Tractor buying tips

[Dukslayr]

This is a big of a follow up post to my earlier post about implements. Thank you for all the input on that post. Based on a conversation I had with my accountant it appears that I’ll be selling my current tractor (Kubota L3830) and buying a different one in 2019. So, my search for a new (to me) tractor has begun. I’m not a tractor or farming guru, quite the opposite in fact. Any suggestions or thoughts from buying, owning and operating various tractors that you all would provide? Here are my thoughts going into the search, what else should I add to list, or any suggestions between various tractor manufacturers you can give?

1. Buy bugger than I think I need. 60 HP is what I think will do me...so I’m guessing I should be looking in the 75-90 HP (engine) range. I’m wanting to pull or lift a no-till drill at some point as long as a variety of other routine activities that won’t take all the HP. A no till drill is probably going to be the most demanding implement I deal with.

2. Buy something that I can get serviced somewhat close by. I don’t work on tractors myself so I need a dealer close by to handle all repairs and such. That leaves me with looking for a John Deere, Kubota or Case (Massey works too) as those are the dealers I know I have in relatively close proximity. Anyone have any thoughts between these brands? I love my Kubota and it’s given me no problems...but open to other tractors.

3. I’m planning to buy used. Any real reason I should consider new? I’m assuming tractors are somewhat like trucks, they lost about 25% of their value when you drive them off the lot?

4. I’m undecided about buying from an individual VS dealer but leaning towards buying from a dealer. I know I’ll pay more but I’m hoping to get some peace of mind with knowing the tractor has been gone through and checked out.

5. I have a hydrostatic transmission right now and love it. I don’t know if the tractors in the 75-95hp range are equipped with that option but if they do I will be going that direction.

What else should I be thinking about? Any recommendations on one manufacturer over another? Thank you for any input.

Thomas

 

[swat1018]

You are a Kubota fan, I'm a Deere fan. I think either are fine. A loader is a must, I'm sure you know that. I have a JD 5400, I think it's the perfect size for a 6' drill. If you are going with a 6' no till, don't get too big a tractor, or you won't cover your tire tracks. Front assist or 4x4 would also be a requirement for me. I would also consider a cab tractor, N. MO weather is always at one extreme or another. I like a Hydrostat for loader work, but prefer a standard transmission for ground engaging implements, it's nice just to find the right gear and throttle, and drive along seeding. I have the 3 point drill, which is more demanding as far as a tractor goes, than the pull type. Can't think of anything else to add...

 

[Dukslayr]

You are a Kubota fan, I'm a Deere fan. I think either are fine. A loader is a must, I'm sure you know that. I have a JD 5400, I think it's the perfect size for a 6' drill. If you are going with a 6' no till, don't get too big a tractor, or you won't cover your tire tracks. Front assist or 4x4 would also be a requirement for me. I would also consider a cab tractor, N. MO weather is always at one extreme or another. I like a Hydrostat for loader work, but prefer a standard transmission for ground engaging implements, it's nice just to find the right gear and throttle, and drive along seeding. I have the 3 point drill, which is more demanding as far as a tractor goes, than the pull type. Can't think of anything else to add...

I should have stated a loader...to me that’s just a given. Same goes for front wheel assist.

I hadn’t considered your comment about setting and going advantage of the standard transmission but you make a great point. With my current tractor most of my work has been loader work and probably why I’ve liked the hydro so much.

I agree on the cab. As far as the drill goes...I’ll probably get the largest drill my tractor can handle and I can afford.

 

[WTNUT]

Dukslayr:

1. If you give me some more detail as to what you will do with it I will give you free advise. With what you posted here, you will need at least a 75hp tractor to lift a 6 foot no till drill. I have a couple drills. The smallest is a GreatPlains 606 3PNT. My smallest tractor is a JD 5055. It CAN’T handle that 3pt drill even with a loader on the tractor even without the weight kit on the drill. If you are going to go with a small 6 foot drill I recommend the 3pt. It can get in small plots and pick up and turn around easily. If you go with a pull version of the 6 foot then 60hp will “probably” pull it fine. My 5055 is the “E” series with a loader. If you like Kubotas (I have had those too), a 50-55hp Kubota is probably not going to weigh as much as the Deere so that would make it even more dangerous to use the drill. Personally, If you think you need a 60hp I would try to get an 80-85hp tractor.

