Shocked!

[MoBuckChaser]

I had a logger walk and mark trees that can be cut on a farm we are selling. I just wanted an idea, so I could let a buyer know what is on the farm. The guy got done the other day and called me yesterday and said He came up with 400 maples, 40 large cottonwoods, 30 Burr and 20 White Oaks, 30 Walnuts, with 4 being veneer trees. I was shocked to know there are that many of everything. And that isn't counting any Hedge post trees. He is now figuring up the board feet to give me a current estimate. Now I am thinking of pulling it off the market for a couple years after I Log it.

This is a mile of river bottom that already holds deer like crazy. Can you imagine what kind of deer will be in that maple regrowth in 2 years! OMG!

Finally have something going my way for once!

 

[wiscwhip]

This is in MO, correct?

 

[MoBuckChaser]

This is in MO, correct?

10-4!

I am thinking of having him walk all the farms. Maybe more of the same.

 

[wiscwhip]

I am thinking your understory regen in that climate would be quick and aggressive! If you are going to sell it, you could do a select cut? You would have to get a forester/logger you trust so they did not high grade the place, but if you are selling it anyway, maybe it doesn't matter?

 

[MoBuckChaser]

I am thinking your understory regen in that climate would be quick and aggressive! If you are going to sell it, you could do a select cut? You would have to get a forester/logger you trust so they did not high grade the place, but if you are selling it anyway, maybe it doesn't matter?

This is a select cut of sorts. Only taking about 10%-20% of the trees is my guess. If we do take any trees, the ones he has marked are the better grades, but you won't know for sure until the log buyers come when they are on the ground in front of them. I think this guy is pretty good from what I can tell. I had my logger buddy with me when we met the guy and walked the farm the first time, he thought he knew what he was talking about. So I will see what he come up with!

 

[Catscratch]

Sounds like a keeper to me. Sell the logs, make some $$$$, shoot some deer for a few yrs, post pics of the giant bucks on a flyer and sell it.

 

[MoBuckChaser]

Sounds like a keeper to me. Sell the logs, make some $$$$, shoot some deer for a few yrs, post pics of the giant bucks on a flyer and sell it.

Sounds like a great plan!

 

[bwoods11]

Seems like creek/river bottom areas grow the best timber down your way. My best trees in IA, are all within 100 yards of the creek.

 

[j-bird]

Are the maples hard maple or soft? Soft maple in my area is essentially pallet wood while hard maple is prized stuff. You are correct in that select cutting can remove those trees, open up your canopy and allow the understory to explode. Sit on it a few years kill some nice deer and then sell it later. I am sure you may have already done this - cause your a smart fella and been around the block a time or two - but I would make sure you know what he has marked. Make sure he isn't cutting every realistic tree on the place and leaving you with crap. Some loggers will cut some pretty small stuff in order to get enough trees to go in after the prime stuff they really want. What remains then is a disaster of small undesirable trees. I know you tend to not trust folks and I don't either, so just make sure you know whats on the list. Select timber harvest has been the best habitat improvement I have made on my place. Also see if you can find out how the market for those timber species is doing.....some may be up while others are down.....just nice info to have.

 

[MoBuckChaser]

We are walking it again next week, I will see what all is marked. These are hard maples also, I don't even know if there is a soft maple on the place, at least not that I have seen.

When I last checked I think the Board foot price on average trees was $.15 on Maple, .30 on the oaks, and $1.25 on the walnut. But I wonder what the veneer trees will be worth if we decide to cut them?

But this guy has a place that needs the maple now, and I have some very good sized and good quality trees, so I hope to get a quote a little higher on the maple.

 

[j-bird]

We are walking it again next week, I will see what all is marked. These are hard maples also, I don't even know if there is a soft maple on the place, at least not that I have seen.

When I last checked I think the Board foot price on average trees was $.15 on Maple, .30 on the oaks, and $1.25 on the walnut. But I wonder what the veneer trees will be worth if we decide to cut them?

But this guy has a place that needs the maple now, and I have some very good sized and good quality trees, so I hope to get a quote a little higher on the maple.

I figure you as one to make sure.....just seems like the sort of guy you are. When you said "river bottom" I just figured soft maples - most soft maples that I am aware of (silver maple and red maple) love the water but are lower quality timber. My hard maple prefer my more upland areas, but I have some in the bottom areas as well. Another virtually worthless habitat tree once it grows beyond the reach of deer! When I had my hard maple cut it was valued at roughly 75% of oak, but again that could be time or even regional demands and the like. With 400 of them...make him squirm a little bit, if he needs them he will step up some. A little bump over 400 trees can add up! Walnut always seems to be where the money is at for the most part. My bottom areas are full of them and I think they tend to be a crap tree as far as deer habitat is concerned. I have never messed with veneer trees, so I can't help you there.

 

[MoBuckChaser]

I figure you as one to make sure.....just seems like the sort of guy you are. When you said "river bottom" I just figured soft maples - most soft maples that I am aware of (silver maple and red maple) love the water but are lower quality timber. My hard maple prefer my more upland areas, but I have some in the bottom areas as well. Another virtually worthless habitat tree once it grows beyond the reach of deer! When I had my hard maple cut it was valued at roughly 75% of oak, but again that could be time or even regional demands and the like. With 400 of them...make him squirm a little bit, if he needs them he will step up some. A little bump over 400 trees can add up! Walnut always seems to be where the money is at for the most part. My bottom areas are full of them and I think they tend to be a crap tree as far as deer habitat is concerned. I have never messed with veneer trees, so I can't help you there.

