Any one been involved with Tony?

[Eggman]

My son and I were at a hunting show today. Tony was giving a seminar on improving your land for Whitetails. It was very interesting but also far fetched on so some aspects.

Anyone else have any experience with him? Is his ideas fufu dust or trust worthy?


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[swat1018]

He's pretty polarizing, people either love him or hate him. I'm sure he knows his stuff, though.

 

[Bill]

Tony gets a bad rap but he brings it on himself :). He's a bit of an ego maniac and
I don't like the "my way" is the only way feeling he puts off. But I learned some things from him. His hunting techniques are strict. He was the first guy to make 0 pressure sink in for me. But the other professionals also teach this.

Keep in mind he is geared towards smaller properties. I think his MI property is 27 acres. Not sure how big the Ohio property is. But on larger tracts of land, IMO, his methods would be a full time career for someone to establish and maintain. The list of "ultimates" is a bit fufu but its marketing and it's his business. You have to market yourself. Other then the ego jab I can't talk bad about what he teaches. It just wasn't all my cup of tea and I didn't like the way it looked. But hey he's shooting decent deer in a high pressure area.

I've been to Tony's boot camp but I've also walked property with Jeff Sturgis and paid Steve Bartylla for a plan. This is my hobby/passion so I've never been bothered by the professionals like some are. In my mind if someone is making a mortgage payment at this I can pick something up from them.

Steve and Jeff would both get my recommendation if someone was going to shell out cash. I just like their approach better. You go see what Tony has done which is great but with Steve and Jeff they look at your land specifically and give you a plan. Chris who works with Tony will come to your place but it's extra $ (no clue how much)

Jeff is boots on the ground so it cost a bit more. Steve uses Aerial pictures and consults with you over the phone so it's not as pricey.

Just my .2 cents on the topic.

 

[j-bird]

I have never met the man or been to his camp or the like. I'll echo Bill's comments though....I spend my money on Jeff Sturgis and Steve Bartylla (books and the like - no actual property eval). I really like Steve's style. I don't know why, I just do. Another guy I have met and like is Jim Ward as well. I have seen his work first hand as well.

 

[yoderjac]

I've got some magic beans I'll sell you but you need to sign a non-disclosure first...

 

[TreeDaddy]

I enjoy reading all of these fellas(Ward,Sturgis,Bartylla,Woods,etc)

All seem to enjoy success with variation of themes easily accessible on this forum

I am doubtful this non-disclosure would hold in litigation

Seems a bit silly

bill

 

[Bill]

I am doubtful this non-disclosure would hold in litigation

Tony tried to sue whitetail ambush years ago because the guy that runs that company was a former attendee of boot camp. the case was dismissed or dropped. Lawyer probably logged on to sites like this and found out there is no secret batter.

I'm still not opposed to a guy using these services though. We're a nutty bunch that kinda eats this stuff up. The average Joe won't or can't delve into the habitat thing like some of us.

 

[yoderjac]

If you're looking for some kind of shortcut to success, buy my magic beans instead. If you are just looking for one more perspective like all the others and you have the money to part with, go for it. The bottom line is that there is not secret sauce. Whether you are learning about management here, on other free forums, through reading QW or websites, it boils down to learning and hard work.

The thing I like most about the forum approach is that it is steel sharpening steel. Each time someone makes a proposition, others are quick to identify holes or conditions where it doesn't work. While there are some high-level principles that apply pretty much across the board, most of deer management is local. It boils down to assessing your local situation. Making "buck beds" may be quite effective in one location and be a laughable waste of time in another.

I much prefer a community of folks freely sharing ideas, successes, and failures to a "pay me some money and I'll tell you my secrets" approach where folks walk away thinking they have the gospel. This is not to disparage Tony over others who take the same marketing approach. From my perspective they are all in the same boat. Some just take it further than others...

lawsuits between folks in the hunting community....Just what PETA is looking for!

Thanks,

Jack

 

[John-W-WI]

I've been to his boot camp. He's out there a little bit, but pretty sharp too.

The only thing I would say that hasn't already been said:

He undoubtedly made me look at the deer woods differently. I wouldn't say everything he taught us at boot camp was useful to me, but I would say his approach was. You can learn almost everything he teaches on forums like this. But if you don't know the question to ask, it's difficult to find the answer. It's a "you don't know, what you don't know" situation.

Tony was a trail blazer long before many others even considered that people would do crazy things for deer. Several consultants attended his bootcamp long before they started their business. But they still have their place and so does Tony.

I don't now what the cost of his boot camp is now days, but I think it was something like $750 when I went. Some will argue that is highway robbery (more often than not, by people that never went). I always looked at it as less than the cost of a half acre of land.

I'm glad I went, but wouldn't need to go again.

-John

 

[sandbur]

I am another person who likes Steve's approach.

A lot can be learned from a group of experienced land managers/hunters who just get together and walk each other property. I have learned a lot in that way. Several of my friends have had Steve to there land or have gotten very good tips from him.

