natural light vs flourescent - Transferred from QDMA Forums

[yoderjac]

Just curious on whats the better route for my scenario. I grow two rootmaker express trays of trees at a time on the floor near a decently large south facing window. Last year I had a flourescent t8 light setup on a timer above them for 16 hrs a day plus the window. This year I havnt used the light at all yet and just use the sunlight coming through the window. They still seem to be growing good. Should I add the light or is it pointless when using window light even though its way less hours per day? This is sawtooth,bur, and shubur trees with a fan blowing sideways at them for one hour a day and an overhead ceiling fan on high all day/night.

Might give them 6 to 8 hours of flor' light in addition to the window's sunlight. Would be a reduction in electrical use but much better on cloudy overcast days.
Growth will be better with some extra light IMO.
Just trying to point out you have other choices.
Good luck.
WBP

I do the exact same thing. My RM are by a large south facing bay window but they also get 18 hours of artificial lighting. I also have some seedlings that just get sunlight and no artificial light. I feel like I get better growth on the ones that get 18hrs of artificial light also.

If they're doing alright as of now, I think they'll be fine. It certainly wouldn't hurt to give them a few extra hours . My biggest concern would be making sure that they don't start leaning too heavily towards the window.

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Originally Posted by nebraskaz71
Just curious on whats the better route for my scenario. I grow two rootmaker express trays of trees at a time on the floor near a decently large south facing window. Last year I had a flourescent t8 light setup on a timer above them for 16 hrs a day plus the window. This year I havnt used the light at all yet and just use the sunlight coming through the window. They still seem to be growing good. Should I add the light or is it pointless when using window light even though its way less hours per day? This is sawtooth,bur, and shubur trees with a fan blowing sideways at them for one hour a day and an overhead ceiling fan on high all day/night.
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The natural sunlight won't hurt but it is insufficient. Look at #4 in Dr. Whitcomb's paper: <http://www.rootmaker.com/docs/GrowingTreeSeedlings.pdf Placing them indoors near a south facing window is a feeble attempt to essentially put them in an outdoor greenhouse.
A friend just sent me some pictures of pawpaws he tried to start in a greenhouse using rootmaker cells this way:

They looked &quot;ok&quot; above ground except that they were lanky as the paper indicates. Now look below ground....

That is a pretty poor root system coming from a rootmaker cell. Now compare that to one of mine:

I did not get the tap measure close enough to the plant for a good reference, but here are the numbers. The tree is only 6&quot; above the top of the cell. It has 13 leaves on it (some of them still small). The tip to tip measurement from the largest leaf on the left to the largest leaf on the right is 15&quot;.
These were planted in the cells in mid-October. It took them about a month to germinate. Whitcomb germinates his seeds in flats, so when he says to transplant them from the cells in 12 to 16 weeks I presume he means 12-16 weeks after germination. Given that, the middle of February will be 12 weeks. I plan to transplant one then and see if it is too early. I'll try to remember to take a picture of the root ball when I do transplant.
I had planned to put the picture of mine on Dogdoc's pawpaw thread, but I think the difference between the pictures illustrates the importance of artificial lights. That is not to say that placing them near a south facing window is not a good idea. Just don't think that in any way substitutes for the artificial lights.
Just to let you know the setup these are growing in, I have 3 fluorescent 2 bulb fixtures that are 4' long. I hang them so the bulbs are about 2&quot;-3&quot; from the top of the seedlings. There is no natural light available for these.
Thanks,
Jack

Yep, the low winter sun lacking intensity will only leave trees longing for more, literally, growing tall a spindly, weak and destined for failure.
G

Good to know, must be why some of these sawtooths got 8&quot; or so before barely putting out leaves. Light has now been put on them set for 16 hrs! It's been 3-4weeks since they put out a radicle, spose not having a light on them hurt already?

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Originally Posted by nebraskaz71
Good to know, must be why some of these sawtooths got 8&quot; or so before barely putting out leaves. Light has now been put on them set for 16 hrs! It's been 3-4weeks since they put out a radicle, spose not having a light on them hurt already?
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they will be fine.

I decided to transplant my first pawpaw today. Here is the root ball from the cell inverted after extraction:

I'm didn't wash away the mix, but this looks like a very typical root ball coming from a cell a little on the early side. None of the mix fell away when I extracted it. That generally means the roots are dense enough to hold everything together.
Compare this to the previous picture of the pawpaw root ball grown in a greenhouse without artificial light in the winter.
Here is the transplanted seedling so you can compare the top growth:

Thanks,
Jack

Looks good! Good to know

good looking baby pawpaw. Mine are dormant right now.

 

[yoderjac]

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