Bucks fighting in January

[gunther89]

Checked a few cameras yesterday and noticed a ton of fighting on them. Had a 4 year old that fought with 2 different 3 year old's and sparred with some yearling bucks too. I was hoping for some antlers to pop off but that was wishful thinking. Do bucks normally fight in January? I would think they wouldn't want to waste the energy on fighting and just worry more about getting food.

 

[phil@thesidehill]

Checked a few cameras yesterday and noticed a ton of fighting on them. Had a 4 year old that fought with 2 different 3 year old's and sparred with some yearling bucks too. I was hoping for some antlers to pop off but that was wishful thinking. Do bucks normally fight in January? I would think they wouldn't want to waste the energy on fighting and just worry more about getting food.

i think its all dependent on testosterone levels and attitude. Plus the bachelor groups are just starting to get back to together again, so they need to reestablish the social hierarchy again. I get pics of bucks working out the pecking order in January pretty frequently. anything from extended pushing and shoving sequences to lighter sparring and posturing is fairly common for me this time of year. As the testosterone levels drop and the groups get back in order the fighting stops. but some bucks are just mean and aggressive and will pick fights whenever.

 

[Buffalohunter1]

Checked a few cameras yesterday and noticed a ton of fighting on them. Had a 4 year old that fought with 2 different 3 year old's and sparred with some yearling bucks too. I was hoping for some antlers to pop off but that was wishful thinking. Do bucks normally fight in January? I would think they wouldn't want to waste the energy on fighting and just worry more about getting food.

It's very common for them to spar through out the Winter up until they shed their antlers.

 

[Bill]

i think its all dependent on testosterone levels and attitude. Plus the bachelor groups are just starting to get back to together again, so they need to reestablish the social hierarchy again. I get pics of bucks working out the pecking order in January pretty frequently. anything from extended pushing and shoving sequences to lighter sparring and posturing is fairly common for me this time of year. As the testosterone levels drop and the groups get back in order the fighting stops. but some bucks are just mean and aggressive and will pick fights whenever.

^ ^ What he said.

I'm still getting lots of tickling pics. No real fighting but posturing.

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[Steve Oehlenschlager]

After spending quite a bit of time photographing them. The gravitational attraction of deer antlers to other deers antlers is just too great. They see another buck and they just have to come on over to show who's boss. Most of the time it seems like the smaller bucks are the instigators as well.

 

[Bill]

Steve may be on to something. From today. There like magnets on their head.

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[Native Hunter]

Same thing going on here in the eastern heartland. Lot of pics of fighting the last time I checked.

 

[Bill]

1/29 and their still at it. I don't think the little buck on the left realizes his antlers fell off already :)

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[Steve Bartylla]

Outside of Late Sept-Dec, I see it very much like brothers wrestling. they're just messing around, unwittingly honing their skills for when it really matters. However, like nearly every wrestling match between brothers, every now and then the younger brother does a little better than they should or does something to bug the other. So, the younger one gets a good punch to the gut and the wrestling between them is over for the day.

 

[Bill]

Steve
That sounds a lot like the way it was when I was kid. When we got old enough to draw blood it slowed down quite a bit :)


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[Steve Bartylla]

Exactly, Bill. That's essentially why you don't see the big boys play spare much with each other. It's typically 2 youngsters or a youngster and a mature buck. Mature bucks seem to be fine play sparing with the youngsters, as they control that situation and don't seem concerned with it getting out of hand...and if it does, they'll be the one drawing blood. 2 mature bucks is a recipe for things getting out of control and resulting in a good blood letting on both sides.

I've said it before, but I don't think most truly grasp how nasty and life threatening true fights are between 2 mature bucks. As I type, there are 4, 4.5+ yr old bucks that I know of, just on the properties I'm managing that were either killed fighting (1) or at very high risk of death this winter because of injuries I'm at least 90% sure they received while fighting (3). I'm hoping 2 of them are able to limp through and make it, but 1 of them is so gimped up and lost so much weight from it already that there's no realistic hope of his survival, meaning the best case is that only 2 mature bucks on the grounds I manage will have died from fighting last season, which would be a great year for me. Combine the grounds I manage and one is looking at a yearly average of between 2500-4500 acres. I'd say 3-7 die from fighting each year.

