Lots of open WI land now closed.

[shawnv]

For those who hunt public in WI I suggest checking the recent maps because this week I noticed 1000's of acres that were Open MFL last season are no longer listed so my assumption is that they are now going to be Closed-MFL. This has been the trend for a number of years now but it seems to have taken a big jump in the wrong direction close to home.

 

[kabic]

Shawn, doe the Wisconsin public land map application show Open MFL?

http://dnrmaps.wi.gov/H5/?Viewer=Public_Access_Lands

 

[wiscwhip]

Kabic, they have a separate map for MFL/FCL properties.

http://dnrmaps.wi.gov/opfl/

 

[wiscwhip]

Upon quick glance, I have not noticed any recent "removals" from our area. That said, with the new rules that allow landowners in Open MFL to switch to Closed MFL without penalty and to then be allowed to lease the property for deer hunting access in addition to getting dirt cheap taxes on the wooded rec land, I see this trend continuing to increase each year until Open MFL acres go the way of the dinosaurs. Let the "double dipping" begin, all on the backs of the taxpayers who actually pay full rate for the acres they own.:mad::rolleyes: I can guarantee you that if I catch wind of any properties I have previously hunted being leased, I will be contacting the County Tax Assessors office to ensure they know the owner is leasing so they can bang the owner for the added income their land is producing. See, if you lease it, you must also pay income taxes on the lease rate, many will try to circumvent this, but not if I have any say in it.

 

[shawnv]

Kabic, they have a separate map for MFL/FCL properties.

http://dnrmaps.wi.gov/opfl/

Like wiscwhip said, it's a separate map. What bites is I spent several hours in Dec scouting areas I won't be able to hunt this fall like I thought I would. With the continued loss of land I can see why I'm seeing so much pressure in the other areas I hunt, double whammy!

 

[wiscwhip]

Like wiscwhip said, it's a separate map. What bites is I spent several hours in Dec scouting areas I won't be able to hunt this fall like I thought I would. With the continued loss of land I can see why I'm seeing so much pressure in the other areas I hunt, double whammy!

YUP!!! ^^^

 

[wiscwhip]

I do see now that the Open MFL acres that were up on the bluffs above La Crosse are now gone from the map. It was a few small areas that were mostly landlocked anyway, but they are definitely not on the map any longer.

 

[kabic]

Found this tidbit a little surprising

Can I bait bear when hunting on MFL-Open or FCL lands?
Baiting is a legal part of bear hunting, therefore is legal on MFL-Open and FCL lands. Hunters could be cited for litter if inorganic materials, such as paper, plastic, Styrofoam or other materials are left at the bait pile.

 

[shawnv]

I do see now that the Open MFL acres that were up on the bluffs above La Crosse are now gone from the map. It was a few small areas that were mostly landlocked anyway, but they are definitely not on the map any longer.

It's usually the small areas that end up having a sweet spot.

 

[Terrific_tom]

I can't remember if it was this forum or QDMA forum that this was discussed at great length. I said that this very thing was going to happen when the law was changed. A lot of guys said that it would never come to this. Governor Walker a friend of Sportsman, yea right.

 

[wiscwhip]

It's usually the small areas that end up having a sweet spot.

Didn't matter in this case though, you would have to travel through Closed MFL in the owners wife's name to get to the Open MFL in his name, so you couldn't legally access it anyway........

 

[wiscwhip]

I can't remember if it was this forum or Old forum that this was discussed at great length. I said that this very thing was going to happen when the law was changed. A lot of guys said that it would never come to this. Governor Walker a friend of Sportsman, yea right.

You mean this thread Tom...................

http://habitat-talk.com/index.php?threads/walker-signs-2-mfl-bills-this-week.5142/#post-101233

See post #4................;)

 

[shawnv]

You mean this thread Tom...................

http://habitat-talk.com/index.php?threads/walker-signs-2-mfl-bills-this-week.5142/#post-101233

See post #4................;)

Yep, some of us called it. I had kinda of forgotten about it until I looked at the difference in some areas I was looking at even from early Jan to what I now see this week. It's like it flipped as soon as the current season closed. They do state on the DNR site that annual updates are made sometime in Jan and I'm sure that was it.

 

[Ben.MN/WI]

Didn't matter in this case though, you would have to travel through Closed MFL in the owners wife's name to get to the Open MFL in his name, so you couldn't legally access it anyway........

Legal access is required if it's open, so call the forester listed on the open property desctiption and ask how to access it. I've been told to go through no trespassing signs to access private property on the MFL open list since that is the access point. I keep those emails on my phone so I can show the email from the DNR to anyone questioning. Often times they have closed MFL by the road and open further back to make it more difficult to access and hunt. those spots can be pretty good since they keep away other hunters.