2. Any of those manufacturers would work. I have had Deere, New Holland, Ford, Kubota, Case and Massey Ferguson so I have it pretty much covered. Have 4 Deeres and one Ford now. My worthless opinion is in the size tractor you are looking at Deere, New Holland and Case are heads and tales above the Massey and Kubota. I would see which is offering the best deal via rebates, bounties or the like if you buy new. I am also a huge fan of buying used utility tractors with low hours on them. You just have to look. My 5055E had 30 hours on it when I bought it. A kid needed to sell it to finish his divorce and he damn near gave it away to me to get away from that woman. It was $11,000 less than what I could buy a new one for. It cost him $367 per hour to own that tractor. I met him at the bank with tractor loaded and paid his note off never seen a happier 25 year old. His wife must have been a pain,

3. I answered 2 before reading 3. See above regarding used tractors. Actually, utility tractors and AG tractors are not like cars they hold their value really well. But, if you are patient and look you can find great deals on used low mile tractors. Look for doctors, lawyers and people with more money than sense. I bought a 50-55 hp Kubota utility tractor off a doctor who was adding on to his pole building barn and just wanted all his equipment out of the way while construction was going on. I bought everything he had for about 60% of what is was worth aa used equipment. I bought a tractor, bushog, post hole digger, a couple blades and I don’t even recall what else. Be careful with tractors with some hours on them if you don’t know tractors you can get skinned too.

4. I would NOT buy from a dealer. Period. That peace of mind is not worth it because very very very very few dealers will have done what you want. If something is glaring and obvious and they need to fix it they will, but the things you need to worry about are hidden and they are not tearing an engine or tranny down to see what it looks like before they sell it.

6. Get away from the hydrostatic transmission on the bigger tractors. A shuttle shift of the like is good for loader work, but other than that you will be shifting. My bigger deere tractors have better and more creature comfort trannys but you are not going to need tractors that big.

Finally, If you are looking for a used tractor, think about how many hours you will realistically put on it in a year and how long will you keep it. Most tractors, not all, went to DEF systems after 2012. Tractors made prior to the DEF systems have a lower center of gravity, and nicer to handle, don’t have to use DEF and if I could find a 2012 with 200 or less hours from an individual I would buy it. I am always looking and anytime I see a 2012 or 2013 without DEF and very low hours I buy it if the price is right. I worry about what to do with it later.


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[FarmerDan]

Nobody ever bought a tractor and said, "Gee, I wish I had less HP!" See if your accountant thinks you can handle a hundred.

 

[swat1018]

WTNUT gives some good advise. You can go to tractordata.com and see a lot of interesting specs. The overall weight of the tractor is important when you have a drill on the back, especially a 3 pt. That drill sticking off the back, especially loaded, will take a lot of weight off the front end in a hurry. Most of the older, non "E" series Deere's, will outweigh the Kubotas. Tractordata also will tell you the 3pt lift capacity. I bought one tractor from a JD Dealer. It was a year old machine that had been in it's rental fleet, and had 225 hours. I got a great deal and a free extended warranty. That was in 1992 and I still use it.

It's important to get your drill situation sized up before you buy the tractor in my opinion. If you get a 6', I wouldn't go huge. If you are going to buy a 10' then I would get bigger. There are a lot of tractor forums around where you can search different tractors when you get a lead, see what kind of problems pop up. Some tractor models, like anything else, are just lemons. I haven't bought any tractors with the new emission crap and DEF. I won't until I have to. I do about 15-20 acres / year with my 6' drill.

 

[WTNUT]

Nobody ever bought a tractor and said, "Gee, I wish I had less HP!" See if your accountant thinks you can handle a hundred.

You are sooooo right!!!!!! I had a TN 95A New Holland it was probably the best food plot utility tractor I have owned. I only ask one question related to tractor size when I am buying “do I have a field big enough to turn it around in?”. If the answer is yes, then it ain’t too big :)


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[Dukslayr]

Dukslayr:

1. If you give me some more detail as to what you will do with it I will give you free advise. With what you posted here, you will need at least a 75hp tractor to lift a 6 foot no till drill. I have a couple drills. The smallest is a GreatPlains 606 3PNT. My smallest tractor is a JD 5055. It CAN’T handle that 3pt drill even with a loader on the tractor even without the weight kit on the drill. If you are going to go with a small 6 foot drill I recommend the 3pt. It can get in small plots and pick up and turn around easily. If you go with a pull version of the 6 foot then 60hp will “probably” pull it fine. My 5055 is the “E” series with a loader. If you like Kubotas (I have had those too), a 50-55hp Kubota is probably not going to weigh as much as the Deere so that would make it even more dangerous to use the drill. Personally, If you think you need a 60hp I would try to get an 80-85hp tractor.

