Fireblight OR damage from 32 degrees?

[WTNUT]

I am attaching photos of some trees that I took yesterday. This damage just showed up within the last week. It is in three different small orchards that are 300 yards apart. I did have a pear tree with fireblight in one of the orchards. The orchards have trees ranging in age from 10 plus years to second leaf trees. All of the mature trees (10 year trees) displayed damage similar to that in photos. None of the younger trees show damage. The only exception is that I did top graft a couple of trees and the scions were doing great. Now the leaves are gone.

Within the last 10 days we had two nights were temperatures were at least 34 degrees and on top of the hill where the orchards are, I feel sure it got to 31 or 32 degrees.

So what do you think this is?

 

[WTNUT]

I think it is FB as well, but was hoping for the best. I am going up there this afternoon to cut the damage limbs off. I hate that stuff!

I will research how far to cut back this afternoon.

 

[wooduck]

That's fireblight Im sure , prevent sprays would have to start pre-bloom as most fireblight gets a foothold then , prune out clean all tools remove prunings and hope for the best , spraying now will not help in my opinion ,, give some serious thought to removing the pear as some pears attract fireblight and spread to surrounding trees , or spray hard next year with antibiotics to catch it early , also some wild fruiting trees in the area could vector in the fireblight or be inoculum sources

One other event can lead to a major outbreak physical injury --- hail , ect

 

[WTNUT]

That's fireblight Im sure , prevent sprays would have to start pre-bloom as most fireblight gets a foothold then , prune out clean all tools remove prunings and hope for the best , spraying now will not help in my opinion ,, give some serious thought to removing the pear as some pears attract fireblight and spread to surrounding trees , or spray hard next year with antibiotics to catch it early , also some wild fruiting trees in the area could vector in the fireblight or be inoculum sources

One other event can lead to a major outbreak physical injury --- hail , ect

I removed the pear. In reading it says to find the infected limb, trace it back to it's point of attachment then "cut at the next branch junction down without damaging the branch collar". If you had FB on a limb that attached to a main lateral, you would not go back to the trunk and cut the main lateral off would you?

My guess is that is not what I have anyway.

 

[wooduck]

We have allways removed about 5 inches below affected area usually discolored wood or scorched leaves and have caught the ones we had . We seem to have most problems after big stress events like winter damage, major wind storms . It usually shows on new succulent growth this time of the year, if caught it should not affect the tree long term , if it is not caught it can travel and take the whole tree . I would not seal the prune cuts myself . but who knows im still learning also .

I would not cut off the main lateral

 

[WTNUT]

Thanks for the responses today. I drove 1.5 hours to the farm and prune out the blight from half the trees. I will get the rest on Sunday. In the meantime I will be studying for my Ph. D in Fireblight,

 

[WTNUT]

We have allways removed about 5 inches below affected area usually discolored wood or scorched leaves and have caught the ones we had . We seem to have most problems after big stress events like winter damage, major wind storms . It usually shows on new succulent growth this time of the year, if caught it should not affect the tree long term , if it is not caught it can travel and take the whole tree . I would not seal the prune cuts myself . but who knows im still learning also .

I would not cut off the main lateral

It was on new succulent growth.

 

[WTNUT]

I am going to work on pruning the rest of the trees Sunday. I will look at the ones I worked on today as well. On a mature tree you can think you have pruned all the dead out , turn around look up and find more dead sprouts. On the new sprouts I pruned back to te main lateral. On the side laterals that were not the main lateral, I tried to get back 6 or 7 inches from the last dead spot.

I knew of FB, but always thought "that will not happen to me"! The real stupid thing was that I left the pear that had FB in place without any pruning for two years before dong anything. I thought it was FB but figured even if it was it would run its course and all would be fine.

I don't see damage to any limb like I did on the pear.

 

[Bowsnbucks]

One thing I've read is to dip your pruners in bleach solution to sterilize the blades between EACH cut you make so you don't spread the pathogen to other parts of the tree not as yet infected. Obviously do the same going between different trees.

 

[wooduck]

Let's hope you got it all and they recover. My father inlaw had an older tree over pruned about 5 years ago. That caused lots of fresh new growth. That year or the year after his tree had FB and survived fine without him doing anything to it. I saw the classic shepherd hook branches and brown leaves and thought the worst. The tree survived fine and he cut none of it out. It needs pruning now but he won't let me thin it. Maybe next February. His tree is loaded this year so your trees may be ok. I lost one this big to it though.

Not to steal the thread but to get control of the pictured older tree I would not prune in the winter as that is what generated the excessive growth. Think of it like this there is only so much captured energy in a tree if you winter prune that energy is stored in the root system and the tree wakes up and sends that energy into the above ground portion of the tree and you get excessive growth.

Now if you were to do some summer pruning early aug you would remove the trees ability to capture excessive energy and maybe, maybe achieve a balance of top to root system and slow the excessive flush of growth and achieve a more balanced tree with good air flow , don't remove over one third of the tree in one season

 

[Maya]

That sucks WT, just blossom blight, or have you seen any bigger shoots? Pruning out infested wood may help, and it's good to get that dead wood out, but it's better suited for younger trees. You might consider a strep spray during bloom next year if the weather is/was warm since pink and you have some rain on the way, and maybe copper at green tip. I've never had to deal with it but have been to talks where it has been discussed. You might want to talk to your local extension service. Just curious, what varieties were hit? Anyways, good luck with it.

