The late November lull

[Hoytvectrix]

What is everyone seeing for in-person or on camera buck sightings lately? It's been almost a ghost town on a couple of our farms in northern Missouri. Looking back at cameras from the last few years, this has been the pattern, but never to this extreme.

I'm assuming (mature) bucks are just out roaming to new ground looking for does that didn't conceive the first go around or the doe fawns that are becoming receptive. Still, one would think if that is the case that we would be seeing random unknown bucks cruising through. Maybe a neighbor has some standing beans or corn we don't know about.

What's everyone seeing this time of year?

 

[TenPoint]

Mine have been dead since Monday. Outside of a couple yearlings. It’s the end of our rifle season too. Rut is over.

 

[Native Hunter]

I checked some cameras today. The primary rut has pretty much fizzled out here. The only bucks visiting scrapes are very young ones. The secondary rut peak will kick in soon (around December 10 for us), and there will be another short burst of action. Any does not bred the first time will cycle again, and young, healthy doe fawns will cycle in for the first time as well. I did get a picture of a mature looking, freakish buck (that I don't like the looks of) following a doe on my place. I think this deer lives on my neighbor's place, because I remember him mentioning having it on camera earlier in the year.

 

[Native Hunter]

Just before I tagged out, I had this deer on my 20 acre place. I will check cameras there next week. I'm hoping he is alive for next year:

 

[Gravel Road]

Not in Northern Kansas. Camera videos have increased from October-Early November 130 videos per week to 330 videos per week. Great time to hunt. My old 7.5 year old buck just showed up on 25 Nov.

 

[Mortenson]

This is an off year for 4.5+ yr old bucks here. It was a great year for 2.5 and 3.5 yr olds. All together I had maybe a dozen bucks 2.5+ on cam this fall. I know of 4 that were shot gun 1. Most of the rest are in hiding now (or killed), haven't been hitting my cams at all. This fall was the lowest pressure we've put on our farm ever. It didn't seem to make any difference. Driving around in my 'hood I've seen 3 bucks tending does in out of the way spots the past couple days. About the time I'm getting excited for future prospects I realize we still have 4 more gun seasons to go and then the 2.5 month long sniper season. Whoopity doo.

 

[buckdeer1]

Thanksgiving has always been the week that an old buck will get out cruising for one last time of the year.I saw 7 bucks this morning, 3 were running a young doe pretty hard and the rest cruising. Did see one being chased by 3 coyotes.Morning and mid day cruising and evening checking areas does are feeding.Then after next week hope for cold weather and evenings for food.

 

[Bill]

My cams have pretty much died off but they're mostly on food and always die off in November. And my neighbor has acres of standing corn.

 

[Tree Spud]

Very quiet here. The few mature bucks we saw were locked down on does. Last week we hit the mid 70's temp wise then saturday opener was around 10 deg F with high winds. Plenty of does moving and still seeing young bucks pushing does. Still have a few good ones working the property (ignore dates), just need to see them in daylight.








Would like to see the buck that did this ....

 

[4wanderingeyes]

I havent seen anything to pull the trigger this gun season, and I am not very picky.

 

[BuckSutherland]

Lull...?? Come to zone 1 in MN. You will see what a real lull looks like. I would be willing to bet approximately 60-70% of hunters did not even see a deer. Many hunters have likely gone 3+ years without seeing a deer. The MN DNR has created the largest lull in "professional" big game management. Regulations that are a complete abomination for sure.

Harvest by year for zone 1:

2017- 57,909
2018- 50,203
2019- 42,412
2020- 39,656
2021- 37,819
2022- 30,459

 

[Hoytvectrix]

Lull...?? Come to zone 1 in MN. You will see what a real lull looks like. I would be willing to bet approximately 60-70% of hunters did not even see a deer. Many hunters have likely gone 3+ years without seeing a deer. The MN DNR has created the largest lull in "professional" big game management. Regulations that are a complete abomination for sure.

Harvest by year for zone 1:

2017- 57,909
2018- 50,203
2019- 42,412
2020- 39,656
2021- 37,819
2022- 30,459

Is Zone 1 the 100 level zones? Do you think it is just over-harvesting? Predators?

