Diverse mix seed weights

[Wind Gypsy]

When planting a diverse blend, the more specialized folks like green cover seed and vitalize seem to make a point of being very balanced with seeds. What I wonder is for smaller plots where the candy crops like peas are going to get wiped out in no time, is there a negative impact of seeding said candy crop heavier than you otherwise should because they aren’t going to be around long to compete with the others plants?

If there are a bunch of peas competing with say brassicas but the peas are wiped out a month after planting, will the brassica growth be notably less than it would have been with half as many peas planted?

I was pretty set on doing a lick creek’ish rotation previously but I’m tempted to just plant everything to a single diverse mix and not dick around with setting the drill up for multiple different mixes and possibly drilling at 2 different times.

 

[SD51555]

I'd give it a try and see what happens. Maybe throw in an extra one or two backup legumes to compensate for the peas getting eaten quickly. I have grown to like balansa and sweet clover.

 

[Wind Gypsy]

I'd give it a try and see what happens. Maybe throw in an extra one or two backup legumes to compensate for the peas getting eaten quickly. I have grown to like balansa and sweet clover.

Yeah, there will be other legumes.

Situation right now is I have left over northwoods whitetail WHS green blend (oats, peas, beans but heavy on the peas). Peas, beans, and oats for that matter too will all get hammered early. So I was thinking plant late July with that blend just a little less than stand alone rate from the big seed box but still have fixation balansa, red clover, alsike, chicory, PTT, radish, kale, and rape in the small box at more balanced blend rates. Then broadcast rye with maybe a small WW or triticale component around Labor Day to fill in any bare spots and ensure it’s green through spring.

 

[Hoytvectrix]

Yeah, there will be other legumes.

Situation right now is I have left over northwoods whitetail WHS green blend (oats, peas, beans but heavy on the peas). Peas, beans, and oats for that matter too will all get hammered early. So I was thinking plant late July with that blend just a little less than stand alone rate from the big seed box but still have fixation balansa, red clover, alsike, chicory, PTT, radish, kale, and rape in the small box at more balanced blend rates. Then broadcast rye with maybe a small WW or triticale component around Labor Day to fill in any bare spots and ensure it’s green through spring.

Are the beans and peas forage varieties? Crimson clover would be pretty solid for including with the blend you are considering. Anything with indeterminate growth would be key.
I feel like brassicas do really well if they have the space to grow. It seems like they can put in a lot of growth to catch up right before that first frost, but not have enough time for bulb production. They are like a blue shell in Mario kart. If you need more greens as a hail Mary they will do that. If you give them time and space for above and below ground they will do that too.

 

[Wind Gypsy]

Are the beans and peas forage varieties?

I believe so.

 

[jsasker007]

WG,
When you say smaller plots, how small are we talking?

 

[Wind Gypsy]

WG,
When you say smaller plots, how small are we talking?

For this mix I'm thinking about 2 plots, one being 1 acre and the other being 2 acres. From Sept until the Nov gun season whittles the deer #'s down there were 10+ deer in each most every night and the bigger seemed to have 10+ most every morning and night in there.

 

[jsasker007]

For this mix I'm thinking about 2 plots, one being 1 acre and the other being 2 acres. From Sept until the Nov gun season whittles the deer #'s down there were 10+ deer in each most every night and the bigger seemed to have 10+ most every morning and night in there.

I think if you can have enough growing to get ahead a little bit of the grazing you might be surprised how well it does. Getting the plants past the point of being wiped out when young is the biggest issue in my opinion. Maybe some oats will keep them going while the peas and beans get started. The worst is when they find those young plants and one bite will take the plants out.

 

[jsasker007]

There are some deterrent products that might help buy you some time. Thinking milorganite might be one but just going from memory on that. Something you can throw in the seeder with the seed to keep it a one pass kinda deal.

 

[Wind Gypsy]

I think if you can have enough growing to get ahead a little bit of the grazing you might be surprised how well it does. Getting the plants past the point of being wiped out when young is the biggest issue in my opinion. Maybe some oats will keep them going while the peas and beans get started. The worst is when they find those young plants and one bite will take the plants out.

That makes sense. Worst case if i seed the peas/beans/oats portion of the mix roughly inline with what greencover's smartmix spits out, they get wiped out and the brassicas and clovers don't fill in enough maybe a few weeds get a leg up. But it'll all be filled in again with winter cereals broadcasted in early sept. Seems like not stunting the brassicas may be a better alternative than over planting something that isn't going to make it much past bow opener in mid Sept anyway.