 

[WTNUT]

This is going to be a long reply and if grow apples or pears for a hobby, you need to pay attention and hopefully you will not make the same mistake as me. First, Maya the trees that were struck were Red Rome and Granny Smith. They are all B-118 trees planted in 2004.
I have read a lot on managing FB in the last 24 hours and WOW it is something that I don't know how the average habit managing guy or hobby grower can deal with. First, most articles say to prune out the strikes as soon as you see the shepherds hook and they are talking hours to a few days - not a week or two later. That can be a problem for those of us who are 1.5 hours or more from our farms. If you don't get to the strikes that quickly, I have started reading some who say it is okay to wait to prune out the strikes. Personally, I am going with pruning them out as soon as possible once noticed even if the strikes started two weeks ago. Next, they talk about cutting to an ugly stub which is essentially leaving a long stub to cut off during the winter to remove any canker that appears. Well, that is a HECK of a lot easier to write about than to do on a mature B-118 that may have 14 side laterals off a main lateral with 5 of the side laterals having been struck. If those side laterals are only 10 inches long, you cant cut out the strike 12 to 18 inches below the strike and then leave an ugly stub. You can cut off those 5 side laterals that have been struck but then the issue is have you protected the main lateral? My guess is you have to do your best and look for cankers to remove in the winter. Next, there are A TON of strikes when you are dealing with blossom blight on a mature tree. My mistake yesterday, was I removed the trimmed wood yesterday. Today I learned you are best to leave it at site until it drys and then remove the wood. Next, if you get the cankers out come winter they recommend cooper at green tip (well if you have 100 plus trees 1.5 hours away and are suppose to spray the who orchard) green tip arrives at different times! Next, you can then spray Strepomycin before blossoms become infected, but it seems to last only a very short time period and you have to watch for times where temps will be

 

[WTNUT]

where temps will be in the 70s with rain in the forcast (has anyone been to southern Ohio that is all spring) Then you have the issue of many different varieties blooming at different times.

If you are thinking about planting your first apple trees plant those that are FB resistant!!!!!!

I will be shocked if I get this under control, but will try to prune out more of the FB Friday.

 

[WTNUT]

NH Mountains,
If I were you I would take the following precautionary steps with regard to your AB graft:
1. rent a John Deere 200 excavator and dig a hole 25 feet deep;
2. scrounge up 41 old pallets somewhere and place one pallet flat on the bottom of the hole;
3. place pot and grafted Arkansas Black on the pallet at the bottom of the hole;
4. pile 20 pallets on top of the Arkansas Black graft;
5. pour 55 gallons of diesel fuel on top of the 21 pallets;
6. light the pallets and wait for the fire to burn out;
7. repeat steps 4-6;
8. pour ten yards concrete in the bottom of the hole;
9. add few yards of concrete to the hole as insurance;
10. fill the hole back in and spread out the left over dirt.

 

[WTNUT]

Stu raises a good point, I have a large tree between two of my worse FB victims and it has no damage at all. It is a red delicious which shows up as FB resistant, but I will tell you one other thing. It does not have the first apple on it. I am not sure that the bloom didn't get wiped out. It should have had fruit this year.

 

[WTNUT]

Fireblight update: I have read a lot and have concluded that there has to be a lot of false information out there. Yesterday I trimmed out more strikes and had three trees with strikes that did not have any on Wednesday. I really do not think trimming out strikes immediately eliminates either blossom or stem blight. It would help prevent the FB from spreading closer to trunk, but you are going to still have lots of blossoms that turn into blight if the bacteria was spread during ideal conditions. I also think it is nearly impossible to remove all strikes from a mature B-118 tree. I had a scissor lift and tractor with bucket and did not get it all pruned out properly as described by experts. I was more aggressive in my cutting with my goal being to save the tree not fruit set on this year. From here on out I will have a spring spray program. Attaching photos of amputated trees after I trimmed.

 

[WTNUT]

I also failed to mention that I decide to cut one tree and left a nurse limb until next year when I will top graft it. Although we learn best through our mistakes, I can't stress how much I regret not educating myself 13 years ago when I planted my first apple and pear trees. I distinctly remember thinking "apples are apples, I will just get some cheap potted trees at Walmart or Lowes when they go on sale". I did. I stuck them in the ground with little to no care about anything other than I knew they would do best on a south eastern slope where the sun would dry the moisture off early. I didn't fertilize, prune, train, spray, or consider FB resistant trees. The other issue that I can't control is that my trees are in large and medium size foodplots ( I originally planted for deer not me). Therefore, I can't control the other host trees that carry the bacteria for FB.

 

[WTNUT]

I looked at his videos and he seems to making progress. Wonder how long he had FB in his orchard before he took action? He had to cut out a lot of trees. I don't look forward to trying to scrape off cankers in the winter and then apply cooper paste! That is going to be impossible if I have cankers in the tops of my trees!