Beginner TSI/- Girdling

[DRG3]

Hello,

I've never done any Hack/Squirt or Girdling, but I've identified an area on my property that will be a good spot for a first try. Basically because If i totally mess it up, there is limited negative impact lol.

I am leaning towards girdling because I am trying to minimize my cost and I am worried about translocation of herbicide. I have a few basic questions regarding girdling.

1) How long should I expect results to take. said differently, when will I know if I've done it right. Is hack and squirt faster and by how much?
2) How deep do I make the cuts? I am leaning towards a double girdle and understand cutting around the tree- but how deep should I be going to get through the inner and outer bark
3) I was planning to cut around waist high- however deep is described above, all the way around the tree. Is there any other technical knowhow needed?
4) Lastly, other than speed of conducting the work- what are the pro's/cons of girdling vs H/S? Why would I pick one over the other?
5) Is it the end of the world If i get stump regrowth from the girdle? Isn't that basically just successional growth?

Any other factors I need to consider? Or info I can provide?

Thanks in advance!

 

[SD51555]

What is your goal for the area you're working on? What do you want to happen after this?

 

[DRG3]

My goal is to allow sunlight in to the area to generate regrowth and improve cover for deer and turkey. In addition to this I'm planning to put in 30-50' strips of herbaceous on my crop field edges, which will butt up to this area i am talking about the TSI. So this will be kind of a stairstep crop ground ->herbaceous -> TSI-> bigger timber in this particular section. for this TSI I'm talking about a 1/2 acre peninsula of tress that juts out into my crop field. I intend to use it as a learning area before I go into larger sections of woods. I do intend to leave a couple of nice oaks standing, but largely kill other than that. I could actually cut and remove the trees here, but I'm wanting to practice the girdle method.

 

[SD51555]

What kind of trees are going to be coming down?

 

[DRG3]

The short answer, sitting here at my desk is everything in this particular half acre that isnt a mature oak. I know there is some, maple, poplar and sycamore in this little block, and also some species like wing dam and other smaller early type species that I cant name.

 

[Telemark]

I would mark everything you want to girdle this summer. Then wait til winter and girdle it all. The girdled trees will stump sprout, giving you immediate food and cover. The sudden increase in light to the forest floor should give you good succession over the years. I would probably burn leaf litter if possible, to really get things going. Then you can manage the regrowth with cutting, spraying, planting, etc.

 

[DRG3]

Makes sense. Thank you. Just out of curiosity, what's the reason for girdling in the winter, vs summer?

 

[Telemark]

Makes sense. Thank you. Just out of curiosity, what's the reason for girdling in the winter, vs summer?

To make the tree stump sprout.

The tree will draw a lot of nutrients down into the root system as it goes dormant for the winter. In the Spring, the lack of biomass above ground will cause the tree to grow like a bush, with the new growth having nutrient densities 2 to 10 times (depending on the nutrient) higher than normal foliage. This is an extremely attractive food source for deer.

If you girdle the tree in summer, it will not be able to draw those nutrients back into the roots, causing significantly less sprouting.

 

[Jerry-B-WI]

If you're girdling the tree in winter to cause stump sprouting why not just cut the tree down? Could be used for fire wood or be made into brush piles which could create habitat for small game animals.

I just don't see the reasoning for leaving the tree standing to rot and fall down eventually anyway.

 

[b116757]

I don’t mind leaving standing dead trees they are habitat for lots of different woodpecker species and other critters also. Many folks find them unsightly however I understand that sentiment also.

 

[Telemark]

If you're girdling the tree in winter to cause stump sprouting why not just cut the tree down? Could be used for fire wood or be made into brush piles which could create habitat for small game animals.

I just don't see the reasoning for leaving the tree standing to rot and fall down eventually anyway.

Some of the places where I want to kill trees are not practical for felling trees and impossible for collecting firewood or even driving an ATV. One place in particular is along my south property line where leaners would end up on the neighbor's property, and felling too many trees would make an impenetrable line that would negatively affect deer movement.

Another spot is near my orchard and food plot. The 100 foot tall trees would land in the food plot and make a mess that would be difficult to clean up. Killing those trees with hack and squirt usually causes the tree to fall in pieces over time, starting at the top.

