Fall disaster plan help

[Brokenbear]

ZONE 6b S E Missouri
Starting from scratch after dirt pan work (river damage) on my bottom land and planted soybeans and rye grass (as soon as the pans pulled out) mid June to try to catch any rains but to no avail
We are in a drought and not enough rain to even kick the rye grass into gear ..and for the beans ..are in the 8-12" category as I type this ..but the little dab of rain was enough to keep the weed seed bank/ roots thriving
Cockerburr the tallest at 24" and pigweed shorter but most wide spread ..to add to this the pigweed is gly resistant so today I hit the whole field after church with 3oz to the gallon (field boom sprayer)
of the Liberty Link chemical which will kill the beans also as they were Roundup beans
So I am going to be starting my 365/green summer/fall program this Aug/Sept with basically a chemical burn down or possibly two and bare dirt fields ..I am going to get 5 or so soil samples and see where I am on PH as well as mineral needs and may possibly end up with a fertilizer buggy and run my 12' field cultivator (with rear sweep tines to level the dirt) and work in the fertilizer but odds are good that the soil is good as it stands

My thoughts are first pass mid August turnips, radishes, Chicory, Berseem Crimson and Ladino clover, Awnless wheat and barley
Then when the brassicas are established toward the end of September (we hope!) over seed with a minimum of 100 lb/AC winter rye

Questions:
If I am going to include say 30lbs each of wheat n barley in my plan should I hold out the wheat and and include the barley in the first pass and the wheat in the rye pass or is even that 30lbs of barley too much competition for the brassicas ?

Would you change ..add or remove from the first pass mix ?

Or changes for the second rye pass

Has any one tried running a drill through a first pass established plot to drill the rye and any other held over cereal seeds ? ...I know it sounds like a crazy question but I am going to have bare dirt and I know germination will be way better drilled cereal seeds with the current conditions of low soil moisture and nothing to hold the moisture that does fall

Of course any way you cut it ..gotta have rain ...

Bear

 

[Telemark]

I wouldn't put wheat or barley in the first pass mix. Maybe oats if you really want a grain in there. Otherwise it looks like a good plan.

 

[Foggy47]

Broadcasting the grains on a second pass may be the best way to do what you want.....if you are going to preserve that brassica.

 

[Bill]

I’m betting your beans won’t die. Just because the bag didn’t say liberty link doesn’t mean they are not resistant.

 

[Foggy47]

I’m betting your beans won’t die. Just because the bag didn’t say liberty link doesn’t mean they are not resistant.

I Wondered about that too. It certainly wont do them any good.....but not sure they will be terminated.

 

[Wind Gypsy]

I wouldn't put wheat or barley in the first pass mix. Maybe oats if you really want a grain in there. Otherwise it looks like a good plan.

This is what my plan is with a similar blend, oats will be the only cereal planted with brassicas/legumes and rye will get broadcasted over the top later on. Primarily because I know oats will frost kill up here early in the season but that might not be the case in SE MO? Not that familiar with the difference in how oats may be more or less competitive in a blend. Also just want the rye to be young still in oct/nov.

 

[Foggy47]

This is what my plan is with a similar blend, oats will be the only cereal planted with brassicas/legumes and rye will get broadcasted over the top later on. Primarily because I know oats will frost kill up here early in the season but that might not be the case in SE MO? Not that familiar with the difference in how oats may be more or less competitive in a blend. Also just want the rye to be young still in oct/nov.

Gypsy.....what do you use to broadcast your rye into the brassica? I'm trying to minimize how much of my crops are driven over.

I am considering setting my cone spreader to throw to the side......and I plan to mount my Herd GT77 at one side of loader and rotate it 90 degrees so that it slings seeds to the side. Thus I could make a pass seeding on one side.....turn around and sling to the other side. May cut down on the traffic through my plots. Still a work in process.....we'll see.

 

[Wind Gypsy]

Gypsy.....what do you use to broadcast your rye into the brassica? I'm trying to minimize how much of my crops are driven over.

I am considering setting my cone spreader to throw to the side......and I plan to mount my Herd GT77 at one side of loader and rotate it 90 degrees so that it slings seeds to the side. Thus I could make a pass seeding on one side.....turn around and sling to the other side. May cut down on the traffic through my plots. Still a work in process.....we'll see.

I just use a bag spreader but understand that can get to be a bit much depending on acreage.

 

[Foggy47]

I just use a bag spreader but understand that can get to be a bit much depending on acreage.

Yep.....I'm done with using a bag spreader. I will put down over 20 bags of rye.....just too old (and experienced) for that bag plan. grin.

 

[Brokenbear]

Thanks for all who have chimed in ...

