How Hard Is Your Place to Work - and Why?

SwampCat

5 year old buck +
I consider my place - on a scale of 1 - 10 - with ten being easiest to work - about a 3. I have an acquantance who had a farm is SE GA - who I envied for the ease it worked. Soil had a lot of sand - one pass with any tillage equipment and would have been ready to plant sod on. Ground was workable the next day after a two inch rain. Close enough to coast where there were regular rain showers, but rarely a flood. Rarely a crop failure

I lose an average of 50% of my planting due mainly to drought, flood, or animals. I have learned not to plant a tree if I cant get running water to it. I once had 15,000 loblolly pines planted and they died in a drought that summer. I had it replanted the following year and it flooded and drowned all the trees three years later. I planted a 20 acre upland pasture with loblolly and every pine was dead in two years - largely due to drought. I have ten or so fruit trees of age to produce - and over the last five or six years - have never got a mature fruit off any of them. Disease or coons have got it all. In the late summer or early fall, I can often drag an 1800 lb, 7 ft wide disk across the ground and not see any disturbed dirt. From Jan through June, I may not be able to get a tractor out of the yard it is so wet. About 75% of the time, a late frost gets the peach and pear bloom. Six months out of the year, a polaris ranger makes ruts six inches deep in the trail.

And I have learned what I can and cant plant. I cant plant brassicas - too hot and dry. I cant plant beans, peas, corn, milo, or sunflowers. The coons, deer, and hogs will ruin it at some point - or floods or drought will get it. I have 15 adjacent land owners - many of them small acreage, with a corn feeder stationed near my property line.

In spite of all that, we have decent deer hunting, some duck, hog, squirrel, turkey, and alligator hunting - all on my property. Also some fishing. After reading a few of the posts on this forum, I wonder if some of these folks realize how easy they have it. I also read some posts on here where it stays so cold so long, they have a very short growing season. Blizzards, bears, and wolves all compound matters for them. Over hunting by neighbors makes deer management difficult.

So, how easy - or challenging - is your property to work?
 
It took many failures before I figured out how to work with the challenges I have. Apple trees are about impossible due to bears. Rye used to be impossible before raised my plots up outta the bowl. The only thing I could grow was white clover, and i eventually lost it to grass because I couldn't grow any rye. Chicory was sparse because of the water. You could darn near canoe across my plots before I figured out how to use that water to my benefit. The water cops confirmed I had no wetlands, and they told me I couldn't move any water off my property. So I asked them if I could dig ponds and move spoils and they said, "Rock on fella."

Years later, things are finally clicking. Still can't do corn because of bears. Can't do beans because I don't have 40 acres of tillable to overcome the pressure. Can't do brassicas for the same reason. Winters can knock it all back no matter what you do. Wolves take their share. I've got a new problem now because the national forest is getting logged hard all around me. My few acres of fresh browse and premium cover ain't the only game in town now.

But I keep at it. Drought doesn't affect me much because I've got very heavy soil, and I am not too many feet away from the ground water. However, I did spray off one plot this year and it's looked like a disaster since because it hasn't rained enough to get it going.

If you ever feel bad about water, think about theses pics. This is what I looked at every spring when I was wondering if this was the year I might get a rye crop. There were years they'd fill up like that all summer long and into the fall. I had to hunt over the tops of the cattle divots where a few oat stems survived the high water.

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Now that I'm nearly done with the terraforming work, I'd give my place a 9 on ease of management within the box of sane practices. Should be down to one day of plot work per year, permanent blinds, nearly drought proof, and i've figured out the preference timing of my forages.
 