 

[wiscwhip]

I have the County Foresters for 4 different Counties on speed dial and in my emailing list. Whoever you dealt with is not on the same page as the ones I have had dealings with in the last couple years. You might want to revisit that. ^^^ If the land between the Open and Closed acres is in another persons name, you have NO legal access to the Open MFL. If you had someone tell you otherwise, they were mistaken and you were smart to keep that email correspondence, because if the County Sheriff were called out, you would have been ticketed for trespassing. I will post a link that explains the whole MFL process in a document from the DNR(some of the leasing info in the document is not correct given the passing of the new laws). Below that link I will post a snip that tells how these Open acres CAN be landlocked so you cannot access them legally.

Link........

http://www.wisconsinforestry.org/files/minutes/MFLAProgramPrimer.pdf

Snip........

The Division was contacted earlier this year by several legislators and asked to identify
how to end leasing on MFL lands. Underlying their request was the stated belief that
public access for recreation is a key benefit of MFL and that allowing landowners to
profit from closing and leasing land was contrary to one important aspect of what the
public values under the law. Landowners have learned how to create deeds
to show the appearance of different ownerships in order to maximize the amount
of lands closed to public recreation. A husband and wife could have 3 different ownerships
between them including: (1)husband, (2) wife, and (3) husband and wife.
Large-block accounts could have many combinations of ownerships including:
(1) 99% industrial ownership and 1% private ownership (president of the company) and
(2) limited liability companies (LLC #1, LLC #2). There are many types of ownerships that
landowners have been able to create. The fact that landowners can
creatively override the legislative limitation on closed acreage under the law fueled their
concerns, particularly when leasing actually encourages landowners to close land and violate the
legislative intent to limit the amount of land any one landowner closes.

 

[Ben.MN/WI]

I found this on the DNR's website. You are correct - if the landowner of the open property has no legal access, you would need to get permission to access that property. The similar landlocked properties I hunt must fall under the second paragraph below where the owner has an easement to their landlocked property and they cannot deny the public access to that easement. You can't hunt when walking on that easement to the property, but you can use it as an access route to the open land. I always keep the emails from the foresters when they describe the legal access points that aren't 100% clear. I've never had an issue yet though. I will say that these properties that are hard to reach through easements have much better hunting than the 160 parcels that border a road with easy access.

If the landowner has no legal access to the MFL-Open or FCL land, how do I access those properties?
You would need to contact the adjacent property owner and ask permission to cross his or her land to get to the MFL-Open or FCL lands.

If the owner of MFL-Open or FCL lands has access to their land through an easement, can I also use that easement to access the land?
The owner of MFL-Open or FCL lands who has access to their land through an easement cannot deny the public from using their easement if public access to their MFL-Open or FCL land is not reasonably available through other means.

 

[wiscwhip]

Pfft........your lucky that your Forester will even tell you where the access points are, the ones I deal with will not give you that information. All they do is tell you to contact the landowner by using the contact info provided on the map if there is a question on access. The reason I was told they won't personally give this info is that the landowners may decide to change where they will allow access from time to time and then if the landowner calls you out on your access point and you tell them the Forester told you to go in at that location, they will call the Forester and complain to them. Maybe just lazy Foresters(?), but I do see their point on having to keep track of the access points for hundreds of individual properties, that would be next to impossible. I think the access points should be required to be clearly marked on the map pages of each individual property right on the DNR map page, but that would be too damn easy I guess.

 

[wiscwhip]

Buffalo Co has one of the highest percentages of non-corporate Closed MFL lands in the state. Waupaca and Shawano Counties are way up on that list as well. I wonder why that is.....................:rolleyes: Can you say "double dipping"...........

 

[shawnv]

Pfft........your lucky that your Forester will even tell you where the access points are, the ones I deal with will not give you that information. All they do is tell you to contact the landowner by using the contact info provided on the map if there is a question on access. The reason I was told they won't personally give this info is that the landowners may decide to change where they will allow access from time to time and then if the landowner calls you out on your access point and you tell them the Forester told you to go in at that location, they will call the Forester and complain to them. Maybe just lazy Foresters(?), but I do see their point on having to keep track of the access points for hundreds of individual properties, that would be next to impossible. I think the access points should be required to be clearly marked on the map pages of each individual property right on the DNR map page, but that would be too damn easy I guess.

I will 2nd that, they need to highlight the access points because I'd say half the landowners are not going to be overly cooperative and some will outright illegally harass you (I was on one piece this year).

 

[shawnv]

Buffalo Co has one of the highest percentages of non-corporate Closed MFL lands in the state. Waupaca and Shawano Counties are way up on that list as well. I wonder why that is.....................:rolleyes: Can you say "double dipping"...........

Not always, the amount one piece I hunted in BC was paid so much in a lease they took it out of the MFL program all together.