Chestnut Trees for Income

[williams111]

Is anyone currently growing chestnuts for sole purposes of making some income off of them? I have seen multiple places that an acre of mature chestnuts can make $10,000/acre per year. Tom Wahl has said this many times. I am debating taking 5 acres out of crops, because its value to the wildlife is basically zero and doesn't get used much at all. I am meeting our district forester out there in March to discuss options. I am debating having 3 acres in switch/crp and 2 acres in chestnuts for future harvest. It is a long term commitment so I dont want to leave any stone unturned before making a decision. I understand it will take a while before they are producing a lot of chestnuts and producing much income. The trees will be in a place that borders a gated level C road with minimal traffic. I dont see it affecting my hunting at all as it will be on the very west side of my property. I have quite a few chestnuts growing out there already just for the wildlife.

 

[Catscratch]

I talked with a forester about growing walnut for logging. He said it's an 80yr investment. Said pecans were much more profitable. Imagine chestnuts would be similar for you.

 

[The Fishman]

Here is a publication that will provide you more information on growing chestnuts as a food crop. There is a wealth of knowledge on the Facebook group Chestnuts as a Tree Crop group. I am not sure if you need to be a member of the group to read the files, but the files section has a ton of files on the commercial growing of chestnuts. The main thing you need to research is making sure that your seedling cultivar choices will grow in your conditions.

 

[williams111]

I talked with a forester about growing walnut for logging. He said it's an 80yr investment. Said pecans were much more profitable. Imagine chestnuts would be similar for you.

I have heard that, that is a long time!

 

[williams111]

Here is a publication that will provide you more information on growing chestnuts as a food crop. There is a wealth of knowledge on the Facebook group Chestnuts as a Tree Crop group. I am not sure if you need to be a member of the group to read the files, but the files section has a ton of files on the commercial growing of chestnuts. The main thing you need to research is making sure that your seedling cultivar choices will grow in your conditions.

Just joined that group, I’ll take a look at the publication. Tom Wahl at red fern farm isn’t too far from me. He’s got quite a few videos on the best cultivars for this area. It almost seems too good to be true even if they only turn out half as good as they sound. I understand there is potential issues/off years and possibly other factors. I think it would be a fun project and give me something to do in retirement.

 

[OakSeeds]

You can make money growing chestnuts; however, there is difficulty in collecting and processing them without a large enough operation to offset the cost of specialized (usually custom made) equipment. Trying to grow them and then harvest by hand - so to speak - is a daunting task. First you have to pick them off the tree and/or collect them off the ground; if your collecting off the ground you will need special equipment and little vegetation under the trees. Getting the nuts out of the burs is no simple task ... the bur spikes can penetrate a leather glove; again, specializecd equipment is usually involved. If you intend to grade your chestnuts by size (bigger nuts usually command a better price); special equipment is again usually employed. Additionally, you will need to float test large numbers of nuts ... you don't want any customer getting one or several bad chestnuts (they can be brutal on social media). Another requirement is the need for refrigeration; chestnuts are not very flavorful - or useful as seed fruit if the dry out more the 30-40%.
You might want to visit either, or both of two commercial chestnut farms (one in Illinois and one in Iowa - Valley Chestnuts), to learn how some of the problematic tasks associated with growing chestnuts have been solved. It becomes quickly apparent why larger operations are beneficial in offsetting the labor and equipment costs associated with growing chestnuts commercially. Starting with a few acres to get your feet wet - so to speak - would probably be fun and perhaps generate a little Xmas cash. Hey, when the deer come running, you can pick up a few extra dollars leasing prime location stands.
https://chestnutridgeofpikecounty.com/ Lots of folks have purchased chestnuts from here; I visited the operation twice and found everyone willing to share information.
https://www.valleychestnuts.com/
https://whitetailhillchestnuts.com/blogs/posts-without-blog/growing-chestnuts-as-a-cash-
crop?gclid=Cj0KCQiA14WdBhD8ARIsANao07hvi2b7lDIKWIn0ZHyBeZuZ4LX98bzA1gWa2Yu5c0Eng1X6ycJ6DNsaArOHEALw_wcB
https://prairiegrovechestnutgrowers.com/ co-op that appears to sell all the chestnuts that several growers provide for sale (might be a place to sell you crop)
The Pike County farm in Rockport is growing each and every year, yet he sells everything he harvests every year. I believe you would really enjoy a visit with these folks. The Whitetail Hill Iowa operation appears to be more informative with regard to starting an orchard and the potential for economic gain.
Good luck

