Misplaced Orchard

[swampbuck]

Not sure if this is the place to post this but thought I could consolidate my orchard questions in one spot and provide some updates as I go.

First thing I recently bought a piece of property primarily for deer hunting. We are relatively low and in southern Wisconsin I am sure there will be some/a lot of frustrating production years. I initially found 3 apple trees when I first purchased the piece and then went off thr deep end. The trees are not planted in an ideal location. After owning the place for a year I found 3 more apple trees that were buried underneath the canopy.

Since then I have pruned the original trees and all have produced some apples now after only producing a handful of apples prior to that. I have no idea what kind of apple they are but they are tasty and mostly drop by early October.

Since then despite a lot of research I have added probably 25-30 apples, crabapples, pears, and persimmons. I will be entering year 3 this next year for some of the apples, crabs, and pears i planted. Most of the apples and crabs are bareroot trees i bought on sale from fleet farm. Not sure what to expect from those but other than one I didn't put screen around they have all made it and some have put on some nice growth with very little care.

I also added 4 pears from Blue Hill this spring (sweet advent and hunters deer pear) to supplement 2 kieffers i ordered from arbor day. I also threw in a couple of persimmons from Blue Hill to see if I could get them to take. Persimmons are not common in my area and to be honest I couldn't even identify one if I had to.

Anyway I'll add a few more details as I move into the offseason and start thinking about what I will add in the future. I know its early yet in my journey and am sure lots to learn, including the challenges of planting them where I planted them, but its my only option and I am stubborn and want fruit trees.

 

[buckdeer1]

I have probably 65 fruit trees and I too planted some in wrong spots over the years.Most can be moved until they get too big.I found a guy that I just paid by the hour that has a 48 spade and he has moved quite a few oaks,fruit trees. and cedars. I have a 32 inch spade and move smaller trees every year. I will agree fruit trees are fun i have some from 20 years ago to a few months ago.I will say they put off alot of food but alot of times it's all at once. I would check with nurseries many of which are mentioned on this site. Plant various drop time and various fruits. Also hard mast such as chestnuts.I would say the biggest things I learned was to think ahead and space far enough apart,plant where you want for when they get bigger,buy disease resistant trees,and protect them with cages and tubes. I use tubes on hardwoods and cages on fruit trees.Check with your state forestry for other shrubs and trees as they usually sell cheaper than nurseries.

 

[hunts_with_stick]

Agreed, I planted 30-40 so far, over the past 4 years. Thankfully I was forced to plant them in the right place simply due to the layout of my property. I have planted various drop times, from sept-November with some carrying into winter. Unfortunately I don’t have much to add, other than I won’t plant any cedars due to CAR. I also protect mine with cages and wire screen around the trunk to keep from getting girdled. No bear issues in Ohio so I don’t have to worry about that.

 

[hunts_with_stick]

Someone on here told me planting fruit trees can be addictive, they were right. I don’t need anymore but yet I find myself thinking “humm, I can plant a bunch of trees here and there, etc…,”

 

[TreeDaddy]

It is absolutely addictive

two rules: 1) keep plantin' 2) no complainin'

bill

 

[swampbuck]

All good stuff so far.

My particular orchard like i mentioned is in a low spot because that is where the original trees are planted and because most of the property is low. I expect late frost will cause issues but I have had apples the fir two years now so its possible to get some fruit.

The shape is turning into a reverse C, partially for hunting purposes. The soil is sandy with low CEC. The soil test shows i have high phosphorus and low potassium so will have to think about that if/when fertilizing.

So far I have not sprayed the trees although I have used glyphosate and clethodim to kill grass around the trees in order to try to establish some clover around the trees. That has been an adventure and a lesson when dealing with grasses that going light on the front end has just ended with more spraying.

On top of the 6 existing apples that were there I have added the following trees.

Fleet Farm Crabs on m7

Whitney Crab
Fireside Apple
Chestnut crab (3)

Willis crabapple seedlings

Transcendent crab
Dolgo (3)
American crab

Jungs

Enterprise on M7
wolf river on standard

Blue Hill

Sweer Advent Pear (2)
Hunters deer pear (2)
Tsukis persimmon
Tin cupHopefully.

I also added 3 wild apples . I left one uncaged and well that one the deer found right away but the other two are doing ok.

I tried to consider disease resistance and drop time in the varieties I selected although I have to admit a $10-15 bareroot tree at Jungs or Fleet Farm is hard to pass and I am willing to see what happens with them.