I consider my place - on a scale of 1 - 10 - with ten being easiest to work - about a 3. I have an acquantance who had a farm is SE GA - who I envied for the ease it worked. Soil had a lot of sand - one pass with any tillage equipment and would have been ready to plant sod on. Ground was workable the next day after a two inch rain. Close enough to coast where there were regular rain showers, but rarely a flood. Rarely a crop failure

I lose an average of 50% of my planting due mainly to drought, flood, or animals. I have learned not to plant a tree if I cant get running water to it. I once had 15,000 loblolly pines planted and they died in a drought that summer. I had it replanted the following year and it flooded and drowned all the trees three years later. I planted a 20 acre upland pasture with loblolly and every pine was dead in two years - largely due to drought. I have ten or so fruit trees of age to produce - and over the last five or six years - have never got a mature fruit off any of them. Disease or coons have got it all. In the late summer or early fall, I can often drag an 1800 lb, 7 ft wide disk across the ground and not see any disturbed dirt. From Jan through June, I may not be able to get a tractor out of the yard it is so wet. About 75% of the time, a late frost gets the peach and pear bloom. Six months out of the year, a polaris ranger makes ruts six inches deep in the trail.

And I have learned what I can and cant plant. I cant plant brassicas - too hot and dry. I cant plant beans, peas, corn, milo, or sunflowers. The coons, deer, and hogs will ruin it at some point - or floods or drought will get it. I have 15 adjacent land owners - many of them small acreage, with a corn feeder stationed near my property line.

In spite of all that, we have decent deer hunting, some duck, hog, squirrel, turkey, and alligator hunting - all on my property. Also some fishing. After reading a few of the posts on this forum, I wonder if some of these folks realize how easy they have it. I also read some posts on here where it stays so cold so long, they have a very short growing season. Blizzards, bears, and wolves all compound matters for them. Over hunting by neighbors makes deer management difficult.

So, how easy - or challenging - is your property to work?
I feel like deer browse is our biggest challenge. And the next biggest challenge isn’t even close enough for me to really have thought of what it is … probably my equipment.
 
My place is 50% upland ,50% creek bottom so will say "5"

Bottomland is only workable aug and september before the rains predispose to deep ruts, stuck equipment,etc

Upland challenges include goatweed,fire ants,feral hogs,sweetgum and fire blight that i am able to work/manage all year provided my equipment stays healthy

bill
 
Geez, not anywhere on the same level of difficulty shown by @SwampCat and @SD51555, maybe a 7? Since so much of the rec ground is just land that didn't lend itself to farming, there's probably lots of similar stories of struggle like in the first 2 posts but you guys have gone beyond the call of duty.

I find myself wishing my dirt was as good as the many row crop fields surrounding us in central MN - better draining, fewer rocks, deeper topsoil, better fertility, etc but converting hay that is sometimes poorly drained or flooded to food and cover good enough for deer isn't that hard. Enough tillable for beans/corn sure sounds appealing for having a better late season draw after the cereals and clover get buried in snow but not having associated expenses/time that would accompany planting corn/beans may be a blessing in disguise.

I'm not sure i'm ambitious enough to take on the project but i'm intrigued a little by the thought of digging the 2' deep canals for drainage across my fields deeper and using the cut to bring the low ground higher after hearing about SD's digs. Not sure if the "water cops" would be cool with it moving more water to the river that cuts through my place though?
 
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Super easy on my place! But I love getting to tinker and seldom work against what I've naturally got to work with.
 
Geez, not anywhere on the same level of difficulty shown by @SwampCat and @SD51555, maybe a 7? Since so much of the rec ground is just land that didn't lend itself to farming, there's probably lots of similar stories of struggle like in the first 2 posts but you guys have gone beyond the call of duty.

I find myself wishing my dirt was as good as the many row crop fields surrounding us in central MN - better draining, fewer rocks, deeper topsoil, better fertility, etc but converting hay that is sometimes poorly drained or flooded to food and cover good enough for deer isn't that hard. Enough tillable for beans/corn sure sounds appealing for having a better late season draw after the cereals and clover get buried in snow but not having associated expenses/time that would accompany planting corn/beans may be a blessing in disguise.

I'm not sure i'm ambitious enough to take on the project but i'm intrigued a little by the thought of digging the 2' deep canals for drainage across my fields deeper and using the cut to bring the low ground higher after hearing about SD's digs. Not sure if the "water cops" would be cool with it moving more water to the river that cuts through my place though?
Careful. Once you get the earth moving bug, you'll want to do more. After every project I swear I'm done. Then I observe it for a year and get more ideas, and before you know it, dirt is flying again.
 
