but I digress

Thoughts?

Edit: And there will be a lot of trees that have to get watered over the next couple of years. So slowing down or limiting access will not be an option for awhile.

 

[4wanderingeyes]

I am not sure about huge bucks, because I haven't had many around in the past couple years, but I will tell you that I can take my 3 dogs in the woods with me, and have them with me as I am working my food plots, and I leave the food plot, and less then an hour later I have deer, including bachelor bucks checking out the same area I was just in. They don't seem to mind my scent, or my dogs. In my experience, if you want to see what deer are in the area, drop a few trees, and put a camera over the area, I usually have several deer all day long and night checking on the area for weeks.


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[j-bird]

I will say your activity level will affect the deer....how much and which ones is tough to tell. I like you work in the woods and make no secrete of it and I also have dogs that run with me as well. This doesn't seem to have much of an affect on the does and younger bucks. I don't house older bucks and maybe that is why, but come the rut if the does are there the bucks will be as well. I do know that I look at my habitat efforts more now with a focus on how to hunt them or get to stand locations without bumping the deer. I used to put stuff where it was easy or I had a spot.....sometimes that doesn't work out so well. I also try to limit my "in the woods" projects to after season closes and before the summer heat kicks in. After that I pretty much stay out of the "woods". I live on my place and I swear the deer know my scent vs my son or other hunters. I can't prove that, but I tend to have far more success on my place than others and we all hunt the same stands. I do try to always hunt the wind when hunting and regardless of if they work or not try to use scent containment measures while hunting as well.

 

[yoderjac]

Absolutely! We made a huge sacrifice when we thinned our pines, put in firebreaks, clear-cut some hardwood sections, and executed controlled burns. We had a significant increase in human activity and deer lost about 20 acres of acorns that were a fall attractant. That clearly disrupted deer on our place including making mature bucks even more nocturnal than they already are. It was also a big impediment to hunting. Years of information collected patterning deer went out the window as large scale changes in the habitat changed how deer relate to our property. Deer are also going to be harder to hunt simply because they will have food-in-cover for a number of years. Deer will have less necessity to use food plots as native foods in cover become more plentiful. They will have more options for bedding and lest distinct movement patterns between bedding and food.

In the long-term, our property will support more and healthier deer over time. Bedding cover on adjacent properties will become less attractive over time as our bedding becomes more attractive. Deer will have less reason to leave our land and be shot elsewhere.

While there are clearly negative short-term impacts on hunting, I'd trade those for the long-term benefits again in a heartbeat!

Thanks,

Jack

 

[Boll Weevil]

We tend to have spikes in activity vs. steady traffic/intrusion. It's more often that we have several work days in a row where there's disturbance in a given area and then it's quiet again for awhile. As well being a rowcrop operation, the deer are somewhat accustomed to equipment so that's not a big deal.

Sometimes large projects will force a big change in pattern but once the project is over and everything quiets down they revert right back to their old ways. Last summer we opened up a new field way back in the timber with several weeks worth of dozer and excavator work. Trucks coming and going, ATVs, burning huge brush piles, and smoke that lingered in the bottom for days and days most definitely impacted the critters. By September though everything was done...I drilled winter wheat and hung a pair of cams on either end of the field. Within days deer and turkeys were right back in there.

 

[Ben.MN/WI]

I'm not sure if just planting 5 shrubs this year and 10 next year will significantly improve your hunting in the long run, so I would leave them alone and hope for the best. If you typically hunt that area during the rut it probably won't hurt your hunting either way though, but watering trees in late summer could change your early season bowhunting there.

I'm more concerned about long term improvements as well, but if there's a way to get the same results with a lower impact close to hunting season that is generally the route I pick when possible. You might be better off getting a couple hundred bare root seedlings from the DNR for $0.50 each and plant them in early spring and then leave the area alone.

 

[trampledbyturtles]

Most observations in replys an my own experiences seem to overlap.

In some regard we all agree that a certain level of intrusion will spook deer.
But how far an long varies in the undergoing operation.
I have had groups of pheasant hunters out for opening day (oct 18), walking upwards of over 40% of the cover. While still capturing photos of mature deer, less than 8hrs after departure. Would it affect archery hunting. Im sure it does but do not know for certain. Cause after a disturbance, I tend to let things settle down for a period of time.

I guess one of my only concerns was. That with an increase in frequency of use (habitat projects). Am I causing mature deer to leave the property for extended periods of time during the summer months (And is this even a bad thing?). Moving them upwards of over half a mile over to the adjacent farmers windbreaks (an I mean shelterbelts cause we don't have what most call woods here) in the middle of a corn field. That sees zero human activity all summer long. While at the same time being surrounded by a virtual jungle of standing corn. Creating thicker cover at that specific time that I could ever hope to recreate, outside of my cattails that typically have water in them this time of year.

I guess in the grand scheme of things. Im hoping that these early disturbances are not enough of a deal breaker. To push mature deer off a property for the long haul. And that by the time the corn starts dropping and the deck gets reshuffled. The bruisers come back home.



Ben.MN/WI
A few ?s an thoughts
So you don't believe adding a couple of desired browsing species in an opening dominated by smooth broom. Would help the area became a draw or focal point? Area is about half an Acre.

In my mind. They are not meant to dominate the landscape. But alternately create a spot of interest. Something different only located in one area.
They are not meant to be species specific. But if the hazel, elderberries and cranberries help some prairie song birds, or pheasants, or a few squirrels an rabbits out, and at the same time increase diversity an improve habitat. Then Im all for it.