 

[Tap]

I've been to his camp, but it was several years ago. I learned a lot, but at the time I wasn't a forum junkie, so a lot of it was new to me. I've learned a lot more from the good people on these forums and their hundreds of individual laboratories. You can learn most of what he teaches on these forums, BUT, a "boots-on-the-ground" experience does teach some things that you just can't get from being on a computer.
Does all of his concepts apply to every property, everywhere in the country? No. Is his way the only way to improve a property? Definately not. Is bootcamp expensive? Maybe. It depends on your financial situation, so that aspect is your call. Am I glad I went? Mostly satisfied.
The biggest benefit that I got, as an owner of a small property, is actually seeing how "big" a small property can hunt with extensive habitat manipulation. And he's surely manipulated his acreage to an amazing degree. Tony's ~50 acres definately hunts "big".
Tony is a bit abrasive and hard-headed, though. But I can overlook some undesirable personality traits if that person can teach me something.

 

[bigbendmarine]

Don't know Tony so don't say this in any way judging him, but I'm a big fan of Steve and I'll do my best to share why.

In an industry filled with hard-sellers in my interactions with him he came across as the opposite... not that I didn't sense he knew his stuff (much appreciate he does), but for what might be called just an "aerial study" he asked a ton of logical "boots on the ground" questions up front that struck me all as being sensible, really dug into what goals I had for my land both hunting wise and OTHER wise, and then really tailored a plan that took a ton of things into account.

He then put all the ideas into an interactive map form that was instantly accessible online with a single link click, and after allowing me time to review it had a LONG follow-up phone call with me where he patiently answered as many questions as I could think to ask him, all while maintaining a super friendly "awww shucks" just plain ol' nice personality. And while he was being so humble and nice I still sensed a driving passion behind the work that, if being honest, left me a bit jealous in seeing someone love their work so much (and I like my own fairly well!).

 

[yoderjac]

I've been to his camp, but it was several years ago. I learned a lot, but at the time I wasn't a forum junkie, so a lot of it was new to me. I've learned a lot more from the good people on these forums and their hundreds of individual laboratories. You can learn most of what he teaches on these forums, BUT, a "boots-on-the-ground" experience does teach some things that you just can't get from being on a computer.
Does all of his concepts apply to every property, everywhere in the country? No. Is his way the only way to improve a property? Definately not. Is bootcamp expensive? Maybe. It depends on your financial situation, so that aspect is your call. Am I glad I went? Mostly satisfied.
The biggest benefit that I got, as an owner of a small property, is actually seeing how "big" a small property can hunt with extensive habitat manipulation. And he's surely manipulated his acreage to an amazing degree. Tony's ~50 acres definately hunts "big".
Tony is a bit abrasive and hard-headed, though. But I can overlook some undesirable personality traits if that person can teach me something.

Great review. Nothing beats boots on the ground and dirt under the nails. No doubt about that. The thing I find funny is trying to call them "trade secrets". I use a variety of consultants. I may be lucky but most are free. I've used state foresters and department of game biologists and USDA biologists. What is great about USDA is that not only will they provide the consulting free, they will pay me to do much of it!

Thanks,

Jack

 

[bwoods11]

I have read about Tony, but I could never figure out if I read this correctly? Does he hold his boot camps on his 52 acres? If so, how the heck do deer stick around after this disturbance?

 

[TenPoint]

I have read about Tony, but I could never figure out if I read this correctly? Does he hold his boot camps on his 52 acres? If so, how the heck do deer stick around after this disturbance?

Trade secrets...

 

[John-W-WI]

I have read about Tony, but I could never figure out if I read this correctly? Does he hold his boot camps on his 52 acres? If so, how the heck do deer stick around after this disturbance?

When I went, he only did boot camps during the off season. And we walked almost every square inch of his land.

As to trade secrets, IMHO he had ideas many people now call "freely available information". It wasn't freely available when I went to his boot camp 10 years ago. It certainly is now. I guess they weren't secrets afterall

-John

 

[Fall's Legend]

Tony tried to sue whitetail ambush years ago because the guy that runs that company was a former attendee of boot camp. the case was dismissed or dropped. Lawyer probably logged on to sites like this and found out there is no secret batter.

I'm still not opposed to a guy using these services though. We're a nutty bunch that kinda eats this stuff up. The average Joe won't or can't delve into the habitat thing like some of us.

Bill,
I admire your professionalism!

 

[Fall's Legend]

Great review. Nothing beats boots on the ground and dirt under the nails. No doubt about that. The thing I find funny is trying to call them "trade secrets". I use a variety of consultants. I may be lucky but most are free. I've used state foresters and department of game biologists and USDA biologists. What is great about USDA is that not only will they provide the consulting free, they will pay me to do much of it!

Thanks,

Jack

Spot on Jack!

 

[homegrownbucks]

I have been there a few times, he has an incredible piece of property for sure. There are certainly many ways to have a great deer property but he has a very good, albeit labor intensive system that works.

I will go back again at some point. Not sure if anyone has seen his blip on the latest ed spin DVD but it sounds/looks like his Ohio property is out of this world, seeing up to 30 bucks a day etc.

 

[Bill]

Bill,
I admire your professionalism!

Thank you for the kind words. Glad we met later in my life and I took this on later in life. When I was younger I'd stink at this and be far to right about everything. :). Time kinda hones the rough edges. Funny how the years teach you know a lot but at the end of the day you don't really know much.