It took many failures before I figured out how to work with the challenges I have. Apple trees are about impossible due to bears. Rye used to be impossible before raised my plots up outta the bowl. The only thing I could grow was white clover, and i eventually lost it to grass because I couldn't grow any rye. Chicory was sparse because of the water. You could darn near canoe across my plots before I figured out how to use that water to my benefit. The water cops confirmed I had no wetlands, and they told me I couldn't move any water off my property. So I asked them if I could dig ponds and move spoils and they said, "Rock on fella."

Years later, things are finally clicking. Still can't do corn because of bears. Can't do beans because I don't have 40 acres of tillable to overcome the pressure. Can't do brassicas for the same reason. Winters can knock it all back no matter what you do. Wolves take their share. I've got a new problem now because the national forest is getting logged hard all around me. My few acres of fresh browse and premium cover ain't the only game in town now.

But I keep at it. Drought doesn't affect me much because I've got very heavy soil, and I am not too many feet away from the ground water. However, I did spray off one plot this year and it's looked like a disaster since because it hasn't rained enough to get it going.

If you ever feel bad about water, think about theses pics. This is what I looked at every spring when I was wondering if this was the year I might get a rye crop. There were years they'd fill up like that all summer long and into the fall. I had to hunt over the tops of the cattle divots where a few oat stems survived the high water.

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Can you work that wet ground into a duck hole?
 
Can you work that wet ground into a duck hole?
Possibly. I'm in duck country, but don't see much for ducks in the fall. The ponds I've already dug get used by ducks a lot in the spring, but never see them in the fall. Most of the time, they've been getting pretty dry in the fall. These are all right in my bowhunting area, so no duck hunting for me.

I found a mallard nest in one of the first clear cuts I ever did. It was tiny, but hen thought it was a good spot. Nice and thick.
 
This is one time I'm glad for having small scale plots. My property is primarily on the shade side of a ridge, so sunlight is limited. In the woods the topsoil is very thin, about an inch or two and then it's nothing but rocks underneath. And I mean nothing but rocks. Hardly any soil. I've been trying to build the soil up for the last couple of years but my rye which comes in pretty thick in the fall usually is pretty sparse by spring. I might have to start doing some summer plots. I turned the yard of my camp into a plot a few years ago. This is the only part of my property that actually has soil but it's pretty clayey because it's where all the runoff from the ridge collects. There is also a spring there so it gets pretty wet. Easily the best place to grow anything though. The same goes for planting trees. My tree planting typically goes, scrape off the topsoil then start pickaxing rocks loose then I just pick the rocks out by hand because it's easier than using a shovel. Put tree in and dump in the 5 gallon bucket of potting soil I had to bring with me.

My plots actually grow better in the shade. I suspect it's probably due to the thin topsoil that dries out quickly in the sun. The shaded areas probably retain more moisture. The one thing that sucks is that I can't really grow anything fancy. I put in PTT and radish every year but they typically don't amount to much. Rarely get a bulb other than at the camp plot.
 
Mine are pretty easy to work I’d say 8 or 9 on your scale for the most part on the new farm I do have several acres of very thin topsoil that is unworkable but the same farm has a creek bottom with some fantastic deep soil so it’s a good mixture. We do suffer from drought some years most years we have a normal July August drought but the last couple years have been much worse than that but it will likely cycle back to wetter conditions. On the other farm probably about 400 of the 640 are tillable acres. Heavy soil not full on clay but a pretty high clay content verdigris soil for the most part. I do have some higher mineral content rock and soil conditions on a couple areas of the larger farm ponds dug in those soils tend to be much more weed free and clearer water ponds than the others are.
 
Man! I guess I won't complain about my little piece of the rock in Upper Michigan. Yes, we have wolves, too many bears and coyotes, too short of a growing season and plenty of rocks in the otherwise very good soil, but some of you guys face much more difficult challenges. Initially, upon reading SwampCats first paragraph I would have said we were about a 4 out of 10 in difficulty, but in comparison to some of you guys we are probably actually a 7 or 8.