 

[williams111]

You can make money growing chestnuts; however, there is difficulty in collecting and processing them without a large enough operation to offset the cost of specialized (usually custom made) equipment. Trying to grow them and then harvest by hand - so to speak - is a daunting task. First you have to pick them off the tree and/or collect them off the ground; if your collecting off the ground you will need special equipment and little vegetation under the trees. Getting the nuts out of the burs is no simple task ... the bur spikes can penetrate a leather glove; again, specializecd equipment is usually involved. If you intend to grade your chestnuts by size (bigger nuts usually command a better price); special equipment is again usually employed. Additionally, you will need to float test large numbers of nuts ... you don't want any customer getting one or several bad chestnuts (they can be brutal on social media). Another requirement is the need for refrigeration; chestnuts are not very flavorful - or useful as seed fruit if the dry out more the 30-40%.
You might want to visit either, or both of two commercial chestnut farms (one in Illinois and one in Iowa - Valley Chestnuts), to learn how some of the problematic tasks associated with growing chestnuts have been solved. It becomes quickly apparent why larger operations are beneficial in offsetting the labor and equipment costs associated with growing chestnuts commercially. Starting with a few acres to get your feet wet - so to speak - would probably be fun and perhaps generate a little Xmas cash. Hey, when the deer come running, you can pick up a few extra dollars leasing prime location stands.
https://chestnutridgeofpikecounty.com/ Lots of folks have purchased chestnuts from here; I visited the operation twice and found everyone willing to share information.
https://www.valleychestnuts.com/
https://whitetailhillchestnuts.com/blogs/posts-without-blog/growing-chestnuts-as-a-cash-
crop?gclid=Cj0KCQiA14WdBhD8ARIsANao07hvi2b7lDIKWIn0ZHyBeZuZ4LX98bzA1gWa2Yu5c0Eng1X6ycJ6DNsaArOHEALw_wcB
https://prairiegrovechestnutgrowers.com/ co-op that appears to sell all the chestnuts that several growers provide for sale (might be a place to sell you crop)
The Pike County farm in Rockport is growing each and every year, yet he sells everything he harvests every year. I believe you would really enjoy a visit with these folks. The Whitetail Hill Iowa operation appears to be more informative with regard to starting an orchard and the potential for economic gain.
Good luck

Oakseeds,
How many acres of chestnuts would you consider manageable to harvest by hand? I dont want to create a big headache for myself, just something to screw around with without it becoming a daunting task. I assume the worst case scenario, once trees are at bearing age would be the wildlife getting the chestnuts before I do? If so that doesn't sound terrible. I have seen 2 options to sell the chestnuts, either to a broker or sell them myself. It wont be life or death if I dont make a dime. I will get just as much enjoyment out of watching the trees grow I think, any profit will just be a bonus. I have been to redfern farm and seen their operation. They actually do you-pick and have a waiting list for people to come to their property to pickup chestnuts and bring them back to them to be weighed and paid for. I dont want that or a commercial operation of any sort, X-mas cash would be more then enough!
Thanks for the info!

 

[b116757]

I’ve considered a small commercial orchard of grafted Chinese verities myself. Get on that Red Fern farm website Tom has a ton of good info on growing them commercially on there.

 

[williams111]

I’ve considered a small commercial orchard of grafted Chinese verities myself. Get on that Red Fern farm website Tom has a ton of good info on growing them commercially on there.

I have read through most of that and seen the videos. I was just looking for someone with first hand experience doing something similar on a small scale.
Thanks

 

[OakSeeds]

Oakseeds,
How many acres of chestnuts would you consider manageable to harvest by hand? I dont want to create a big headache for myself, just something to screw around with without it becoming a daunting task. I assume the worst case scenario, once trees are at bearing age would be the wildlife getting the chestnuts before I do? If so that doesn't sound terrible. I have seen 2 options to sell the chestnuts, either to a broker or sell them myself. It wont be life or death if I dont make a dime. I will get just as much enjoyment out of watching the trees grow I think, any profit will just be a bonus. I have been to redfern farm and seen their operation. They actually do you-pick and have a waiting list for people to come to their property to pickup chestnuts and bring them back to them to be weighed and paid for. I dont want that or a commercial operation of any sort, X-mas cash would be more then enough!
Thanks for the info!

