shrub row planting plan by NRCS, not understanding why

[willy]

I received the plan for a 4 row shrub plan using elderberry and plum as the shrubs. I told the nrcs that I would like 2 rows of plum and 2 rows of elderberry when adding to my crp plan. The lady sent me the plan today and she divided the shrub rows by the north half is plum and south is elderberry. There is no change in soil and minimal elevation change over the 175 yards the rows run. My crp tree/shrub plan last year in a different county had me planting 2 rows of one shrub and then 2 rows of another or one row of one flavor and another row of another flavor.

That is how I have always planted shrubs regardless if it was for crp or my own habitat development.

Anybody have an idea why this would be planned this way?

 

[trampledbyturtles]

Only reason I would do it that way would be topo based, on the slight chance of there being more moisture on one end vs the other.

Elder loves water, plum likes it high and dry.

Personally would run it Elder/plum/plum/elder due to hight characteristics and leaf drop of both. Plus the elder may give your plums some relief from intense rubbing, and the elder can come back from new canes so no worries if a few get destroyed.

Otherwise tell her to kick rocks and redraw the plan.

 

[willy]

Thanks Trampled, I replied to her email with questions but I am looking for ideas/reasoning to add to my argument to put them in the rows I want. She is new and really seems to want to make her mark and show she's got the power. She fd up my crp to the point I told them I was backing out of the contract and then the people in the FSA called me and told me she was wrong with her assessment and said I could have the initial plan that was approved. She doesn't care for me too much so I want to have my facts/reasoning covered for our next face to face conversation or phone conversation.

The guy who drew up my original plan resigned for another job after the initial submission and then she came in. It's been a major pain in the ass since then. She likes to flex her education/theories in her plans and explanations.

 

[Tree Spud]

Tell her to provide a list of prior projects where she applied "her" approach and then quantify the results achieved.

Have her explain why segregating the species is better than diversity?

Present her the previous plan and have her critique why that plan is not acceptable.

Provide evidence of your success with the previous plan and ask her to explain why continuing with the existing plan is not acceptable.

Make sure you cc the previous plan designer and her supervisor. These little woke NRCS PIA's often shield their work from their supervisors. Many of them are the new breed of eco-activists and anti hunting.

Shed some light on her activities. Making sure she knows there are more eyes on her may reign her in.

 

[Ben.MN/WI]

Just sprinkle in a few shrubs where you want them and it will be fine.

 

[Bassattackr]

Tell her to provide a list of prior projects where she applied "her" approach and then quantify the results achieved.

Have her explain why segregating the species is better than diversity?

Present her the previous plan and have her critique why that plan is not acceptable.

Provide evidence of your success with the previous plan and ask her to explain why continuing with the existing plan is not acceptable.

Make sure you cc the previous plan designer and her supervisor. These little woke NRCS PIA's often shield their work from their supervisors. Many of them are the new breed of eco-activists and anti hunting.

Shed some light on her activities. Making sure she knows there are more eyes on her may reign her in.

This.. Boom.

 

[bwoods11]

Many of the NRCS employees wouldn’t know the difference on inspection. Plant it how you want.

 

[Tree Spud]

Many of the NRCS employees wouldn’t know the difference on inspection. Plant it how you want.

I agree ^^^^

But they know the yellow march swallow that nests in June that will not allow you to mow trails until July 1st. Or that there is a rare spotted tree frog spotted 2 miles from your property delaying your food plot approval for a year as an environmental; study must be conducted.

If you ask an NRCS employee if you can do something first response is "no", back-up response is you need a conditional use permit. So don't ask for permission.

 

[bwoods11]

Also once you plant the tree rows in CRP…nothing says re-plants have to be the same tree or shrub. I found that out a few years ago.

You are not supposed to plant invasive trees,….but if you plant Plum, some die, and you want to switch to Chokecherry, there is nothing in the contract that prevents that.

 

[willy]

Well deer camp '21 is over so I can take some time and share what happened with shrub plan.

I was incorrect on soil type not being an issue for half of the rows according to the map nrcs had. However I was able to diversify the shrub rows. The south end is still plum but I was able to put in 2 rows of choke cherry and 2 of elderberry on s end.

I conferred with another nrcs and they said I didn't have much say in the plan with soil type issue.

Hoping for the best. I'm plowing the rows for prep tomorrow and drilling 40 acres of crp.

If anyone is still looking for some shrubs, IA nursery has some. What I got from them last year did real well this year.

 

[Tree Spud]

Well deer camp '21 is over so I can take some time and share what happened with shrub plan.

I was incorrect on soil type not being an issue for half of the rows according to the map nrcs had. However I was able to diversify the shrub rows. The south end is still plum but I was able to put in 2 rows of choke cherry and 2 of elderberry on s end.

I conferred with another nrcs and they said I didn't have much say in the plan with soil type issue.

Hoping for the best. I'm plowing the rows for prep tomorrow and drilling 40 acres of crp.

If anyone is still looking for some shrubs, IA nursery has some. What I got from them last year did real well this year.

SPS - shovel ... plant ... shut-up

I have found the less you talk to the NCSC, the less frustration and attention to your property you will have.

 

[willy]

SPS - shovel ... plant ... shut-up

I have found the less you talk to the NCSC, the less frustration and attention to your property you will have.

Yea I don't think I'm going to do that anymore as in the three counties I have crp, they were all checked last year for compliance. 2 passed fine. The one that I dealing with above was the one that didn't. The gal told me she was going to be checking all the crp fields now as per the recent gov directions she said they've been charged with. Too many landowners let crp go so they are to check yearly on crp. She may be bluffing but as expensive as the stuff is that I got to plant, I'm not going to put myself in position to do rework at my expense in a couple years. I know they've checked that farm 4 times in last 3 years., since she was hired.