Flooding? This is the only food plot where I have ever had a flooding issue and I is in early spring just after the snow melts...
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By early June it is starting to dry up pretty well...
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and by late summer you would never know it had ever been wet. Some years it never gets wet at all. You may also take note of the large rock pile on the right side of this plot which is only 1 of 3 rock piles I made when we opened up this plot after a timber harvest.
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I only have 16 acres of food plots scattered throughout our 160 acres (10%) but I can still get beans in our larger plots (3.5 acres) when we keep the deer numbers down.
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and if I E-Fence them I can get beans in smaller plots.
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Same thing with corn, although I don't grow much corn anymore. Inputs are too expensive and since I don't combine it, I have to deal with corn stalks for a few years after planting, but I have grown pretty good corn. I started out using a John Deere 7000 planter...
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but I have even grown fairly decent corn with my no-till drill.
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Sugar beets...
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Bears have killed about 25-30 apple trees over the years but if I fence them out I can grow pretty nice apple trees.
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In recent years I have even started growing alfalfa.
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So, while I have had to do 3 timber harvests to clear the openings, and I have put a lot of work into bull dozing out stumps and rocks, I do have pretty good soil when it is done. I'll try not to complain too much about the difficulty of maintaining this place in the future...
 
Roads are my nemesis. I went from a place where the previous owner graveled several miles of roads to this crap
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I have a really big steep hill that so far prevents me from accessing about half my place with certain equipment. I only feel comfortable bringing the small tractor up and down it and even the back up will make you pucker when the front wheels come off the ground.
I spend all the time I should be doing habitat work dealing with roads. I have lived on the mini and skid steer this summer shaping and ditching what I can. It’s not my favorite work. So I’d say a 3 cause of that.
 
Man! I guess I won't complain about my little piece of the rock in Upper Michigan. Yes, we have wolves, too many bears and coyotes, too short of a growing season and plenty of rocks in the otherwise very good soil, but some of you guys face much more difficult challenges. Initially, upon reading SwampCats first paragraph I would have said we were about a 4 out of 10 in difficulty, but in comparison to some of you guys we are probably actually a 7 or 8.

Flooding? This is the only food plot where I have ever had a flooding issue and I is in early spring just after the snow melts...
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By early June it is starting to dry up pretty well...
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and by late summer you would never know it had ever been wet. Some years it never gets wet at all. You may also take note of the large rock pile on the right side of this plot which is only 1 of 3 rock piles I made when we opened up this plot after a timber harvest.
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I only have 16 acres of food plots scattered throughout our 160 acres (10%) but I can still get beans in our larger plots (3.5 acres) when we keep the deer numbers down.
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and if I E-Fence them I can get beans in smaller plots.
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Same thing with corn, although I don't grow much corn anymore. Inputs are too expensive and since I don't combine it, I have to deal with corn stalks for a few years after planting, but I have grown pretty good corn. I started out using a John Deere 7000 planter...
View attachment 54465

but I have even grown fairly decent corn with my no-till drill.
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Sugar beets...
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Bears have killed about 25-30 apple trees over the years but if I fence them out I can grow pretty nice apple trees.
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In recent years I have even started growing alfalfa.
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So, while I have had to do 3 timber harvests to clear the openings, and I have put a lot of work into bull dozing out stumps and rocks, I do have pretty good soil when it is done. I'll try not to complain too much about the difficulty of maintaining this place in the future...
Wildthing, are you opening up your orchards for deer in the fall or do you harvest the apples? I've thought about not individually fencing each tree but I want the deer to clean up the leftover apples too..
 
Mine is good except winter access is hard so I'd give it a 7 out of 10. Winter is hard to access when the long drive is buried under 3 feet of snow. I want to build a small cabin so I have a good reason to go plow and maintain the driveway in the winter.

The hardest part to get work done for me is finding time! 2 young kids and wife keep me busy. They come out to the land with me a lot too and we all enjoy it but on those trips together I get very little work done!
 
Wildthing, are you opening up your orchards for deer in the fall or do you harvest the apples? I've thought about not individually fencing each tree but I want the deer to clean up the leftover apples too..
No - I still have some small trees in the fenced orchard so I don't want them in there. I have 25 trees inside the fenced orchard - we call it the "People Orchard". My wife freezes apples for pies, dehydrates apples for family and friends and we give many of them away. Those that are left over go to the wildlife.