 

[jsasker007]

Turnips are pretty much ignored by "my" deer until they go through a couple of frosts. Radishes get eaten as soon as they come up.

 

[Bowsnbucks]

Radishes get hit first here too.

 

[Foggy47]

There are some deterrent products that might help buy you some time. Thinking milorganite might be one but just going from memory on that. Something you can throw in the seeder with the seed to keep it a one pass kinda deal.

I used to plant pure stands of soybeans.......and would put down some milorganite as a fertilizer and to keep the deer off the plots until the beans got established. I think it worked pretty well. I think it kept the deer off the plots for about two weeks or so. Maybe due to rain too.

 

[Wind Gypsy]

Turnips are pretty much ignored by "my" deer until they go through a couple of frosts. Radishes get eaten as soon as they come up.

I've seen similar. A couple years ago up north we thought the radishes in a mix all failed because the plots were near 100% PTT. I think the radishes just got hammered immediately.

 

[jsasker007]

The LICK CREEK ratios seemed crazy high as far as pounds of seed per acre but Paul had the experience doing it with great results but it took a few plantings before everything was seeded. We all benefited from Paul sharing his successful strategies with us. You might be able to implement some of his techniques with what you're doing.

 

[Foggy47]

This topic has been on my mind to research today. My Brother in law is recently retired as an Iowa farmer. He was big on cover crops and somewhat of a pioneer in this area. He coached me some when I got started into my journey into a drill and "regenerative ag".

Anyway....he is always calculating the populations of the various seeds in a mix and submits the NUMbER of seeds planted per acre is much more important the the lbs. I think we all agree on that. Further.....he suggested I always keep a blend of three types of seeds: 1. Legumes 2. Grains / Grasses 3. Brassicas. So in an effort to keep a simplified list of seeds to consider I came up with this list of seed choices to comprise my mixes. If I take these choices to the Green Cover site.....their "Smartmix" program can help attain the proper seed rates. Sometimes my little "cheat sheet" helps jog my memory for suitable seeds.

 

[Foggy47]

^. Now I need to learn how to take a MS word document from my apple computer and post it on this screen so it can be read. Grrrrr. Grin.

Apple and MS Word do not play well together.

 

[Westwind]

Foggy, do you use an iPhone? The app “Notes” allows you to scan documents and turn them into PDF format which is easy to post like posting a photo (i think).

Open “Notes”
On the bottom right hit the square with the pencil on it
At the top of your keyboard hit the little camera
Select “scan documents”
Take a photo of the document, the yellow shading is the part you will see
Hit save or “save to files”

I can’t think of how to get it into photos which is super easy to get on here

I use notes quite a bit but I have to struggle through a little. It is handy though

I would like to see your stuff.

 

[Foggy47]

Foggy, do you use an iPhone? The app “Notes” allows you to scan documents and turn them into PDF format which is easy to post like posting a photo (i think).

Open “Notes”
On the bottom right hit the square with the pencil on it
At the top of your keyboard hit the little camera
Select “scan documents”
Take a photo of the document, the yellow shading is the part you will see
Hit save or “save to files”

I can’t think of how to get it into photos which is super easy to get on here

I use notes quite a bit but I have to struggle through a little. It is handy though

I would like to see your stuff.

I will try to do this a little later. I need to learn this stuff.

 

[Foggy47]

Foggy, do you use an iPhone? The app “Notes” allows you to scan documents and turn them into PDF format which is easy to post like posting a photo (i think).

Open “Notes”
On the bottom right hit the square with the pencil on it
At the top of your keyboard hit the little camera
Select “scan documents”
Take a photo of the document, the yellow shading is the part you will see
Hit save or “save to files”

I can’t think of how to get it into photos which is super easy to get on here

I use notes quite a bit but I have to struggle through a little. It is handy though

I would like to see your stuff.

Just saw this thread.....and made an attempt to do as Westward suggested above. I can get the pic into notes and transfer to my computer via the "share" feature with my MacAir......but the PDF file is too large to pull it up on this post.

Sadly I'm 1/2 generation behind the times when it comes to the digital world. In my next life......I'm going to be an IT guy. grin. When I was operating my biz.....I always had somebody to do this stuff for me.....thus I never took the time to learn. Lame excuse......I know.