Field prep?

[Derek Reese 29]

Just wondering some thoughts on how to prep a field for frost/overseeding.
This is a half acre field that I intend to frost seed into. Right now it is covered in a pretty thick carpet of weeds and grass that is mostly dead.
My thoughts include brush hogging as close to the dirt as possible, then running a small hare over the ground, then somehow raking the debris off (either by hand or a small pull behind rake).
I could even use a leaf blower if that would help. Would then broadcast lime as the pH from a soil test came back at 5.7.
I plan to spray IMOX or cleth/2,4 db once the grass/weeds start growing.
I can't currently do any of this as there is 6 inches of snow, but wanted to plan in case we got a warm spell.
This plot is right below my house so I can do the work whenever the weather cooperates.
Would like the field to be as close to bare dirt as possible for the best seed to soil contact.
I plan on getting ahold of a cultipacker too but don't know how much this will help with frost seeding.
Any suggestions would help!-thanks

 

[Catscratch]

I pretty much do things the opposite of what you are thinking. All that thatch you are trying to remove is perfect desirable in my eyes. I would frost seed. Mow thatch on top of the seed. Then maybe use appropriate chemicals. Lots of ways to skin a cat though.

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[Derek Reese 29]

I pretty much do things the opposite of what you are thinking. All that thatch you are trying to remove is perfect desirable in my eyes. I would frost seed. Mow thatch on top of the seed. Then maybe use appropriate chemicals. Lots of ways to skin a cat though.

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I would love to no-till once I get things going, but this thatch might be 2-3" deep in places...I just dont know if the seeds would even get close enough to the soil (even being the small clover seeds that I plan to use).

 

[Catscratch]

I wish I could post pics of the thatch I plant in. Overgrown hay fields are perfect, the thicker the better (unless it's fescue or brome). I don't want to talk you out of your plan... but what you are describing is exactly what I look for. If you ever wanted to try throw-n-mow you have a good setup for it.

 

[Derek Reese 29]

I wish I could post pics of the thatch I plant in. Overgrown hay fields are perfect, the thicker the better (unless it's fescue or brome). I don't want to talk you out of your plan... but what you are describing is exactly what I look for. If you ever wanted to try throw-n-mow you have a good setup for it.

Ill try to get some pictures this weekend..i think the weeds in the field already may be smartweed too...dont know if thats an issue but I know i have issues with it taking over some other plots...hoping the herbicides will deal with it nicely and the frost seeded clover will handle the rest...

 

[Catscratch]

In my experience a spring planting is not great for weed control in clover. I prefer to spray in the late summer and fall, then seed in the fall also. With that said I'm ok with some weeds so a spring planting isn't the worst thing in the world. I also don't mind replanting clover the same year if I didn't like the results. Clover seed is cheap.

 

[Derek Reese 29]

In my experience a spring planting is not great for weed control in clover. I prefer to spray in the late summer and fall, then seed in the fall also. With that said I'm ok with some weeds so a spring planting isn't the worst thing in the world. I also don't mind replanting clover the same year if I didn't like the results. Clover seed is cheap.

i definitely dont mind a fall overseed at all though I have always had my best success with frost seeding...our summers are too unpredictable (last year no rain for 1.5 months from july into august)
i want to get the wildlife used to feeding in the field early this year and my brand new sprayer is just chomping at the bit to be used...so i dont mind weeds either...i dont need it to look like a magazine...just dont want it to be overrun with weeds (i will be mowing to control as well)

 

[Bowsnbucks]

Learning from others here, our camp has done some August / September planting of clover with good results. Less weed competition - as they are dying down then. With proper fertilization / liming, the following spring should see it really kick in.
Frost seeding in late February or March would be a good bet in your location - my camp is near you. I'll be frost seeding then.

 

[Derek Reese 29]

hers a few pictures of the field as it is now..can someone help me ID the weeds? I thought smartweed but wasnt sure...thanks!

 

[S.T.Fanatic]

Reed Canary Grass. It is a cool season grass. I would burn the plot off in spring, give it 2 weeks to green up and hit it with gly. I would do an annual clover with a oats in the spring and then do a TNM of perennial clover and chicory in the fall with a winter rye nurse crop if you want a perennial clover plot.

 

[Derek Reese 29]

Reed Canary Grass. It is a cool season grass. I would burn the plot off in spring, give it 2 weeks to green up and hit it with gly. I would do an annual clover with a oats in the spring and then do a TNM of perennial clover and chicory in the fall with a winter rye nurse crop if you want a perennial clover plot.

do you mean burn it with fire? or just burn it with gly? i feel like i need to get that thick thatch out of there before i even try to do anything...

 

[S.T.Fanatic]

I would use fire. The black soil will warm up fast and with a spring rain the "weeds" will grow quickly. Let them get about 4-6" tall and spray with gly and broadcast your clover and oats.

 

[Derek Reese 29]

i have no experience with fire...can i use or rent a drip torch or acetylene? i was going to try to hare some of the thatch up and away before it warmed up

 

[S.T.Fanatic]

The snow will melt in the open before it does in the wooded area next to your proposed plot. If time isnt a problem just keep an eye on the snow melt ad burn it off before the snow melts in the woods. You can buy a drip torch for about $150 shipped to your front steps. If it will be a one time use for you it's an expensive option. What you can do is rake up a small pile of dry thatch, set it on fire, and use a garden rake to drag it around to spread the fire. If you can get at it early enough in the spring there will still be plenty of freeze thaw cycles going on.

 

[Catscratch]

Never burned before? Call the county fire department and let them know what you want to do. They might offer to help or at least want to know the day and time you plan to burn. Fire can get away quickly and just because it isn't windy when you start doesn't mean it won't be once you've started. Burning is very common here... I knew an old rancher who said "I never lit a fire I didn't immediately regret". I've found those words to be wise many times.

 

[Tree Spud]

I knew an old rancher who said "I never lit a fire I didn't immediately regret". I've found those words to be wise many times.

I have that exact feeling every time I start my burn pile

 

[Tree Spud]

If it is reed canary grass, you will probably need 2-3 spraying of Gly over about 7-8 weeks. There will be probably be a good latent seed bed that you will have to contend with.

 

[Derek Reese 29]

If it is reed canary grass, you will probably need 2-3 spraying of Gly over about 7-8 weeks. There will be probably be a good latent seed bed that you will have to contend with.

will the rhizomes be an issue too? or will the gly get those as well? I just got a new ATV sprayer that has an adjustment for how many ozs per acre (not gallon)...any suggestions on the setting for that?
i am rethinking my frost seeding and will probably just wait on putting in the perennial clover till the fall....buckwheat/oats/annual clover planted in the spring is looking like a much better option so i can be sure the canary grass is gone before moving forward with something the deer will eat...

 

[Tree Spud]

That's why multi, spread out spraying withy gly is recommended. You want to kill, then watch for new grass emerging, and spray again until you no longer have new growth to eventually kill the entire rhizome system. You may have a seed bank that still can produce new growth RCG, but you will have to monitor. I would fall seed red clover and winter rye as the rye will suppress new RCG growth, both will provide a food source.

 

[Derek Reese 29]

That's why multi, spread out spraying withy gly is recommended. You want to kill, then watch for new grass emerging, and spray again until you no longer have new growth to eventually kill the entire rhizome system. You may have a seed bank that still can produce new growth RCG, but you will have to monitor. I would fall seed red clover and winter rye as the rye will suppress new RCG growth, both will provide a food source.

Guess I’m already getting impatient but I want this to be a solid clover and grains spot I just moved in last fall and I want to do this right and not struggle for years to come....