Seed Coatings - and PURE LIVE SEED

[Foggy47]

^ Glad you weighed-in on this topic Dan. I have never asked for seed tags when ordering through established seed houses known to many of us. I suppose I should. I do check the tags when I am on-site at a retail store.....but I am not knowledgeable enough to make value decisions other than the germination rates.

After getting so much coated seed this year......I think I need to take a better look at what I'm doing. Some will say that the coating makes each individual seed more viable.....thus the lower number of seeds (due to coating) will bring the germination rate up to the seeds that have not been coated. Dunno.

Also, I have mostly used "pounds per acre" as a way to determine seed rates. I need to visit that topic more (in a few areas) to determine various mixes I use. I know I sometimes plant an excessive number of seeds and I am wasting money and likely other ill effects from overpopulation.

I never seem to know enough on these topics. I suppose that our judgements are based on the good 'ole "trail and error" methods.....which are learned in the School of Hard Knocks. lol.

 

[FarmerDan]

getting so much coated seed this year......I think I need to take a better look at what I'm doing. Some will say that the coating makes each individual seed more viable.....thus the lower number of seeds (due to coating) will bring the germination rate up to the seeds that have not been coated. Dunno.

I don't know either. I am suspicious of the marketing ploys used by some seed sellers. I believe the seed coatings can do some good. At the same time I'm not sure the extra cost assures a better outcome compared to uncoated seed. I will share my recent experience. It involves my lawn. Truth be known, if I had it to do over again I think I would have pursued a career in turf management. Anyhow, I over seeded my lawn which was in a sad state. My expectations for success were low. But I never given up. I get lazy but I don't give up. The seed I bought was coated...much to my chagrin. Being in a hurry I bought the needed amount, twice the poundage I would have need had it have been pure seed.

I simply broadcast the seed, come what may. It was dry and stayed that way except for a couple showers, those showers that give just enough rain to start germination but not enough to keep things growing. My lawn seed didn't do anything. It laid there for six weeks. And then it rained and rained and rained. Now I have grass, much to my surprise. I can only guess the seed coating provided protection and benefit. So, in this case I am impressed. If I m correct in my thinking, uncoated seed probably would have started germination and then died when it turned dry again.

Also, I have mostly used "pounds per acre" as a way to determine seed rates. I need to visit that topic more (in a few areas) to determine various mixes I use. I know I sometimes plant an excessive number of seeds and I am wasting money and likely other ill effects from overpopulation.

I never seem to know enough on these topics. I suppose that our judgements are based on the good 'ole "trail and error" methods.....which are learned in the School of Hard Knocks. lol.

I think you are right Foggy. Buy some seed and get it into the ground. It isn't rocket science. But, I think we all waste a lot of money on seed, good seed, that isn't going to grow or, if it does, achieve it's full potential. Too many plants? Too few plants? If you start thinking on a plants per acre basis your traditional rates might seem out of whack. There are so many things to consider it might make your eyeballs roll back into your head. However, if you can come to some understanding it is still necessary to play the game of what to do when and in what quantity, but you might save yourself a season or two. We are granted only so many seasons to play this game! And, let me ask, if our goal is improved habitat for growing and keeping game do you think all this discussion about seed characteristics and planting procedures makes much difference?

 

[Foggy47]

I don't know either. I am suspicious of the marketing ploys used by some seed sellers. I believe the seed coatings can do some good. At the same time I'm not sure the extra cost assures a better outcome compared to uncoated seed. I will share my recent experience. It involves my lawn. Truth be known, if I had it to do over again I think I would have pursued a career in turf management. Anyhow, I over seeded my lawn which was in a sad state. My expectations for success were low. But I never given up. I get lazy but I don't give up. The seed I bought was coated...much to my chagrin. Being in a hurry I bought the needed amount, twice the poundage I would have need had it have been pure seed.

I simply broadcast the seed, come what may. It was dry and stayed that way except for a couple showers, those showers that give just enough rain to start germination but not enough to keep things growing. My lawn seed didn't do anything. It laid there for six weeks. And then it rained and rained and rained. Now I have grass, much to my surprise. I can only guess the seed coating provided protection and benefit. So, in this case I am impressed. If I m correct in my thinking, uncoated seed probably would have started germination and then died when it turned dry again.