I hunt public land on the bottom 1/3rd of the state. I live in MN but own and hunt private land in Missouri like many on this forum.

 

[BuckSutherland]

Is Zone 1 the 100 level zones? Do you think it is just over-harvesting? Predators?

I hunt public land on the bottom 1/3rd of the state. I live in MN but own and hunt private land in Missouri like many on this forum.

Yes, the 100 zone. The DNR is 100% responsible for this mess either through direct action or inaction. Either they have no ability whatsoever to assess wildlife populations or this is direct malfeasance. There are four main killers of deer in zone. The MN DNR does or COULD control 3 of the 4.

1. Hunters- DNR controls the length of seasons, number of tags, etc. All of the goal setting meetings 5 years ago the DNR agreed to 50% increase in deer population for the majority of zone 1. We received a massive decrease instead of an increase. Its possibly never occurred to the DNR to make the entire region bucks only, shorten the season, or in some cases some permit areas should be completely shut down cause its gotten so ridiculous.

2. Bears- We used to have 20,000 bear permits in MN. Now we are typically down to 3,200-3,500-3,700 area. It is much more common in my area (east of leech lake) to see a bear then it is to see a mature buck. The damn bears are everywhere. Seems like they get a few fawns on my property every year. I've had 6 separate bear encounters under 50 feet in the last 2 years. I didnt have 1 in the previous 10.

3. Wolves- Where does a hunter even begin.... Just imagine if the REAL wolf number were revealed and wolves weren't "endangered" anymore. Perhaps then the MN DNR scientist could sue to get control of a wolf season to manage their population. States sue the federal gov't all the time. Anyone that has been around northern MN for 20+ years like I have knows the wolves are blanketing the entire zone.

4. Winter- The DNR will tell you out of the left side of their mouth we have had several very rough winters in the last 5 years and that killed a bunch of deer. Then out of the right side of their mouth they say the moose all died from global warming. You can't control the snow but you could have dialed back permits, seasons, party hunting, cross tagging, youth hunts, etc. This is equivalent of a surgeon waiting to start a procedure until the frickin patient is already dead.




I'm of the opinion that the horrendously abysmal deer and moose numbers in MN are not an accident, and in fact are 100% deliberate. There is no other plausible explanation cause this is the biggest $hit sandwich in the history of big game management. I can hardly believe they could be so inept, so that only leaves deliberate action. All of the goal setting BS from 5 years ago COMPLETELY ignored. Pedal to the metal on all policies that further wipe out the whitetail. I cant wait until the next time one of their brown shirt thugs comes to harass me. Gonna be some words exchanged.

 

[SD51555]

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[Wind Gypsy]

Yes, the 100 zone. The DNR is 100% responsible for this mess either through direct action or inaction. Either they have no ability whatsoever to assess wildlife populations or this is direct malfeasance. There are four main killers of deer in zone. The MN DNR does or COULD control 3 of the 4.

1. Hunters- DNR controls the length of seasons, number of tags, etc. All of the goal setting meetings 5 years ago the DNR agreed to 50% increase in deer population for the majority of zone 1. We received a massive decrease instead of an increase. Its possibly never occurred to the DNR to make the entire region bucks only, shorten the season, or in some cases some permit areas should be completely shut down cause its gotten so ridiculous.

I'd be on board with buck only and elimination of doe permits. Unfortunately our family place up there is now a CWD surveillance are and not only is a tag either sex, you can get a bonus tag over the counter. Unfortunately the Management plan mandates more liberal harvest when CWD is detected, there's not really any room for them to make decisions otherwise now that it's in written in the management plan.

I'm not sure shortening season would do much as I doubt much gets killed the last week/weekend but I sure wouldn't be opposed.

2. Bears- We used to have 20,000 bear permits in MN. Now we are typically down to 3,200-3,500-3,700 area. It is much more common in my area (east of leech lake) to see a bear then it is to see a mature buck. The damn bears are everywhere. Seems like they get a few fawns on my property every year. I've had 6 separate bear encounters under 50 feet in the last 2 years. I didnt have 1 in the previous 10.

Yeah, we need to kill way more damn bears.