Sorry to be slow in responding; just returned from the TX hill country south of San Antonio. Depends on a number of things including how much "free" help (family) and equipment (e.g., mower /sprayer, etc) you can muster. If it were me, I'd try to do it right ... from planting to harvest. I'd start with a tad more than an acre (45,900 sq ft) in an east-west layout including 3 rows of 18 trees-per-row spaced 30' apart with 30' between rows and a 15' buffer strip on all 4 sides. I'm a Dunstan fan ... they make big chestnuts and have solid reputation (marketing hype) that might assist sales. I would not buy 54 grafted trees (grafts fail); instead, I'd buy 4 lbs (more than enough for 54 trees) of the largest nuts available from Chestnut Ridge of Pike County to direct seed in the fall and spring. Be sure and call him (217) 242-5281 and ask that they not be "heat treated." Half of the chestnuts would be stratified in the fridge until spring in moist paper towels in sanwich bags (works great for me).
It's probably best to prep the orchard area before planting if you can; reduce as much vegetation as you can, or at least mow it as short as you can.
Assuming you don't have much help, I'd direct seed half of them (27) in the fall and leave a planting slot for a spring planted seed between each of 2 fall planted chestnuts. For each chestnut I work the dirt pretty fine (2-foot dia x 2-feet deep) to assist tap root development, place the chestnut on it's side (radical pointed down if it has one in the spring); then push a landscape pot (black plastic pot with the bottom removed) over the seed and push it a couple-three inches into the soil. I buy the cheaper 4-foot landscape fabric; use a 4' x 4' piece on each seed; and cut a hole big enough to place around the pot- (fold the fabric in half and cut a half moon). I place pea gravel 12-18 inches all around the outside edge of the pot and mulch on the rest of the fabric (I get good mulch free from my city). , I add 3-5 inches of straw mulch over the seed in fall plantings ... and add round piece of hardware cloth (1/4 x 1/4 inch) inside the pot over the seed (held down tightly with a landscape staple). Be sure to water any direct-seeded nut generously at planting to ensure good contact with the soil ... in the fall, you don't want air pockets in the soil. I*'d start caging the27 you plant in the fall if your deer density numbers are very high; you'll need the cages in the spring when the tree starts growing.
Tired from travel; signing off now .... I'll add some additional thoughts later. I'm sure others can add helpful comments.

 

[yoderjac]

Just a few thoughts. I've experience growing chestnuts for wildlife from seed, but no experience growing chestnuts for profit. Having said that, here are my thoughts:

First Dunstan's have been hyped to the wildlife community. They don't have any stronger reputation in the commercial market than other Chinese chestnuts. If your intended market is not selling nuts for folks to grow trees (a very small market), you can probably do better looking at other chestnut varieties. Another thing to consider is they you can't sell them as Dunstan chestnuts. They are not the Dunstan variety unless you get grafted Dunstan trees. You can't use the trade name Dunstan in any marketing. That pretty much eliminates any advantage the Dunstan name might carry. Chestnut Ridge of Pike County, I believe, has the original grafted Dunstan variety trees.

The only other thing I would remark on is the time factor. It will probably take you 10+ years before you produce enough chestnuts to begin selling in any kind of volume. Economies of scale come into play here.

If you are looking for a fun hobby, if you enjoy this sort of thing, it might be just the ticket that may make a little money eventually down the line. As a true business venture, I'd be skeptical.

Thanks,

Jack

 

[williams111]