I think you are right Foggy. Buy some seed and get it into the ground. It isn't rocket science. But, I think we all waste a lot of money on seed, good seed, that isn't going to grow or, if it does, achieve it's full potential. Too many plants? Too few plants? If you start thinking on a plants per acre basis your traditional rates might seem out of whack. There are so many things to consider it might make your eyeballs roll back into your head. However, if you can come to some understanding it is still necessary to play the game of what to do when and in what quantity, but you might save yourself a season or two. We are granted only so many seasons to play this game! And, let me ask, if our goal is improved habitat for growing and keeping game do you think all this discussion about seed characteristics and planting procedures makes much difference?

Yep.....agreed. I'm not here to make a living off the land, yet I only got so many more years to learn the best practices for my little slice of land. Inquiring minds need to know.....lol.

Tho....I think just being smart enough to ask the questions is a step in the right direction. It's all good.

EDIT: Smart Pills

One day two boys were walking through the woods when they saw some rabbit poop. One of the boys said, ''What is that?'' ''They're smart pills,'' said the other boy. ''Eat them and they'll make you smarter. So he ate them and said, ''These taste like poop.'' ''See,'' said the other boy, ''you're already getting smarter.''

 

[T-Max]

I think weed seeds is the number on the tag I look for as much as any. I don’t overly concern myself with germination rate because as has been mentioned, I am seeding in less than ideal conditions usually.


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[bigboreblr]

IT would be great if we had a list of clover seed sources that do not coat.

Nicotinmides, wasted money, or possible uneeded innoculant aside, I just like my seed to be harder for birds to find. Expecially when I'm mixing them in with larger seeds like rye and oats.

Hopefully I am not a throw n mower by this fall and I got a seed drill of some sort.

 

[FarmerDan]

I started a seed tag thread sometime ago. I thought it was a good idea. But it died.

 

[Foggy47]

I started a seed tag thread sometime ago. I thought it was a good idea. But it died.

Funny how that works. Sometimes a certain topic may feel pretty important to me, but other folks just are not on the same page. lol

 

[SD51555]

Funny how that works. Sometimes a certain topic may feel pretty important to me, but other folks just are not on the same page. lol

That's my daily man. I keep finding answers to questions nobody is asking.

 

[TreeDaddy]

That's my daily man. I keep finding answers to questions nobody is asking.

Well.......

You search for answers where the rest of us aren't looking has enriched us all

bill

 

[Foggy47]

Well.......

You search for answers where the rest of us aren't looking has enriched us all

bill

"Enriched" is pretty strong. Don't encourage him! Grin.

 

[TreeDaddy]

Nope

found this in habitat talk dictionary

en.rich/in'riCH. verb. improve or enhance the reading of soil science in an effort to learn what the eff SD is talking about

bill

 

[bigboreblr]

Ordered some seed from seed world. Shipping was very reasonable. They have an optino for ocated or uncoated seed. uncoated was out of stock. Bought 40lbs of crimson clover. Can't see the seed tag online most of the time, including this one. Bag came in 50% coated......... raw seed if in stock was 30% more.

However, I got 100% seed........ A few days later, couldn't find a order or shipping confirmation, or a charge on my debit card. So...... I ordered from outside pride the same thing........ Next day the seed world order came in. Between 10% discount code and only $30 to ship 40lbs, outsidepride was pretty reasonable. I ordered 5lbs of their deer green brassica mix ontop of that.

Now I got 90lbs of crimson clover seed, maybe, maybe 2.5 acres of land to put it on....... Gonna be red carnations for a few summers...... Figured this srping mix with oats. Picked up a whole oats 50lb bag for $20 at the local feed store.

 

[davidhelmly]

Ordered some seed from seed world. Shipping was very reasonable. They have an optino for ocated or uncoated seed. uncoated was out of stock. Bought 40lbs of crimson clover. Can't see the seed tag online most of the time, including this one. Bag came in 50% coated......... raw seed if in stock was 30% more.