2. Any of those manufacturers would work. I have had Deere, New Holland, Ford, Kubota, Case and Massey Ferguson so I have it pretty much covered. Have 4 Deeres and one Ford now. My worthless opinion is in the size tractor you are looking at Deere, New Holland and Case are heads and tales above the Massey and Kubota. I would see which is offering the best deal via rebates, bounties or the like if you buy new. I am also a huge fan of buying used utility tractors with low hours on them. You just have to look. My 5055E had 30 hours on it when I bought it. A kid needed to sell it to finish his divorce and he damn near gave it away to me to get away from that woman. It was $11,000 less than what I could buy a new one for. It cost him $367 per hour to own that tractor. I met him at the bank with tractor loaded and paid his note off never seen a happier 25 year old. His wife must have been a pain,

3. I answered 2 before reading 3. See above regarding used tractors. Actually, utility tractors and AG tractors are not like cars they hold their value really well. But, if you are patient and look you can find great deals on used low mile tractors. Look for doctors, lawyers and people with more money than sense. I bought a 50-55 hp Kubota utility tractor off a doctor who was adding on to his pole building barn and just wanted all his equipment out of the way while construction was going on. I bought everything he had for about 60% of what is was worth aa used equipment. I bought a tractor, bushog, post hole digger, a couple blades and I don’t even recall what else. Be careful with tractors with some hours on them if you don’t know tractors you can get skinned too.

4. I would NOT buy from a dealer. Period. That peace of mind is not worth it because very very very very few dealers will have done what you want. If something is glaring and obvious and they need to fix it they will, but the things you need to worry about are hidden and they are not tearing an engine or tranny down to see what it looks like before they sell it.

6. Get away from the hydrostatic transmission on the bigger tractors. A shuttle shift of the like is good for loader work, but other than that you will be shifting. My bigger deere tractors have better and more creature comfort trannys but you are not going to need tractors that big.

Finally, If you are looking for a used tractor, think about how many hours you will realistically put on it in a year and how long will you keep it. Most tractors, not all, went to DEF systems after 2012. Tractors made prior to the DEF systems have a lower center of gravity, and nicer to handle, don’t have to use DEF and if I could find a 2012 with 200 or less hours from an individual I would buy it. I am always looking and anytime I see a 2012 or 2013 without DEF and very low hours I buy it if the price is right. I worry about what to do with it later.


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Sage advice here. Thank you. This exactly what I was looking for.

I really don’t intend to do much with the tractor outside of plant 10 acres of food plots and mow/maintain 125 acres CRP. Honestly I’m not doing anything special with it.

I also don’t have a drill bought and don’t need a big one. All of my plots I can get a big tractor into. My farm is ag type fields and timber with easy access to most all fields/plots.

I’m also not married to Kubota in any way. It’s the only tractor I’ve ever owned and it’s just been a great tractor for what I’ve needed. My dad owns a case, and 3 JDs.

I found a JD 5075E for sale somewhat close with low hours pre DEF for what appears to be a pretty reasonable price.

 

[swat1018]

I'd go big if you plan to mow 125ac of CRP. If you don't need a small drill, I've seen 10' drills go cheaper than the 6', just a supply/demand issue. I'd want to have enough to run a batwing mower.

 

[Dukslayr]

I'd go big if you plan to mow 125ac of CRP. If you don't need a small drill, I've seen 10' drills go cheaper than the 6', just a supply/demand issue. I'd want to have enough to run a batwing mower.

It won’t all be mowed annually...just whatever the contract specifies (which isn’t much annually).

 

[WTNUT]

[

I found a JD 5075E for sale somewhat close with low hours pre DEF for what appears to be a pretty reasonable price.[/QUOTE]

How many hours that is a great size tractor for what you will being doing.


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[WTNUT]

I'd go big if you plan to mow 125ac of CRP. If you don't need a small drill, I've seen 10' drills go cheaper than the 6', just a supply/demand issue. I'd want to have enough to run a batwing mower.

All good advise.

The comment about the drill is spot on. 125 acres is a lot to mow, and I too would go with a batwing for sure.

If I were mowing 125 and planting 10, I would be far more interested in a tractor and nice batwing than a drill. I would buy the drill last.


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[Dukslayr]

[

I found a JD 5075E for sale somewhat close with low hours pre DEF for what appears to be a pretty reasonable price.

How many hours that is a great size tractor for what you will being doing.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk[/QUOTE]
150 hours

 

[kl9]

75-90 hp put you in a frame size that is hard to use in woods


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[Dukslayr]

75-90 hp put you in a frame size that is hard to use in woods


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Agreed. It won’t be used in the woods.