The blue hills order though i noticed that the trees were much better developed than some of the bargain trees i have purchased. Those have only been in the ground for one year.

I am very interested to see if I can get the persimmons to take . I have been interested in their late bloom times which should help me with where I am at. I tried some persimmons from gurney last year and they were underwhelming, but everything i have gotten from them has been that way.

Next summer I'll be interest to see how some of the trees do being they should be in their leap year...hopefully.

 

[Bowsnbucks]

I can add a few things to maybe help you on fruit trees.
1 - They need lots of sun to produce well.
2 - Plant DR (disease-resistant) varieties.
3 - Cage them, and also wrap the trunks loosely - not tight - with aluminum window screen. (helps keep mice & voles from girdling = dead trees)
4 - Fruit trees grow best on gentle, south-sloping locations. (for the most sun)
5 - Try not to plant in low areas - "frost pockets" - cold air sinks = heavy frost kills.
6 - Read online info about choices of rootstocks, and how they determine the size trees you'll end up with, as well as anchorage in the soil. (Full-sized trees vs. dwarf or semi-dwarf, and also how sturdy-rooted your trees will be in certain soil types.) Mich. State, Purdue, Penn State, U. Minn., U. Illinois, Cornell U., Rutgers are all heavily into fruit tree programs. Good sources of info.
7 - Read the sticky on the top of this fruit tree thread "Fruit Tree Guide" by Buckvelvet. Lots of info there.

There are several great nurseries to buy trees from. You mentioned Blue Hill - our camp has planted a number of trees from BH and they are growing great. I know the owner and he runs a top-notch nursery. Very serious about his stock. He grafts onto full-sized rootstocks, so you'll end up with big trees. I'm not affiliated with Blue Hill, but I'm happy with what we've planted from him. Look up Turkey Creek on this forum - he has a great reputation for very good trees.

 

[bigboreblr]

Tons of great advice on here. Low CEC, ammend lightly and amend often. I mix triple 15, 6-24-24, and potash (0-0-42?). Since your phosphorus is high, I'd blend some triple 15 and potash if you can find it. Alot of maintenance ferftilizer blends for apples are 5-8-12 relative ratio'd.

The more important thing is the pH. Light doses maybe twice a year. I got low CEC sandy soil at camp, but have trouble visiting all the spots. I mix my fertilizer with pelletized lime and try in April then in June. My pH is even as bad as high 4's in some spots.

Impatient? M7 grows fast. Got like 4ft of growth on one with Sundance on it. Try a few other's for your soil. M111, g890, P18, dolgo, anontovka, or P18 are all good choices. Think B118 was meant for sandy soil, P18 good for low pH, dolgo works good in sand too. Probably dolgo roots are the most preferred by folks on here. Give them a little room,especially if you bow hunt up from a treestand.

Stick with as many as you can take care of well and have a good place for.

Clover is nice for nitrogen, but can attract voles / field mice a bit more. Also, if you spray insecticide someday, the bees will be on that clover all growing season. I stopped seeding clover at home for that reason. At home trees get Malathion and sometimes imidan or sevin (carbyl) during the year. Maybe 3-4 sprays. Camp maybe once a year if things line up well time wise.


Kerr, Liberty, and maybe some more crabapples. The more edible trees should be closer to camp, crabapples more out back. Some guys don't like going out back during apple season. Probably could of killed a doe with a rock and hour ago in my driveway. Give them good enough place to be, you'll have trouble keeping them away......

Turkey Creek is a very good place to buy bare roots. Never bought from bluehill or Midwest deer, but heard tons of good things about their quality, the rootstock used, and the varieties they sell.

 

[bigboreblr]

The varieties and rootstock from Jung's and Fleet are just fine. I'd buy those, I'd probably buy more than one of them too if you see them again. fireside crab I am not familiar with.

If I don't have a lot of new varieties to graft this year, I will be using my chestnut for a few pieces to graft.

My main regrets is buying unknown rootstock trees. Wonder if they're going to get bigger, or will have problems in my heavier clay at home. Not a major regret, but wished I tried some more rootstock varieties at camp. got a lot of antonovka rootstock, wish I had more examples on Siberian or dolgo. I bought some from saint Lawrence nurseries, most are anty, but some of their crabs are on siberian. Only got about 3 or 4 years into this, but it'll take a few more years to see how things go. MY problem at camp will more be the pH than the sand. More I learn about weeds n food plot plants, the more I see pH issues over there. Get the pH good, and a lot of issues go away with soil.