Sorry to be slow in responding; just returned from the TX hill country south of San Antonio. Depends on a number of things including how much "free" help (family) and equipment (e.g., mower /sprayer, etc) you can muster. If it were me, I'd try to do it right ... from planting to harvest. I'd start with a tad more than an acre (45,900 sq ft) in an east-west layout including 3 rows of 18 trees-per-row spaced 30' apart with 30' between rows and a 15' buffer strip on all 4 sides. I'm a Dunstan fan ... they make big chestnuts and have solid reputation (marketing hype) that might assist sales. I would not buy 54 grafted trees (grafts fail); instead, I'd buy 4 lbs (more than enough for 54 trees) of the largest nuts available from Chestnut Ridge of Pike County to direct seed in the fall and spring. Be sure and call him (217) 242-5281 and ask that they not be "heat treated." Half of the chestnuts would be stratified in the fridge until spring in moist paper towels in sanwich bags (works great for me).
It's probably best to prep the orchard area before planting if you can; reduce as much vegetation as you can, or at least mow it as short as you can.
Assuming you don't have much help, I'd direct seed half of them (27) in the fall and leave a planting slot for a spring planted seed between each of 2 fall planted chestnuts. For each chestnut I work the dirt pretty fine (2-foot dia x 2-feet deep) to assist tap root development, place the chestnut on it's side (radical pointed down if it has one in the spring); then push a landscape pot (black plastic pot with the bottom removed) over the seed and push it a couple-three inches into the soil. I buy the cheaper 4-foot landscape fabric; use a 4' x 4' piece on each seed; and cut a hole big enough to place around the pot- (fold the fabric in half and cut a half moon). I place pea gravel 12-18 inches all around the outside edge of the pot and mulch on the rest of the fabric (I get good mulch free from my city). , I add 3-5 inches of straw mulch over the seed in fall plantings ... and add round piece of hardware cloth (1/4 x 1/4 inch) inside the pot over the seed (held down tightly with a landscape staple). Be sure to water any direct-seeded nut generously at planting to ensure good contact with the soil ... in the fall, you don't want air pockets in the soil. I*'d start caging the27 you plant in the fall if your deer density numbers are very high; you'll need the cages in the spring when the tree starts growing.
Tired from travel; signing off now .... I'll add some additional thoughts later. I'm sure others can add helpful comments.

Thanks for the response, I will take it all into consideration when planning. Can a north to south layout work as well? The spot I am thinking of would layout better for that.

 

[williams111]

Just a few thoughts. I've experience growing chestnuts for wildlife from seed, but no experience growing chestnuts for profit. Having said that, here are my thoughts:

First Dunstan's have been hyped to the wildlife community. They don't have any stronger reputation in the commercial market than other Chinese chestnuts. If your intended market is not selling nuts for folks to grow trees (a very small market), you can probably do better looking at other chestnut varieties. Another thing to consider is they you can't sell them as Dunstan chestnuts. They are not the Dunstan variety unless you get grafted Dunstan trees. You can't use the trade name Dunstan in any marketing. That pretty much eliminates any advantage the Dunstan name might carry. Chestnut Ridge of Pike County, I believe, has the original grafted Dunstan variety trees.

The only other thing I would remark on is the time factor. It will probably take you 10+ years before you produce enough chestnuts to begin selling in any kind of volume. Economies of scale come into play here.

If you are looking for a fun hobby, if you enjoy this sort of thing, it might be just the ticket that may make a little money eventually down the line. As a true business venture, I'd be skeptical.

Thanks,

Jack

Jack,
The area is currently in crop, making $200/acre and I am not really getting any enjoyment out of it, neither are the deer. I didn't buy the property for financial gain, strictly recreational. I am going to run the layout by the forester out there in March and see if there is any sort of cost share programs that would help offset the costs. I have spoken to him briefly about this already and think it may be possible with the "alley cropping" program, which may also offset the cost if I can receive some rent until the trees are shading out the crop in the alley. I am thinking I will get some chestnuts from a red fern farm next year for the project, I believe they have specific "seed" trees they allow people to come pick from. I did purchase some nuts from Burnt Ridge after talking to them to verify the varieties would be hardy to zone 5. I wouldn't call this a business venture, more of a hobby or a little cash eventually. I have about 28 years until retirement, I am thinking it may be fun to pickup chestnuts in retirement with my kids or grandkids. I keep running this through my head as worst case scenario I am unable to pickup the nuts and the wildlife get them, or I suppose some sort of disease like blight could take out the trees.

 

[H20fwler]

There are a lot of cost share programs that the state and Feds have for different projects, just find one that fits the same goals you are looking for.
Here, our county Ag Dep hate it when farm ground gets taken out of production and can't wrap their heads around not planting row crops or see why anyone would want to retire farm ground.

From my experiences the Chinese chestnuts grow much better for me than the Dunstan’s or any other varieties and they have better DR. The Dunstan’s seem to like sandier dryer soil... the Chinese tolerate my loamy clay and thrive.

 

[williams111]

There are a lot of cost share programs that the state and Feds have for different projects, just find one that fits the same goals you are looking for.
Here, our county Ag Dep hate it when farm ground gets taken out of production and can't wrap their heads around not planting row crops or see why anyone would want to retire farm ground.

From my experiences the Chinese chestnuts grow much better for me than the Dunstan’s or any other varieties and they have better DR. The Dunstan’s seem to like sandier dryer soil... the Chinese tolerate my loamy clay and thrive.

