OAKS

[Boone]

We have a 40 that is loaded with 100 yr old oaks . My question is whether to have the logger take them all or keep some standing?

 

[BuckSutherland]

No way on earth I would get rid of them all. If you are gonna take some I would leave a few strategic clumps, and then maybe a few other random ones for regen.

Are you on Agtalk Boone?

 

[Boone]

No way on earth I would get rid of them all. If you are gonna take some I would leave a few strategic clumps, and then maybe a few other random ones for regen.

Are you on Agtalk Boone?

No but I will definitely check it out. thanks

 

[j-bird]

I agree that removing ALL of them would be potentially a bad idea. Much of it is going to depend on what other oaks you have look like from an age and production stand point. Mature oaks tend to produce a stark understory and removing them will get the ground some much needed sunlight to promote cover and browse, as well as some nice timber income, but you have to make sure your not removing the only mast producing food source off the property. If you have plenty of other younger oaks around that are producing then it isn't near as big a deal. There is also something to be said about the look of some old mature oaks as well.

 

[buckdeer1]

Find a forester that also knows habitat.Is the price of oak high enough to cut a 100 year old tree

 

[bwoods11]

A select cut might be the answer?

 

[chickenlittle]

A select cut might be the answer?

Depends on what select cut means to that forester or logger. If it really means high grading, then it is a bad idea.

Hard to make recommendations with no more knowledge. From a deer hunting perspective, it does depend what else is around that block on you and the neighbors. Getting professional help from a forester would be a good idea if they can understand and plan for your goals (i assume income and deer). If the trees are ready, I'd consider clear cutting and leave some small blocks standing. If you could cut half now and half in 5 years, even better.

 

[Boone]

The previous owner was a forester and believes this yr all of the oaks are 100 years old. Im thinking to do it all at once but leaving clumps of 6-8 trees around our stands. As far as 'junk' trees do you guys hinge cut them or have them removed?

 

[Bowsnbucks]

We just did 2 loggings in the past 3 years at my camp. We talked with 4 foresters before we made a decision on what / how much to cut. The 1st question the foresters asked was, " Are you looking for timber income now and in the future, or better habitat for game, or a combination of both ? " We wanted both, but with an edge to habitat. They said to cut most of the red maple and some of the mature oaks, but leave many of the oaks stand for acorn production ( food and regeneration ). They advised us which oaks were the healthiest and we marked those trees that we wanted to let stand with surveyor's tape. The loggers cut the rest. ( It ended up at about 85% red maple cut, and the other 15% cut was oak. ) We also left some hickory trees for nut production / regeneration.

The foresters suggested we plant some spruce seedlings in the cut areas to create more thermal / bedding cover and to cage some of the stumps to protect the " stump sprouts " that would grow from the stumps and roots of cut trees. We did those things and have new, lower growth from stumps that will be great browse / cover, and many new spruce trees growing that will create new bedding areas for deer to shelter from the worst winter weather.

Get several quotes on oak prices before getting cut-heavy. Oak hasn't been up there in price like it was a few years back. Rotational logging, as NH and Chickenlittle said above is a very good plan. Many camps around mine do that and we rotate our cuts too.

 

[j-bird]

If you are having timber cut - have them take everything that is of marketable size, that you are willing to part with. many loggers only want the high end stuff, because they make more money in less time. However that thinking is a great way to have all sorts of large mature junk trees that do nothing for you but block the sunlight. My first timber cut was a recovery from a high-grading cut that happened before my time. All my oaks where crowded by large ash, cottonwood, sycamore, hackberry and other general junk trees. I made some money, but we only removed the trees I said could go. This past summer they returned and removed the walnut as the price had recovered from when it was down during the previous logging. I only hinge cut smaller trees, larger trees are far more dangerous to hinge...If you want a large tree removed and the logger doesn't want it, I think it is best to simply cut it down for firewood or simply let it rot. I retained many oaks and yet the newly available light has caused an explosion in the understory. Logging is a great tool when properly applied. I removed lots of hard maple, ash, hickory, poplar, hackberry, sycamore, and other stuff. We did cut a few oak, cherry and the like, but they where damaged and at risk of only further decay. You also have to understand what you want moving forward. if you want to totally change the trees you have growing you will be looking at essentially a clear-cut and having to replant what you want. If you want more of what you have then a selective cut can get you there.

 

[Boone]

Thanks for the input. This is family owned so trying to find a happy medium is going to be tough. I would like to have half cut now and half in 5 yrs or so. Transforming the woodland sounds like fun. I will definitely be plugging NS and ordering some apple trees. We have never had a good amount of cover on our land so a combo of hard mast, browse, food plots, and security will bring out the most potential our land has to offer. It will be interesting for sure.

 

[TreeDaddy]

I cringe at reading this thread and the thought of cutting ANY oak

sorry

bill

 

[j-bird]

Oaks are just like any other crop - there is a time for harvest. I know that a mature oak flat can be devoid of any sort of understory and other than the acorns it provides very little for deer. It can literally look like your local park under that canopy - but instead of grass it's just dead leaves. Mature oaks have huge, dense crowns that block out tons of light needed for a productive understory. As for harvesting them - good luck. Even 40 acres isn't going to draw a lot of desire from loggers unless the property is literally packed with prime timber. Trying to get them to cut only half that much will be even a bigger challenge. I see it all the time where folks of small properties can't get much interest in logging simply because of the small size of the property and the limited timber available. I have also seem loggers be reluctant to remove the larger low value trees - the ones we REALLY need to have removed, simply because it is barely worth the effort. having prime timber will help, but don;t just let them take just that - you will end up with a stand of "junk" later and then nobody will want to cut it!

 

[Boll Weevil]

I have also seem loggers be reluctant to remove the larger low value trees - the ones we REALLY need to have removed, simply because it is barely worth the effort.

J-bird's absolutely correct on this one.

It's been a few years ago but had some success with a small logging mule logging outfit where I gave him the low value junk trees that were taken to a pulpwood mill. Removing them so remaining crop trees could thrive and habitat improvement was worth far more to me than the puny price per ton they'd add to my check.

Consider the longterm/big picture...it may actually COST timber and wildlife value by leaving a stand of junk timber vs. giving the trees away. If there's enough value in your high-dollar oaks, you might be able to convince your logger to take some of the low-value wood too (if he has a buyer).

 

[chickenlittle]

Every oak is sacred, every oak is great, if an oak is wasted, God gets quite irate.

Nothing wrong with cutting an oak tree if it meets your goals.