I agree that the beans may act just like the Gly resistant pigweed does when hit with Gly by setting back then taking off again

I was also sure that the introduction of cereals planted at the time the Brassacas were planted was taboo for several reasons ..choke out the Brassicas and also not be at the "deer yummy stage" in Nov/Dec by being too big .....but somewhere I had filed away that there was some sort of conflict based on genetics that went beyond just physical blockage of sunlight and hoggin the H2O n nutrients ??? but that it was not a consideration once the Brassicas were established ..

As far a overseeding after the Brassicas and Clovers establish ...this old bay is way past bag spreading 30 bags of cereal rye !

I do have a big 3 point PTO driven cone shaped spreader but it is really designed for bulk lime and fertilizer spreading ...it has a huge agitator that flails the heck out of the intended product so I do not know how well it would or could meter out and spread the small seed cereals ...another option is I have an old 12' John Deere Van Brunt drill that I can drop down just enough to engage the drive wheel just scratching the surface or even possibly air dropping by using the lift arms to pull the drill and raise the tongue of the drill to keep the openers in the air ..but it has drag chains ..but they could be individually wired up to the board step on the back ..or left down to stir ???

I will say that the Brassicas are some what of another fishing expedition in that we have had PTT in plots somewhere on the farm for years and the deer seem ho-hum choosing clover over it every time except one year where all heck froze and iced over and the deer pawed out the root out of survival ...that spring the field had 10.000 + what looked like softball covers laying every where ...

So if the clovers would survive a no till drill say 40 days after planting .. I would almost accept some damage to the Brassica ..what to do what to do*&%#@X*&

Bear

 

[Telemark]

https://www.tractorsupply.com/tsc/product/groundwork-two-behind-spreader-130-lb-tbs6519t

 

[Foggy47]

I've broadcast a fair amount of rye seed, fertilizer and pell lime with a cone-type spreader. Most all of these are made by the same Italian manufacturer. I kinda have love / hate thoughts about putting out seeds with mine....but it has always got the job done. They are good at big volume jobs.

My main complaint comes from trying to keep an even spread across a given area. Mine always seems to apply heavier to one side than the other.....and that varies allot with the material being spread. I'm going to focus on a solution to this before using it again this fall. I know mine is getting rusty at the bolts that hold those curved cup sections to the spinner plate (mine is all steel). I've read that by changing to other bolt holes you can affect the direction of the spread.

Also have seen some folks buy the newer stainless steel spinner plate.....which would solve my corrosion issues. Mine is about 15 years old.....and while I have cleaned it pretty good......it's starting to rust the spinner plate.

 

[Brokenbear]

Thanks Tele ..I have one of those but mine is a Yardman that I use on my level ground around the house ..I have put two transmissions in it just pulling it with a garden tractor ...
So I am thinking those imports likely won't survive 8 or 10 acres scattering a half ton of cereal rye ..and my bad I did not say how many acres were involved in my projects ..but hey any idea is better than no idea so thanks for you input

Bear

 

[Brokenbear]

I've broadcast a fair amount of rye seed, fertilizer and pell lime with a cone-type spreader. Most all of these are made by the same Italian manufacturer. I kinda have love / hate thoughts about putting out seeds with mine....but it has always got the job done. They are good at big volume jobs.

My main complaint comes from trying to keep an even spread across a given area. Mine always seems to apply heavier to one side than the other.....and that varies allot with the material being spread. I'm going to focus on a solution to this before using it again this fall. I know mine is getting rusty at the bolts that hold those curved cup sections to the spinner plate (mine is all steel). I've read that by changing to other bolt holes you can affect the direction of the spread.

Also have seen some folks buy the newer stainless steel spinner plate.....which would solve my corrosion issues. Mine is about 15 years old.....and while I have cleaned it pretty good......it's starting to rust the spinner plate.

Yes mine is Italian bought years ago ..fortunately we only used it for lime as our Coop has some smaller fertilizer buggies that they will deliver for $20 + contents (loaded of course) and then empty our 1/2 ton trucks can easily get it back to Coop
I never really noticed it having a tendency to "throw" more one way than another but I must admit we always run a criss cross pattern so not an issue at the time ..
I think the cone spreader is going to have to be my go to solution to the over seeding

 

[RJAJr]

Interesting thread, I am over seeding a clover/chicory plot that has been struggling with weeds in this droughty summer we are having in WI. I will never plant clover in the spring again. That said I was going to spread about 60lbs/acre of rye with some Ladino and White Dutch mixed in there over about 2.5 acres. Was going to seed it with the tow behind but I think now I will hand spread it. I am shooting for the first couple of weeks in August. Good luck with your plan and thanks for sharing it.