3. Wolves- Where does a hunter even begin.... Just imagine if the REAL wolf number were revealed and wolves weren't "endangered" anymore. Perhaps then the MN DNR scientist could sue to get control of a wolf season to manage their population. States sue the federal gov't all the time. Anyone that has been around northern MN for 20+ years like I have knows the wolves are blanketing the entire zone.

I don't blame them for not wasting management $ on a lawsuit that is going to lose. I think we're effed by the Endangered Species Act language that makes it near impossible to meet every BS technicality objective to delist.

4. Winter- The DNR will tell you out of the left side of their mouth we have had several very rough winters in the last 5 years and that killed a bunch of deer. Then out of the right side of their mouth they say the moose all died from global warming. You can't control the snow but you could have dialed back permits, seasons, party hunting, cross tagging, youth hunts, etc. This is equivalent of a surgeon waiting to start a procedure until the frickin patient is already dead.

I'm of the opinion that the horrendously abysmal deer and moose numbers in MN are not an accident, and in fact are 100% deliberate. There is no other plausible explanation cause this is the biggest $hit sandwich in the history of big game management. I can hardly believe they could be so inept, so that only leaves deliberate action. All of the goal setting BS from 5 years ago COMPLETELY ignored. Pedal to the metal on all policies that further wipe out the whitetail. I cant wait until the next time one of their brown shirt thugs comes to harass me. Gonna be some words exchanged.

It does seem in the moose zone they are using the moose as an excuse to shit on the Whitetails up there. I do buy that whitetails hurt the moose population with the disease/tick angle but where I have serious fooking heartburn is how damn quiet they are about the wolves and bears hammering moose calves. One just has to look at ND who issued 342 moose tags this year. Tell me that ND has better moose habitat..

 

[Wind Gypsy]

Lull...?? Come to zone 1 in MN. You will see what a real lull looks like. I would be willing to bet approximately 60-70% of hunters did not even see a deer. Many hunters have likely gone 3+ years without seeing a deer. The MN DNR has created the largest lull in "professional" big game management. Regulations that are a complete abomination for sure.

Harvest by year for zone 1:

2017- 57,909
2018- 50,203
2019- 42,412
2020- 39,656
2021- 37,819
2022- 30,459

My land is in 157 (south-southeast of lake mille lacs) which doesn't feel like zone 1 at all - current #s show 4,716 of the 31,658 deer killed in region 1 were from this zone which further shows how few are getting shot in actual northern MN.

 

[SWIFFY]

Things have been real slow in my neck of the woods too. I had some great daytime movement last year from the 22-26th of November. Those particular bucks are still alive this year but did not move at any time in the area they were in last year. Theyre alive... I guess thats the main thing. Everything seems a little later this year. We have a cold snap starting again now, maybe that will get them going?

 

[Brian662]

In my experience, once the pre rut and peak rut has passed, daytime movement of mature bucks goes back to 95% weather dependent. I think once the fawns and does that weren't bred during the first rut come into estrous, you'll get another small 3-4 day spurt of activity that may not be quite as weather dependent. In my area those dates are traditionally Dec 2-6 based on logs and trail camera data.

As for a report in SE MN and SW WI, the movement has slowed since the warmer weather came in. I'll be out with the muzzle loader this weekend in WI looking for some second rut action. If the weather forecast holds, the following weekend in MN will be really good over food.. if I see anything worth reporting, I'll gladly update.

 

[g squared 23]

I haven’t seen many deer the last week of November, but the couple of bucks I’ve seen have been good ones. Biggest deer I’ve ever seen in person was a 190”+ nontypical with droptine and third beam, mass outta this world. Out well before dark to eat at a wheat field, Saturday after Thanksgiving. This has been a long while ago.

Another really good 150” came by following a doe a few years ago on black friday. Bases seemed the size of coke cans, but they seem to get bigger every time I tell the story.

I always get a couple hunts in during those days as once December hits, deer movement and especially buck movement drops off a cliff. Only a fierce weather front will get them moving, and even then I don’t see much activity until around Christmas.


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[MN Slick]

Early November was a lull in my neck of North MO, the worst movement I've ever experienced. I saw as many older deer this past Saturday than I saw from Nov 5-12. The rut seems to be more of a trickle rut each year that goes by.