Mature buck fights are nasty and I've come to strongly believe that they are no where near as frequent and are far more life threatening than most believe. In fact, I'm convinced that more mature bucks than not try to avoid them, if they can...When it most often gets nasty is when another mature buck tries to claim a section of a reigning King's ground. So long as they all have their own corner of the world to dominate, I've come to believe that pitifully few have the desire to get in real fights, as they are big enough to draw blood and it isn't a game anymore to them.

 

[Bill]

I'm one of those who never really gave death because of fighting much of thought.

I have only once seen a real fight take place. One rifle season I was about to drop the hammer on a buck locked down with a doe when out of nowhere came a fierce grunt that lead to a knock down drag out fight. Me being greedy, I kept trying to decide who was nicer before I shot. I never did shoot because they jumped, rolled and did back flips until they got where there was no good shot. I can tell you from watching it they weren't fooling around and they fought until they were out sight. One would back off and the other would chase him down and start it all over. Probably one of the most awesome things I've seen while hunting.

 

[Steve Bartylla]

In all the years I've spent in the deer woods, about 40% of that time being in areas with a good number of mature bucks, I've only been there to witness 3 that I can think of, being lucky enough to get 2 on film start to finish. To anyone that questions the brutality, I'd suggest trying to break just 1 tine off a 3.5+ year old's shed some time. The force it takes is pretty impressive...Then think about what it takes to back the main beam of a 4.5+, which is far from uncommon. Even the winner most often pays a very high price for those battles.

IME, relatively few are killed during the battle. The real mortality comes weeks, months, even a year or more later, when those old injuries become too much to handle. The one this year that's already dead on his hooves sustained a bad front leg injury from a fight in late Oct. I passed him gimping around me on two different sits, as he was trying to fight through it to dog does and chase off younger bucks. I should have arrowed him. Despite being 4.5 and about to enter the prime of his life, his Jan pic makes him look like a hobbled 10.5+ year old buck, just a broken down skeleton of what he was even in late Nov when I passed him last. Dogging does and chasing off youngsters can result in a 25-30% weight loss during the rut for "healthy" mature bucks. Now imagine what it does to one that's working with 3 functional legs.

 

[Steve Bartylla]

As a side note, that's a big part of why I design properties the way I do. When the ground allows for it, offering everything a mature buck wants and needs in multiple areas not only helps stack the odds of that ground being able to get more mature bucks to create core areas on it than it otherwise would, but I believe it also reduces the odds of them killing each other, when compared to those that focus on concentrating buck activities on very limited amounts of fall candy crops. When done "right," you can still be every bit as effective in hunting those bucks, but you are also building better hunts in future years and helping those bucks reduce their stress levels, as opposed to putting those stress levels on steroids and unwittingly trying to get them to kill each other.

 

[Bowsnbucks]

I've never actually SEEN a real fight between bucks, but I HEARD one and saw the aftermath from one.
I was in a tree stand in archery season in a very remote area probably around 1980. It got dark and I was about to get down when I heard some really aggressive grunting coming near my location from 2 different directions. I figured Id stay up in the tree and listen and get some first-hand lessons on grunting /vocalizations. What ensued sounded really scary. Smashing antlers and hooves pounding the ground, lots of panting - grunting / wheezing. They broke apart a couple times and the last time the one buck charged the other and it sounded like it knocked all the air out of the other buck. One ran off in high gear and the other chased it making a " roaring " sound occasionally. ( this was all in pitch black darkness ). I didn't want to get down ( !!! ) and in about 10 minutes, the winner came back to my area stomping his feet and grunting continuously. He eventually took off chasing some does about 1/2 hr. later. I still gave him ANOTHER 1/2 hr. before I got down from my tree !!!

Once while hunting in Maine, I saw where 2 bucks had fought ( snow on the ground ). What a scary sight that was. Small firs and spruce knocked over, blood on the snow - hair. I wouldn't want to be in the area when a fight broke out !!! ( un-armed )

 

[huntall]

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[huntall]

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[browndog]

I had a bunch of fighting going on too. Would have been a good spot to find a pile of antlers if they would have been dropping. Four bucks in this spot, all 2.5 and 3.5yr olds.

 

[bueller]

That trail is well beaten down :eek:. Nice bucks!

 

[browndog]

That trail is well beaten down :eek:. Nice bucks!

There were quite a few fights happening in front of this cam and I kept telling myself to stick a vid cam there, but like a dumba$$ I never did. I found my first shed antler 30yds behind this cam on that trail.