I try and cover my tracks as best as a guy can, but what do I know I just had a customer write in a $12,000 bad check for prebuy seed. I get bad checks in season, but I never have had that happen before. Then he tried to call the seed company and have them deliver it direct. What a world we live in.

 

[Ben.MN/WI]

What did they say the cottonwoods are worth? I'm guessing they aren't worth much per board foot, but those tall straight cottonwoods can have a lot of board feet on them. It would be fun to watch one of those giant ones get dropped.

 

[j-bird]

I try and cover my tracks as best as a guy can, but what do I know I just had a customer write in a $12,000 bad check for prebuy seed. I get bad checks in season, but I never have had that happen before. Then he tried to call the seed company and have them deliver it direct. What a world we live in.

You get screwed over by more bad checks......Every time I saw someone with a check I would just punch them in the nose! As I get older I simply don't trust anybody.....it's one thing when you have a history with folks, it's another when some folks are just out there to screw somebody over. I get told all the time that I carry a grudge. I don't carry a grudge.....I may forgive, but I don't forget.....big difference! As for your timber - it's one of those things that some folks just don't do real often so it can be hard to build a relationship with a logger - many places are cut once every 50 years and if you get hosed you just have to take that beating. I won't banter on about the contract and insurance and payment methods and clean-up and access and all those things. You seem to have your act together from that standpoint. IF they calculate the board feet and price, you may want to contact a few places just to make sure your not getting low-balled, again, just to cover your butt.

 

[j-bird]

What did they say the cottonwoods are worth? I'm guessing they aren't worth much per board foot, but those tall straight cottonwoods can have a lot of board feet on them. It would be fun to watch one of those giant ones get dropped.

When I had my place cut - they dropped some big yellow-poplar. My neighbor called me, "What the @#$% is going on over there!" He had heard the crashes from his place....1/2 a mile away. That was why I called loggers I had some "junk" trees like cottonwood that was WAY bigger than I felt comfortable with - some I'm not sure my saw was even big enough. Bringing down stuff that big I'll let the pros do....they get paid to take those risks. Cottonwood you virtually give away - but it's worth it because of the improved habitat that follows. I think I got like $20 for a decent sized cottonwood tree.

 

[MoBuckChaser]

You get screwed over by more bad checks......Every time I saw someone with a check I would just punch them in the nose! As I get older I simply don't trust anybody.....it's one thing when you have a history with folks, it's another when some folks are just out there to screw somebody over. I get told all the time that I carry a grudge. I don't carry a grudge.....I may forgive, but I don't forget.....big difference! As for your timber - it's one of those things that some folks just don't do real often so it can be hard to build a relationship with a logger - many places are cut once every 50 years and if you get hosed you just have to take that beating. I won't banter on about the contract and insurance and payment methods and clean-up and access and all those things. You seem to have your act together from that standpoint. IF they calculate the board feet and price, you may want to contact a few places just to make sure your not getting low-balled, again, just to cover your butt.

Nope, have not been screwed I still have the seed. Just a pain in the ass to try and resell half of his order that a normally don't sell in my area.

 

[Bowsnbucks]

I've seen some really sharp looking cottonwood slab table tops and benches on web-sites. Those slabs weren't cheap to buy if you wanted to make your own table or bench. I wonder what gives ????????

 

[kl9]

Is this the one with the creek running through on the left side?

 

[j-bird]

I've seen some really sharp looking cottonwood slab table tops and benches on web-sites. Those slabs weren't cheap to buy if you wanted to make your own table or bench. I wonder what gives ????????

I suspect it's 2 things.
#1 - the large markets drive prices.....not a lot of demand for cottonwood tables in my opinion. You want something of solid wood (furniture, flooring, cabinets) you want, oak, walnut, cherry and a growing trend in homes now is even maple. These trends drive the prices. Even hickory and ash have dropped in price - they used to be used to make all sorts of wood handled tools. Most of those now are some sort of fiber/plastic concoction so the lack of demand has lower the price.
#2 - the drying time and mechanical strength of cottonwood is not real favorable to commercial markets. Cottonwood is virtually a wood sponge. Cut a piece of cottonwood and weigh it. Once it is sufficiently dry for wood working that same piece will weigh 1/2 of what it did. that drying time and energy needed to pull that moisture out is not a desirable thing. The other is the mechanical properties/strength of the wood itself. Most of the traditional hardwoods has better shear and tensile strengths. This holds true for lots of "pallet" grade woods. They either lack the needed strength or they simply hold too much moisture, or have other issues regarding commercial applications. As such they use them to make crates and pallets as these are essentially disposable and they want as cheap a raw material as possible for that one time use application.

You will always find guys that make stuff out of some strange things. I had a guy actually want a couple of my buckeye trees. Why? He uses the wood for making temporary molds and likes the soft wood as it is easy to shape and carve by hand. There is no commercial value for buckeye what-so-ever that I am aware of. I told him if he could cut them and get them out he could have them.....buckeye is a pretty worthless wildlife tree to me.

 

[MoBuckChaser]

Is this the one with the creek running through on the left side?

yep