AWP and Winter Wheat

Rit

5 year old buck +
I typically don’t concern myself with rain when I TNM a plot. I tend to do it when I have time. The last few years has been around Labor Day because that is when I like to plant my WR. I have mentioned this before but those plots end up being mostly WR. I like WR but don’t feel like it is this great attractor that I want. I do however want the WR for the Spring and have the option of planting something into if I choose.

This year I have a field that isn’t in great shape but decided to broadcast BW into last years WR and clover. We had little rain before I seeded and almost none since. 150 pounds of BW later I might have 100 BW plants. Nature being nature it has still put armor on the soil so I will have something to plant into. Mostly weeds, grass, and returning clover. I have no concerns about broadcasting into this because my first TNM plot was into standing weeds. The plan was to plant Soy beans, sunflowers, and AWPs into the BW around August 5th and come back Labor Day weekend and broadcast WR into whatever grew and call it a day.

However the 2 week forecast is calling for quite a few days of high % rain. I have always broadcast my AWP with my WR in September but with all the possible rain it sure seems like a good time to plant the beans, peas, and sunflowers. I have never planted winter wheat but they had some when I picked up the seeds so I grabbed a few bags. So my question is... is it too early to plant? Will those seeds take off and leave no room to top dress with WR come September? The beans and sunflowers will frost out and if I can’t get a good throw of WR I could end up with nothing when it gets cold. I suspect there will be heavy browse on the beans and sunflowers. I read something about using AWPs as a summer annual I just don’t know what will happen to them if I plant them mid to late July. I also am not sure about planting the wheat early or if I should broadcast that the same time as the WR.
 
Cereal grains don't have much general difference in attraction for my deer. WR germinates better when surface broadcast on my soils. Having said that, cereal grains, regardless of kind, are most attractive when they are young and supple. I often split my fall plant. If I wait until Sep to plant my PTT, I don't get large tubers. So, I often plant PTT in early August and then WR/CC in Sep. As long as I keep the PTT rate low (2 lbs/ac) I don't seem to have any problem with the WR germinating and growing. I would guess the question would be if you spray and kill everything, what is the right rate of AWP for you to plant cereal in Sep.

Another thought might be to add buckwheat to your AWP when you plant now. The buckwheat should take up space but I'd keep the rate down around 10 lbs/ac. Then when you broadcast your cereal in Sep, mow the field at about 6"-8". This should not hurt your AWP and the Buckwheat mowed at that height should have nothing but some stalk left letting enough light in for the WR. Just a thought...

Thanks,

Jack
 
I cant see planting the peas, sunflowers and beans now being a bad thing, it probably wont get out of control this time of year. I imagine the deer will be hard on it.

I think its too early for the wheat. Its never a bad time for WR! Its very attractive to my deer. Id plant it anytime after Late August without hesitation, worse case scenario itll just all come up in the spring.
 
I’ve read if you plant Winter Rye too early , it will get too tall and rank and won’t be so appealing to the deer. As with Winter Wheat, I’m not sure if that’s the case , too.
 
I’ve read if you plant Winter Rye too early , it will get too tall and rank and won’t be so appealing to the deer. As with Winter Wheat, I’m not sure if that’s the case , too.
Same with all cereal grains. It is the most attractive when young and supple.
 
Cereal grains don't have much general difference in attraction for my deer. WR germinates better when surface broadcast on my soils. Having said that, cereal grains, regardless of kind, are most attractive when they are young and supple. I often split my fall plant. If I wait until Sep to plant my PTT, I don't get large tubers. So, I often plant PTT in early August and then WR/CC in Sep. As long as I keep the PTT rate low (2 lbs/ac) I don't seem to have any problem with the WR germinating and growing. I would guess the question would be if you spray and kill everything, what is the right rate of AWP for you to plant cereal in Sep.

Another thought might be to add buckwheat to your AWP when you plant now. The buckwheat should take up space but I'd keep the rate down around 10 lbs/ac. Then when you broadcast your cereal in Sep, mow the field at about 6"-8". This should not hurt your AWP and the Buckwheat mowed at that height should have nothing but some stalk left letting enough light in for the WR. Just a thought...

Thanks,

Jack
Good point about the rate. The plot is about 2.25 acres so begrudgingly I will still plant 1/4 acre of brassicas in the plot. The other will be AWP, soybeans, and sunflowers. I’ll have to do some figuring on the rates of each to use. Then come over the top after Sept 1st with WR and wheat.
 