 

[SwampCat]

I am sure no tractor expert here. I am only on my second one. Everybody told me to get the biggest one I could afford - except the salesman. I had decided on a 5075e JD. The salesman asked me what implements I was going to use. I told him nothing over eight foot because my access roads are tight. He said a 55 hp would do it all and save me $6k for implements. I split the difference and went with the 65 hp. I bought a bush hog with the money I saved. I have never thought I have needed more hp. I have an 84” woods seeder that is a load on the back at a little over 2000 lbs loaded - but never any problems with that. I have a lot of wet ground on my place. The tractor ruts the ground something horrible compared to my 30 hp JD. I am glad the bigger tractor doesnt weigh one pound more. Lately, with the wet weather - I have been using the smaller tractor just to keep from rutting the ground so bad.

I looked used and everything I found with a couple hundred hours was within $4000 of new. If you dont have a truck and trailer to haul it- that can get expensive. JD dealer charges $300 one way for 30 miles. Be aware some of your smaller gearboxes on tillers and posthole diggers might not be rated for the bigger tractor. Everything cost more for a bigger tractor. Fuel, service, hauling, implements, parts are more.

I put more hours on the bigger tractor, but I get on the smaller tractor a lot more.

 

[Frosted brassica]

If you are not doing a lot of tight work in small places with a loader then perhaps an older ag tractor will give more value than you expect. Are you handy in fixing mechanical problems? Do you know a good tractor mechanic? Maybe a neighbor who is a farmer? Local farmer and mechanic can likely direct you to local farm equipment auctions, and if you become friends may even walk an auction with you and point out tractor deals. Don’t be afraid of older tractors if you can manage a little maintenance.

 

[Dukslayr]

If you are not doing a lot of tight work in small places with a loader then perhaps an older ag tractor will give more value than you expect. Are you handy in fixing mechanical problems? Do you know a good tractor mechanic? Maybe a neighbor who is a farmer? Local farmer and mechanic can likely direct you to local farm equipment auctions, and if you become friends may even walk an auction with you and point out tractor deals. Don’t be afraid of older tractors if you can manage a little maintenance.

I honestly don’t have the time or experience to mess with a lot of extra maintenance or mechanical issues. I also don’t know any of the local farmers (yet). I will probably stick to buying something relatively new with low hours in hopes that I don’t run into a bunch of maintenance issues. I agree with you, though, the older tractors offer tremendous value. My limited amount of time at the farm has to be spent working on my projects...and I am hoping to avoid the tractor being one of those projects!

 

[yoderjac]

3) I can't speak to your area, but around here, folks don't buy new tractors every few years just because they want something different like to do cars. With cars, there are a lot of good values in the slightly used market. I don't see those around here with tractors except in special circumstances. You might see that in a case where someone bought a new tractor and then died and the estate sold or something like that. So, when I see a late model tractor at a dealership, I need to convince myself that the original owner didn't dump it because it was a lemon. I'm not saying there is not value out there, just that it is a bit harder to find and you really need to understand the history on a tractor.

4) In 2) you talk about dealerships that are nearby. A tractor is a long-term investment for most of us. In some ways you are buying a dealership rather than a tractor. Depending on your location, dealerships may be large enough that you are just a number. In other locations, you can develop a much more personal relationship. When I was looking for a tractor, I "interviewed" service departments. I talked to the service manager and several mechanics. I now know the mechanic that works on my tractor and he knows my tractor and its history intimately. Often, he will cut my labor charge because he is fixing something that he feels is cause by a design issue with the tractor. I've learned a lot about how I can deal with small issues in the field saving me a trip to the dealership. There are times, when I've called him from a broken down tractor in the field and he gives me a list of things to try and test before bringing it in. Often it turns out to be a fix I can do myself. Or even operator error. I realize you can't do this everywhere. If your area lends itself to dealers that are small enough for personal service, you might consider this. Buying your tractor from the dealership is one step in establishing this relationship.

5) I have both hydrostatic and straight gears on my tractors. Hydrostatic excels if you are doing a lot of loader work and is nice if you are using a belly mower. Other than that, I prefer the geared tractor for most of my farming like tasks. My larger tractor is not hydrostatic and I prefer that for my mix of uses between FEL and other tasks.