The last time I dropped a bunch of mature aspens, it made an awful mess that the deer avoided. And a few years ago a strong wind took down some big beech and maple trees, which also made an impenetrable barrier.

Additionally, I don't want small animals on my property, because that means mostly rodents. I've never seen a rabbit or hare on the island. The standing dead trees also give hunting perches for raptors, which help control the rodents.

 

[Howboutthemdawgs]

To make the tree stump sprout.

The tree will draw a lot of nutrients down into the root system as it goes dormant for the winter. In the Spring, the lack of biomass above ground will cause the tree to grow like a bush, with the new growth having nutrient densities 2 to 10 times (depending on the nutrient) higher than normal foliage. This is an extremely attractive food source for deer.

If you girdle the tree in summer, it will not be able to draw those nutrients back into the roots, causing significantly less sprouting.

I’m a little confused on how girdling causes stump sprouts? Felling the tree will cause sprouts but girdling is a long slow decaying process. I’ve girdled a ton of trees and never had one stump sprout. I have trees from 4 years ago that are girdled still standing. They are dead but they are hanging on.

 

[loshonhora]

How many acres total is your property/timber that you want to girdle? Have you considered a timber cut? You may be throwing away some good money by just killing those trees.

 

[DRG3]

This farm is 51 acres and basically half timber half crops. I have a Forrester from the local nrcs that’s going to come out but that’s a long wait. I am on the schedule though.
This section im talking about starting with is only a half acre. It’s in a good natural bedding/nesting spot and I thought a good spot for me to practice the technique as I’ve never done it.

 

[Howboutthemdawgs]

This farm is 51 acres and basically half timber half crops. I have a Forrester from the local nrcs that’s going to come out but that’s a long wait. I am on the schedule though.
This section im talking about starting with is only a half acre. It’s in a good natural bedding/nesting spot and I thought a good spot for me to practice the technique as I’ve never done it.

Go for it! It won’t hurt. Hack and squirt the smaller stuff and girdle anything about the size of your leg or bigger. Just be strategic and release some of the more beneficial (to wildlife and timber value trees) and it’s a win-win. Don’t worry about translocation. I’ve heard a study where in a number of years they lost one tree they could tell from translocation. It’s effective anytime of the year. It’s been said that spring is no good but that only applies for heavy sap flow species like maple.

 

[b116757]

I’m a little confused on how girdling causes stump sprouts? Felling the tree will cause sprouts but girdling is a long slow decaying process. I’ve girdled a ton of trees and never had one stump sprout. I have trees from 4 years ago that are girdled still standing. They are dead but they are hanging on.

Trees in Northern Wisconsin almost never stump sprouted for me I didn’t even realize it was a thing trees would do until I moved to Kansas so there is definitely a latitude thing associated with sprouting. At least in my experience.

 

[Jerry-B-WI]

Trees in Northern Wisconsin almost never stump sprouted for me I didn’t even realize it was a thing trees would do until I moved to Kansas so there is definitely a latitude thing associated with sprouting. At least in my experience.

Maybe they didn't stump sprout if girdled. Every red maple that was cut during the logging of my land stump sprouted. The popple are growing thick like hair on a dog. The plan written by the forester I hired called for regeneration from coppice. The deer love the sprouts from the maple stumps and are always browsing on the new growth popple.

 

[b116757]

Poplar root sprout like mad when the ground see’s sunlight I don’t guess we had much in the way of red maple on our place to compare to.

 

[Telemark]

I’m a little confused on how girdling causes stump sprouts? Felling the tree will cause sprouts but girdling is a long slow decaying process. I’ve girdled a ton of trees and never had one stump sprout. I have trees from 4 years ago that are girdled still standing. They are dead but they are hanging on.

Girdling might be the wrong word. I don't remove the bark as is typical in "girdling". I just run a chainsaw around the tree twice at about hip height, which is what I thought OP was talking about.

 

[Howboutthemdawgs]

Girdling might be the wrong word. I don't remove the bark as is typical in "girdling". I just run a chainsaw around the tree twice at about hip height, which is what I thought OP was talking about.

Correct same as what I do. It takes years for mine to completely fall. Usually it’s just limbs and bark peeling off as it decays