I cant see planting the peas, sunflowers and beans now being a bad thing, it probably wont get out of control this time of year. I imagine the deer will be hard on it.

I think its too early for the wheat. Its never a bad time for WR! Its very attractive to my deer. Id plant it anytime after Late August without hesitation, worse case scenario itll just all come up in the spring.
I am thinking the same thing that the deer will be all over it. However I do have quite a bit of Ag around so I may be surprised. Worst case I can always kill off half of the field if it gets grows too well. I am more worried about weed pressure.
 
I’ve read if you plant Winter Rye too early , it will get too tall and rank and won’t be so appealing to the deer. As with Winter Wheat, I’m not sure if that’s the case , too.
I have heard that often also but I think time of year has something to do with it also. I have seen deer grab 18” stalks and eat the whole thing in late November but there also wasn’t much else around. In July or August they still have way too many options. I do agree though that young and tender is better.
 
I may also spray with interline/liberty. I read the other thread and I need a clover killer with no residual. If I hit it with Glyphosate it will bounce back on me leaving less room for winter grains.
 
I may also spray with interline/liberty. I read the other thread and I need a clover killer with no residual. If I hit it with Glyphosate it will bounce back on me leaving less room for winter grains.
so, what is the point of killing the clover? doesnt one plant the clover to have it come back the next year? or, does that spraying only kill the above ground leaves and the roots produce new clover in the spring?
 
so, what is the point of killing the clover? doesnt one plant the clover to have it come back the next year? or, does that spraying only kill the above ground leaves and the roots produce new clover in the spring?
I don’t want the clover in there. I have strips of clover on the outside that I maintain. I had broadcast the clover in with WR a few years earlier.
 
Rit, Just curious why you said you are begrugenly planting brassica? Thanks.
 
Rit, Just curious why you said you are begrugenly planting brassica? Thanks.
I just can’t get the deer to eat them. Things like radish end up bolting the following spring. I have tried a wide variety. I’ll still plant them but I won’t like it. Maybe I’ll add peas or beans this year and see what happens.
 
Spread a couple hundred pounds of shelled corn on your brassica plot. I bet they move right from the corn to the brassicas once the corn has been consumed.
 
I just can’t get the deer to eat them. Things like radish end up bolting the following spring. I have tried a wide variety. I’ll still plant them but I won’t like it. Maybe I’ll add peas or beans this year and see what happens.

You better tell your deer they are very weird. And missing out. ;)
 
Spread a couple hundred pounds of shelled corn on your brassica plot. I bet they move right from the corn to the brassicas once the corn has been consumed.
That is certainly an option. Maybe that and an exclusion cage will tell a story.
 
You better tell your deer they are very weird. And missing out. ;)
They must have a better food source. I have grown some pretty brassica plots that went mostly untouched.
 
Don't worry Rit.....my deer don't like brassica much either. I plant it every year however and they are slowly taking to it...especially later in the year once the left over grains in the ag fields has been consumed. I don't think it's because they don't like it....I think it's because they have better options. I consider brassica and cereal grans a foodplot insurance policy....it will grow and the deer will eat it if they are hungry enough!

So my spring planting failed and so did my summer planting....so for now I'm waiting until about labor day to row plant a mix of AWP and brassica and then come back later and broadcast (small plot so I use a small hand held broadcaster) to spread wheat/rye. What I see is that the deer here like the wheat better, but it doesn't stay green as long AND it doesn't green up as soon in the spring. Wheat here also doesn't get near as tall as rye does. My brassica bolt in the spring as well and I have even had AWP plants survive the winter into spring as well....(that is more a sign of deer density more than anything).
 
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I started years ago with radish only on a very small strip. It grew and they devoured it. I then went to GHR, PTT, and DER. The tops get mowed down. They’ll eat some of the bulbs but I always have leftovers in spring, more PTT than GHR. But I’ve also seen them dig throw a foot of snow to get at them as well. Some year I should try a top only mix that doesn’t do much for bulbs.
 
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I just can’t get the deer to eat them. Things like radish end up bolting the following spring. I have tried a wide variety. I’ll still plant them but I won’t like it. Maybe I’ll add peas or beans this year and see what happens.
Thanks for the reply. I am in Southern OHio and I am planting about .4 acre this year and .6 acre of peas, oats, rye. We will see.
 
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