The only other thing I would suggest is to start with your techniques and work backwards to tractor features. For example, if you are planning to use old traditional farming techniques like a 3 bottom plow, consider not only HP, but weight. Also consider features like draft control. If you are planning on going the no-till route, consider how large of a drill you will be using. If it is 3-pt, a FEL will offset weight and they will load your tires if you get a FEL. If it is tow behind, make sure you have sufficient hydraulic outlets and controls. What kind of spraying equipment will you use? Do you plan to use a foamer (homebuilt or commercial)? If so, if it (or any other equipment) is driven electrically, do you have connectors where you need them with sufficient power. How about other implements? I used an auger and had the rear window open so I could control it. It got stuck in the ground and as I was working to release it, it finally popped loose. It rebounded enough that the top of the arm hit and shattered the rear window. And that takes me to Cab or open. I got a cab on one tractor and found it to be both a blessing and a curse. If you have a cab, you need air-conditioning; at least in my location. The cab heats up very quickly with all that glass. When the AC is working, the cab is a dream. It really extends how much time I can spend in the tractor as I get older. No more having to watch out for the swarm of yellowjackets when I make the next pass! When the AC is out, it is very limiting. With my particular tractor model, they have big design issues with the AC and it is almost impossible to keep it running. So, if you get a cab, talk to the mechanics about the reliability of the AC in whatever model you get.

Best of luck,

Jack

 

[Dukslayr]

3) I can't speak to your area, but around here, folks don't buy new tractors every few years just because they want something different like to do cars. With cars, there are a lot of good values in the slightly used market. I don't see those around here with tractors except in special circumstances. You might see that in a case where someone bought a new tractor and then died and the estate sold or something like that. So, when I see a late model tractor at a dealership, I need to convince myself that the original owner didn't dump it because it was a lemon. I'm not saying there is not value out there, just that it is a bit harder to find and you really need to understand the history on a tractor.

4) In 2) you talk about dealerships that are nearby. A tractor is a long-term investment for most of us. In some ways you are buying a dealership rather than a tractor. Depending on your location, dealerships may be large enough that you are just a number. In other locations, you can develop a much more personal relationship. When I was looking for a tractor, I "interviewed" service departments. I talked to the service manager and several mechanics. I now know the mechanic that works on my tractor and he knows my tractor and its history intimately. Often, he will cut my labor charge because he is fixing something that he feels is cause by a design issue with the tractor. I've learned a lot about how I can deal with small issues in the field saving me a trip to the dealership. There are times, when I've called him from a broken down tractor in the field and he gives me a list of things to try and test before bringing it in. Often it turns out to be a fix I can do myself. Or even operator error. I realize you can't do this everywhere. If your area lends itself to dealers that are small enough for personal service, you might consider this. Buying your tractor from the dealership is one step in establishing this relationship.

5) I have both hydrostatic and straight gears on my tractors. Hydrostatic excels if you are doing a lot of loader work and is nice if you are using a belly mower. Other than that, I prefer the geared tractor for most of my farming like tasks. My larger tractor is not hydrostatic and I prefer that for my mix of uses between FEL and other tasks.

The only other thing I would suggest is to start with your techniques and work backwards to tractor features. For example, if you are planning to use old traditional farming techniques like a 3 bottom plow, consider not only HP, but weight. Also consider features like draft control. If you are planning on going the no-till route, consider how large of a drill you will be using. If it is 3-pt, a FEL will offset weight and they will load your tires if you get a FEL. If it is tow behind, make sure you have sufficient hydraulic outlets and controls. What kind of spraying equipment will you use? Do you plan to use a foamer (homebuilt or commercial)? If so, if it (or any other equipment) is driven electrically, do you have connectors where you need them with sufficient power. How about other implements? I used an auger and had the rear window open so I could control it. It got stuck in the ground and as I was working to release it, it finally popped loose. It rebounded enough that the top of the arm hit and shattered the rear window. And that takes me to Cab or open. I got a cab on one tractor and found it to be both a blessing and a curse. If you have a cab, you need air-conditioning; at least in my location. The cab heats up very quickly with all that glass. When the AC is working, the cab is a dream. It really extends how much time I can spend in the tractor as I get older. No more having to watch out for the swarm of yellowjackets when I make the next pass! When the AC is out, it is very limiting. With my particular tractor model, they have big design issues with the AC and it is almost impossible to keep it running. So, if you get a cab, talk to the mechanics about the reliability of the AC in whatever model you get.

Best of luck,

Jack

Very good advice and thoughts here too. Thank you. The dealers around me are all more “rural” dealers. I definitely plan to get to know the guys at the dealership of whatever we buy. My next step is going to be going around to the handful and meeting them and checking out their tractors. If I move away from Kubota and toward Case, Massey or JD I’ll onlu have to visit a couple dealerships. I already know the guys at the Kubota dealership now, as they’ve been taking care of my L3830 for the last 5 years. They’re good people for sure, as I’m sure the other dealers are good folks too.