That's funny you say that about the Ag Dep. I actually had a county soil/water guy out when I first bought the property just to walk it and see what projects/practices would be eligible for funding or cost share. I brought up enrolling some of the crop ground into CRP. His exact wording in an almost frustrated tone was, "The CRP programs were not developed for people to buy ground only to enroll it into CRP." I was a bit shocked at that response, not that I disagreed about why the practices were started, but wouldn't you think he would be glad someone wanted to enroll?

 

[yoderjac]

That's funny you say that about the Ag Dep. I actually had a county soil/water guy out when I first bought the property just to walk it and see what projects/practices would be eligible for funding or cost share. I brought up enrolling some of the crop ground into CRP. His exact wording in an almost frustrated tone was, "The CRP programs were not developed for people to buy ground only to enroll it into CRP." I was a bit shocked at that response, not that I disagreed about why the practices were started, but wouldn't you think he would be glad someone wanted to enroll?

I think they are different in different areas. In my area, USDA almost pushes us to get into their programs. Some have worked out well for us. They have pitched others where the paperwork is not worth the small amount of funding. It just depends on the program.

Most of the stuff that has worked well for us is putting in firebreaks, using prescribed fire, and some tree harvest incentives.

Thanks,

Jack

 

[Hoytvectrix]

That's funny you say that about the Ag Dep. I actually had a county soil/water guy out when I first bought the property just to walk it and see what projects/practices would be eligible for funding or cost share. I brought up enrolling some of the crop ground into CRP. His exact wording in an almost frustrated tone was, "The CRP programs were not developed for people to buy ground only to enroll it into CRP." I was a bit shocked at that response, not that I disagreed about why the practices were started, but wouldn't you think he would be glad someone wanted to enroll?

Close friend of mine is an NRCS agent that enrolls acres in CRP and similar type programs. I have heard similar comments from him, but only in the context of people who purchase land to put it into production with the intention of enrolling it in CRP.

 

[b116757]

I would use grafted trees so your trees all drop at the same time you could alternate every other or every third row to a different verity for pollination but your drop times being spit between only two verity’s would aid greatly in harvest.

 

[yoderjac]

Clearly there are folks who can do it, but I've had zero success grafting Chinese scions to Dunstan trees. I think chestnuts are one of the harder trees to graft. They seem to respond to injury by putting up root stems rather than pushing grafts.

 

[OakSeeds]

Thanks for the response, I will take it all into consideration when planning. Can a north to south layout work as well? The spot I am thinking of would layout better for that.

Sure, and you can square it up as well .... using the same 30' between trees and rows with a 15' buffer ... simply plant 7 rows with 8 trees in a row ... around 50.5k sq. ft ... about 10% more than a acre.
I suggested you purchase chestnut seed and direct seed them instead of planting seedlings or grafted trees for a couple of reasons. First, direct seeded trees have a taproot that seedings and grafted trees do not. This helps to anchor the tree and the deep tap root can assist with capturing subsoil moisture in periods of low moisture (keeping 54 trees watered -especially during the last 4 weeks of the late summer growing season when most of nut size and weight is determined) is not an easy task for many of us. Second, as scientific studies have demonstrated, grafted trees do not perform as well as seedlings (and I would argue) seeded trees in orchard settings.
https://journals.ashs.org/hortsci/view/journals/hortsci/56/11/article-p1315.xml ........ great read for the discussion at hand

American Society for Horticultural Science …. says
"The growth of Chinese chestnut (Castanea mollissima) production in the midwestern United States is unique compared with most fruit and nuts because orchard cultivation currently favors seedlings rather than clonal selections. This is because C. mollissima seedlings from good parents outperform grafted trees at the orchard-level because of issues with delayed graft failure (Hunt et al., 2012)."

They also say ...
"‘Carolina’ (C. mollissima) is a third-generation OP offspring selected in Alachua, FL, from the widely available Dunstan population. The population is derived from a putative and lost C. dentata tree (described as blight resistant) and three C. mollissima cultivars, ‘Nanking’, ‘Kuling’, and ‘Meiling’ (Note: Morphological characteristics and DNA markers indicate no C. dentata ancestry in the Dunstan population). ‘Carolina’ is reported as particularly sweet, but evaluations by M. Nave suggested that the cultivar’s siblings, ‘Carpentar’ and ‘Revival’, are sweeter (Miller, 2003; Nave, 1998)."

Large, sweet chestnuts .. just what a consumer might really favor!