And as far as mass bare root plantings. I do use that technique to fill in larger gaps in the habitat. Willows for example work well to fill in low spots in my perimeter windbreaks in the low drowned out spots. Typically these will evade much of the heavy browsing and have a chance of survival.

But in the instance of the 15 shrubs, I am hoping for quality over quantity. They will all be caged for three years with weed mats an mulch and watered two years to try an increase the chances they survive to maturity while getting their faster.

Wrong or right I do not know,
What I do know is I watched my father try to manage from a distance over the years. And with specific projects that never seemed to turn out the best. Crabs, apples, plums, chokeberries, oaks and cottonwoods that have been left to their own defenses. Haven't fared the best. So I am trying things in a slightly different approach.

Only time will tell.

 

[Ben.MN/WI]

I didn't initially realize you were from South Dakota. A small number of shrubs there would be more helpful than other places, but I still don't think 5-15 shrubs will have a huge impact on a 1/2 acre site. But I completely agree though that 5-15 shrubs would be better than 0 shrubs. If you've tried planting lots of trees and let them fend for themselves without much success, your plan is the next step. Maybe to give you the most bang for your buck, you could look at caging shrub species that will naturally eventually spread on their own. Specifically I'm thinking of wild plum since I know they are natural to your area and wildlife loves them. If you had a dozen of them caged and watered for a couple years, you would have a great main tree that would eventually send out underground runners and form a much larger thicket. I could see that becoming a major draw.

Any time I've hunted out west in open areas with lots of dry ground and grasslands those random plum thickets were great areas to find all kinds of wildlife.

 

[H20fwler]

I think it will impact the deer in the area some, a lot of it depends on if deer are used to a little human traffic. Deer are very adaptable animals and they seem to sence the difference between danger and a guy working. I have always been a firm believer in minimal disturbance but some things you just have to get done.
By planting you are improving your habitat and that will pay future rewards.

Last fall right in the middle of our deer gun season I came home for lunch real quick and had a box of pear trees from Wildlife Group on the porch. I looked at the weather forcast and the weather was due to freeze hard, so I gave up the afternoon of hunting to get the trees in right and don't regret it one bit. The trees are thriving this year and I am reminded every time I see them about the afternoon planting while everyone was driving by in orange and the warden stopping by to talk with me about how I was developing my place and how nice he thought it was turning out.

A tip for hauling your water; you aren't hauling a lot so would lids on your buckets or gallon jugs work with a wheeelbarrow? I have hauled a crazy amount of water to trees that way.

Also if you can order your trees to be delivered mid March so you can catch the thaw and spring rains.

 

[Mortenson]

I dropped some fruit trees right on top of my best go-to spot this year, and I'll add more next year. I weighed all the pros and cons similarly to you. The spot has seclusion going for it, so I just ride the atv in, take care of business, and ride out. I'll probably change the patterns of a few deer no doubt, but so be it. Most deer will adjust. My goal is to improve the property and habitat for my kids for when they become hunting age. Totally worth the trade off in my opinion.

 

[trampledbyturtles]

H20fwler-
Ya, this next year I am shooting for an earlier planting date. Got em in May 15th this year. Little later than I would have liked, but that is the way things fell work wise.

And thanks for the tips on the water.
Currently I'm running a 250gal shuttle that I fill to 200gal. This allows me at least 5 gallons per tree. 10 new apples, 10 apples from previous yrs, 6 new oaks, my hazles, and if really dry I hit the mass willow planting just to help them through this first year. Going to have to get a second shuttle an trailer next year for the increased work load. Plan on needing 390gal per trip at the moment. That will leave a little room for flexibility if the plans change to try an squeeze in a few more. Tell ya what though, a guy starts to feel it after schlepin 40 pails of water. Not really looking forward to 80 next year. Open to ideas!

Ben.MN/WI-
I was planning on trying the bunching idea this next spring with Redosier Dogwoods.
Was thinking 3-4 per 5ft diameter cage, 16 total cages. In about a half acre location that recently had a nice stand of young cottonwoods drown out.
Think over time they would stand a chance of forming a decently dense thicket?
Or does this species not like to be spaced that close together?

 

[Ben.MN/WI]

Red osier dogwoods are great for wet areas and the deer love to browse them. You can help a thicket form by letting them grow in the cages for a couple years and then take off the cage and bend over one of the 6-8' tall branches/shoots. Keep the shoot connected to the main plant and throw a shovel full of dirt on the end of the shoot. The ROD will form roots there where it touches the dirt and will send new growth up from there. You can cage that new growth for a couple years and repeat. That will help expedite the ROD expansion.

I would also recommend spraying next year's planting locations so you can reduce the competition around the shrubs. I think that would be especially important in prairie areas where things can get pretty dry.

 

[Knehrke]

It depends so much on your location...suburban bucks or deep woods? If there's routine incursions, then the deer likely get used to it, but putting up stands a week before season in an area that doesn't get traveled is a sure way to drive off mature bucks. The truly big boys are probably only killable a couple days a year anyway, and they're so hard to pattern...and I get more pleasure from being able to work the woods all year...I take my chances. In general, once bow season starts I'm not out there working, but since that's Oct 1st in my area, I'm planting right up until then. I'm lucky enough to be in a travel corridor between a 700 acre park and a large swamp, so we see some traffic once the rut kicks in.

 

[trampledbyturtles]

Well, not sure about long term, but short term impact so far has been negligible.

Pulled trail cams last night and reviewed this morning. The bachelor group has resurfaced. And a dandy has decided to sink his roots, have him multiple times in a tight core area. Setting July 31 end date for all major projects. With maybe 1 or 2 watering trips post July if things get really dry.