What browse do deer eat in northeast woods (NY)

[eclipseman]

Hello all,
I was referred to come here from some archery members for some info. I own 120 acres in Eastern NY near VT. The land is mainly wooded. I have 2 food plots about 2 acres each. I think I have a good handle on what I’m doing with the foods plots but wanted to start doing some timberstand type improvements in my woods. I contacted the NY forestry and also a QDMA forester. Both will not be able to make it to my property for at least 6 months to a year and I do not have thousands to spend on a hired person to make me a forestry type plan. I know could potentially do more harm than good so I have been doing as much research as I can before doing a little work on my own. My goals are priority improving the lands for deer And then a distant second is wood for money. About half the property was logged 12 years ago. It was not clear cut though. Even though part of the property was logged, all the younger trees are too tall for deer to browse the leaves and there is very little ground vegetation or bedding so that is what I want to improve. I am wondering what tree species I look to cut down and which tree species to hinge cut. What other considerations? I plan on starting small because I do not want to hurt my lands, so I’m thinking I’m going to start with about a 10-15 acre area and make it a bedding area. Thoughts?

 

[Telemark]

Don't cut any mountain maples. But you can hinge other maples. I also cut beech that are too big to be used for scrapes but too small to produce mast.

 

[mikmaze]

I would get a good day set aside and bring two rolls of collored marking ribbon, mark desireable trees, oaks, apples, persimon, and double ribbon unknown. Get it ready for the forester/ qdma guys. try to reach out to any local folk that may be willing to walk with you and id stuff, then focus on releasing the desireable. Focus on how you are to access the land, plan on creating cover away fom access trails, and funnels to your spot. note the prevailing wind during hunting season, keeping it all in mind before you start cutting could make it all work better quicker than learning the hard way though trial and error.

 

[Shedder]

Don't cut any mountain maples.

Why?

 

[Telemark]

Why?

It's one of their favorites.

 

[Bill]

What happened to the half of the property that was logged 12 years ago? Any invasives like multiflora rose or anything else bad show up? Not sure that far north but in the mid Atlantic area it would be full of sweet gum now. Just mention that because I like your idea of starting slow. It will give you a chance to see what happens good or bad.

When it comes to hinge cutting an area I don't ever really worry about what not to cut. But I'm not looking to grow timber for future sale. I would think the area that was logged would be prime for putting in pockets of hinge cuts. Should be lots of smaller diameter stuff to work with.

I'm sure you have read up on hinge cutting but I like to mention some things when guys ask about it.

Hard hat, eye protection and chainsaw pants are a must. When you're hinge cutting and pulling trees down something will hit you eventually.

Knee high cuts block deer movement. Shoulder high cuts allow deer to walk under them. Both have there use but they don't interchange well...

 

[chickenlittle]

It is likely the part that was logged was high graded and the best timber trees are gone. If it wasn't clear cut, what was left behind and does that have any value now or in the future? If was high graded and the best oaks removed, it would be degraded for current and future timber value. You'll want to inventory what is there and whether it has timber or wildlife value or not. If the logged section doesn't have much future timber value, that section you might consider more of a blank slate for your habitat improvements. Once you know what tree, shrub, and invasive species you got, you need to develop an understanding of how the deer interact with your current property and neighboring locale. Next part is determining what is the most effective way to hunt it. Then what changes can be made that improve upon that? You want to have all those together in a comprehensive strategic plan before you start changing stuff. Does a 10-15 acre bedding area help or hurt? What are smarter options.

You might consider putting together some of that information, think about it some, and then run it by the folks here for critique and brainstorming. You could have a good idea about things before the foresters arrive.

 

[chickenlittle]

I'll add I don't think one needs to worry about cutting Mountain Maple or Striped Maple as long as you don't treat the stumps. Both are shrubby maples that can be good browse. I've read about mountain maple but never seen it. Mountain maple is supposed to tolerate high levels of browsing and keep growing back. We have striped maple in our understory and I think many people dislike it because it has no timber or firewood value. But if it Mountain or Striped maple manages to get up above the browse line, it would not worth much to the deer. I would try to manage it by periodically cutting it and let it continue to produce browse within reach.

 

[Telemark]

You can usually pull mountain maple over. The trunks are thin and flexible.

I have read that it is possible to train mountain maple to grow as a bush, but I haven't tried it. All mine grow as a single narrow trunk, with lots of suckers at the base.

The deer like them so well, that I often set my cameras on mountain maples, since I don't bait deer on that property.