However, I got 100% seed........ A few days later, couldn't find a order or shipping confirmation, or a charge on my debit card. So...... I ordered from outside pride the same thing........ Next day the seed world order came in. Between 10% discount code and only $30 to ship 40lbs, outsidepride was pretty reasonable. I ordered 5lbs of their deer green brassica mix ontop of that.

Now I got 90lbs of crimson clover seed, maybe, maybe 2.5 acres of land to put it on....... Gonna be red carnations for a few summers...... Figured this srping mix with oats. Picked up a whole oats 50lb bag for $20 at the local feed store.

I would use 50# of that crimson for 2.5 acres.

 

[jsasker007]

I see so many seeds now contain a "seed coat" which makes for some confusion on my part. We're going to need to calculate the hard seed from the bag of seed we're buying; I have attached a short article from Perdue to detail what will happen if we do not consider these now common seed coat practices. I think many are aware of this practice.....but it can be a huge factor to the occasional plotter folks (like me) .....and we often don't see these tags until the seed is on our doorstep.

I've been somewhat disregarding this coating.......but no more! It's a big factor.

All the more reason to go and get it locally if possible. First the BOB seed was way over priced, now they give you just over half of what you were paying way too much. Take the price and double it is what you're getting. Robbery

 

[Mortenson]

All the more reason to go and get it locally if possible. First the BOB seed was way over priced, now they give you just over half of what you were paying way too much. Take the price and double it is what you're getting. Robbery

There was a company at the IL Classic selling 5 lb bags of cereal rye for $7

 

[Westwind]

There was a company at the IL Classic selling 5 lb bags of cereal rye for $7

The uninformed are complete suckers. I sometimes have to use a seed company in Geneseo when I can’t get out to Welters. I keep a close eye on them, they don’t have a price list online or in a printed catalog and I am pretty sure I get the foodplotter price instead of the ag price sometimes. I know I’m a pain in the ass buying 8 bags compared to a tote but it still bothers me that I feel like I can’t trust them.

 

[Foggy47]

The uninformed are complete suckers. I sometimes have to use a seed company in Geneseo when I can’t get out to Welters. I keep a close eye on them, they don’t have a price list online or in a printed catalog and I am pretty sure I get the foodplotter price instead of the ag price sometimes. I know I’m a pain in the ass buying 8 bags compared to a tote but it still bothers me that I feel like I can’t trust them.

The last I looked at the welter's seed catalog.....it was almost all coated seeds now. Seems more coated seeds are being offered all the time. I'm not sure what to think of this? I think there can be some benefits to coatings.....but you definately are buying fewer live seeds.

I do like the convenience of buying from Welter's. The have a fair shipping price on partial bag orders.....and the availability has been really good for things I want.

 

[Foggy47]

I think weed seeds is the number on the tag I look for as much as any. I don’t overly concern myself with germination rate because as has been mentioned, I am seeding in less than ideal conditions usually.


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One thing I have learned when planting. I (almost) always take a small number of seeds from what I am planing......either in a mix or seperate seeds.......and wrap them in a wet paper towel and put that combo in a plastic sandwich bag. I keep that bag in my house where the light will warm the bag for the next few days.

It's then easy to monitor when germination occurs and the extent of the germination from the contents of that bag. Helps me to look for timely results on my property and any potential seed failure (which almost never happens) .

 

[jsasker007]

It would be nice if they still gave us a choice to buy coated or not. I noticed when I bought some clover and it was blue. Never had a problem with clover germination and wasn't too happy about it myself. Now I just try to do timely mowings and get the very most from my plots that are in clover and chicory. Chicory USED to be affordable but now it's hard to find for under $10 a pound the last time I was looking to buy some.

 

[SD51555]

It would be nice if they still gave us a choice to buy coated or not. I noticed when I bought some clover and it was blue. Never had a problem with clover germination and wasn't too happy about it myself. Now I just try to do timely mowings and get the very most from my plots that are in clover and chicory. Chicory USED to be affordable but now it's hard to find for under $10 a pound the last time I was looking to buy some.

That one always hurts a little.

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