I used to toss the leftovers over the fence for the deer. I would toss 40-50 apples over the fence every night and they would be long gone before morning. We had a single CWD positive deer in our county in 2018 so the DNR banned the feeding of deer so we quit doing that. We never had another positive CWD deer after 5 years and a few thousand tests so they recently lifted the feeding ban. The deer will be happy this winter. You can see that the deer have trampled down the snow looking for the apples...
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Last year a flock of about 25 turkeys discovered the apple orchard and they would fly in 2-3 times per day and have their fill. Not many deer tracks outside the orchard last year but you can see that every square inch of the snow inside the fence was trampled down by turkeys 😄

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We do have a lot of other apple and crabapple trees throughout the property in various stages of maturity so they can find apples elsewhere.

Here is a pic of some of the Honey Crisp harvest...
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Future apple pie...
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More apple pies...
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No - I still have some small trees in the fenced orchard so I don't want them in there. I have 25 trees inside the fenced orchard - we call it the "People Orchard". My wife freezes apples for pies, dehydrates apples for family and friends and we give many of them away. Those that are left over go to the wildlife.

I used to toss the leftovers over the fence for the deer. I would toss 40-50 apples over the fence every night and they would be long gone before morning. We had a single CWD positive deer in our county in 2018 so the DNR banned the feeding of deer so we quit doing that. We never had another positive CWD deer after 5 years and a few thousand tests so they recently lifted the feeding ban. The deer will be happy this winter. You can see that the deer have trampled down the snow looking for the apples...
View attachment 54489

Last year a flock of about 25 turkeys discovered the apple orchard and they would fly in 2-3 times per day and have their fill. Not many deer tracks outside the orchard last year but you can see that every square inch of the snow inside the fence was trampled down by turkeys 😄

View attachment 54490

We do have a lot of other apple and crabapple trees throughout the property in various stages of maturity so they can find apples elsewhere.

Here is a pic of some of the Honey Crisp harvest...
View attachment 54491

View attachment 54492

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View attachment 54495

Future apple pie...
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More apple pies...
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Looks delicious, that's my dream for my orchard! I guess I'll keep planting and expand in other areas, so they can have some too....
 
No - I still have some small trees in the fenced orchard so I don't want them in there. I have 25 trees inside the fenced orchard - we call it the "People Orchard". My wife freezes apples for pies, dehydrates apples for family and friends and we give many of them away. Those that are left over go to the wildlife.

I used to toss the leftovers over the fence for the deer. I would toss 40-50 apples over the fence every night and they would be long gone before morning. We had a single CWD positive deer in our county in 2018 so the DNR banned the feeding of deer so we quit doing that. We never had another positive CWD deer after 5 years and a few thousand tests so they recently lifted the feeding ban. The deer will be happy this winter. You can see that the deer have trampled down the snow looking for the apples...
View attachment 54489

Last year a flock of about 25 turkeys discovered the apple orchard and they would fly in 2-3 times per day and have their fill. Not many deer tracks outside the orchard last year but you can see that every square inch of the snow inside the fence was trampled down by turkeys 😄

View attachment 54490

We do have a lot of other apple and crabapple trees throughout the property in various stages of maturity so they can find apples elsewhere.

Here is a pic of some of the Honey Crisp harvest...
View attachment 54491

View attachment 54492

View attachment 54493

View attachment 54494

View attachment 54495

Future apple pie...
View attachment 54497

More apple pies...
View attachment 54496
Awesome man!
 
Roads are my nemesis. I went from a place where the previous owner graveled several miles of roads to this crap
View attachment 54470

I have a really big steep hill that so far prevents me from accessing about half my place with certain equipment. I only feel comfortable bringing the small tractor up and down it and even the back up will make you pucker when the front wheels come off the ground.
I spend all the time I should be doing habitat work dealing with roads. I have lived on the mini and skid steer this summer shaping and ditching what I can. It’s not my favorite work. So I’d say a 3 cause of that.
Man, that would drive me crazy! Well… it does drive me crazy on some places I hunt and I don’t have the equipment you do. Does it impact huntability of the property for you?
 
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