 

[Chainsaw]

Cornell has a Master Forest Owner program with over 140 volunteers throughout the state that that are trained to help fellow NY state landowners in managing their woods for wildlife, timber, maple syrup and all else. Some of the volunteers are serious land managers themselves and can be of great help to you. MFO services are free. Just click on the link here and follow their instructions to request a visit. Note; I am a volunteer in the program but are simply too far away from your location for a woods walk visit. and know that they are usually looking for more volunteers and they provide excellent training at a very low price to help cover some of the costs. Anyhow here is the link;
http://blogs.cornell.edu/ccemfo/
If you do request a woods walk be sure to ask for someone really into the wildlife aspect of it as well as timber management. Most of us MFO's are very knowledgeable in some aspects but not so much in others so you want to contact one that is strong in what help you are looking for.
Also here is the link to preferred winter browse chart from the NY DEC website. https://www.dec.ny.gov/animals/7195.html

 

[Bowsnbucks]

Chainsaw's link sounds like a great place to start. ^^^^^

If you have possible future "timber money" trees, take into consideration how you'll get them out once cut for sale. You don't want to destroy any habitat improvements you make when it's time to cut the money trees. Maybe have a skid-road worked into your long range plans so if you have money trees, it'll be easier to pull them out without ruining what you've already started. If you plan to sell some timber, I'd start by figuring on their exit route first - and then plan on your plantings, hinging, plots, etc.

 

[Tap]

It might be better if you told us what species of trees that's on your property. Not all North East woods lots are created the same. The species can vary wildly over just a few miles or even from neighbor to neighbor.
Tell us what you have and we will have a better chance of advising you in the best way.
Do you have White Ash and if so, has the Emerald Ash Borer arrived there yet? Hemlock? Blue Spruce? These all have potential pest disasters on the way. If a species is going to die-out from a blight then that may effect on what, or how you cut.

 

[eclipseman]

It might be better if you told us what species of trees that's on your property. Not all North East woods lots are created the same. The species can vary wildly over just a few miles or even from neighbor to neighbor.
Tell us what you have and we will have a better chance of advising you in the best way.
Do you have White Ash and if so, has the Emerald Ash Borer arrived there yet? Hemlock? Blue Spruce? These all have potential pest disasters on the way. If a species is going to die-out from a blight then that may effect on what, or how you cut.

I know we have red and white oaks. Way more red than white. I know we have maples but I’m not 100% sure which types yet. We have white pines but not a lot (maybe 5% of all the trees). We have trees that have ovalish leaves with points at the nonstem end. I am not sure what these trees are yet.

 

[Apple Junkie]

Along the same line as chainsaw suggested above, you may want to become a member of the New York State Forest Owners Association. This group is made up of folks just like yourself, who have similar interests and challenges in managing their properties. I am member, and I had a fellow Master Forester do a "woods walk" with me to identify what trees I had, offer general suggestions on what the timber potential might be, and what governmental programs were available. They do not take the place of a professional forester, but they are very knowledgeable and helpful folks. Some chapters are more active than others, but it's worth your consideration. Good luck, have fun.

https://www.nyfoa.org/swg/index.php

 

[Knehrke]

NYSDEC will help you to draw up a forest management plan based upon your objectives (ie, income through timber, wildlife, native grasslands, etc). It will include a survey of tree types, soil classification, and most impactful management practices. I'm on the other side of the state in Region 8, but one of the DEC foresters set me up when we bought the property and helped me to make contact with like-minded folks who've I've been able to plumb for their secrets to success (and failure!!!). And as a bonus, the forester has become a good friend who occasionally hunts and fishes with me. Even if you don't follow all of the management practices that are recommended, the information on their relative benefit will be useful. Finally, like Apple Junkie, I highly recommend getting involved with NYFOA.

 

[almanac12]

My first question would be: what are your goals? Why are you making changes to your land? Timber improvement? Habitat improvement? Access?

Get multiple opinions from multiple sources about what would help/hurt achieve your goals. I would carefully research best practices to manage your land based on drainage, soils, desirable species, invasive species, recreation, and habitat requirements for game.

I really think it's a good idea to go really slow to start. Plant a few trees or shrubs and see what grows. Watch for damage for deer, rabbits, voles, etc. You will be shocked at how tenacious those critters are. Their favorite food is likely much of what you're planting. I've seen deer pull off metal wire cages to nip the tops off of tamarack.


I know you don't want to pay for a forestry plan, but my experience is that there is a wide range of perspectives in the forestry profession. I don't think it will cost thousands to get a private party plan. Some foresters are conservation minded while others only think about "boards and cords". The WI DNR foresters I have worked with are of the latter mind set.