Select Cut

[chummer]

I was considering hiring a forester to do the heavy chainsaw work for me, it would be nice to get some coin out of it too but my basic purpose is to get rid of any tree that doesn't drop a fruit or nut and give me some more room to plant more trees that do.
FORECON has an office right here in my town but I haven't approached them yet because I wanted some opinions before heading in any one direction. Who did you use if you don't mind me asking bud?

His name is Dave. I can get you his number, he is actually from the Ithaca area. He is a hunter and listens when you talk deer. This is the third time we have used him. I had him mark a bunch of junk trees but the loggers are not obligated to take them. They are marked different and are taken free of charge for both parties. They took a few but left most. I am sure you could require them to take them for a price. I had them price in three plots that came off the price.

 

[ruskbucks]

I had thought a lot of times, if done right, you can do a select cut maybe around every 10 years or so. For you, next 20-25 years, what is that based on? Not disagreeing, just trying to learn as much as I can. My hesitation with cutting anything is I really like my woods as is. Although, I know it can definitely improve animal habitat. Too bad prices for aspen arent really high as I would like to get rid of all of those too.

There are a few reasons for the next cutting to be done in 20+ years. The main reason is most of the maples will be in the saw log stage in another 20 years instead of the pulp wood most were from the recent cutting. I also didn't really want to have another cutting done in only 10 years. I also put my land in a mfl program for 25 years so they would like to manage it one more time before it is up. It was actually tuff to get a logger to come in for only 50 acres, it would be really tuff to get them to come in for another very select cut. I had my woods managed for wildlife first then for timber production. I like it to be thick with cover and full of many different kind of trees. I had them leave all the tops scattered. They act like cages for the young trees, food for deer, nesting for birds, rabbits, etc. I would have them clear cut your aspen. All my clear cuts were in areas the forester thought they would come back strong. They are about 15 ft tall after 5 years and so thick you can hardly walk thru. They provide a Lot of food and cover.

 

[Buckly]

A good forester will mark a certain percentage of junk to go along with the good stuff. Just cut and drop. Take if they wish The loggers don’t like it but, the little secret is they will do it. I remember my first select cut I ask the logger how it was going and he said he could go a lot faster if he didn’t have to run around and cut all these trees with X’s on them. LOL.

 

[r49740]

First forester will be here today for a walk through. Based on the 1" of rain coming Thursday, he was proactive in coming sooner instead of postponing. That a good positive in my book. Will be interesting to see how it goes.

 

[Troubles Trees]

His name is Dave. I can get you his number, he is actually from the Ithaca area. He is a hunter and listens when you talk deer. This is the third time we have used him. I had him mark a bunch of junk trees but the loggers are not obligated to take them. They are marked different and are taken free of charge for both parties. They took a few but left most. I am sure you could require them to take them for a price. I had them price in three plots that came off the price.

I am definitely looking for someone to take out a majority of the standing timber on my property, I would guess 8-10 acres. I have been cutting everything down 8" in diameter and removing it, but I am not comfortable cutting down the big stuff and would rather someone take it and use it, or maybe even get a little cash out of it, as opposed to just dropping it and letting it rot. I ran out of room to plant and am trying to get rid of anything that doesn't drop a nut, fruit, deer will browse or creates cover.

 

[chummer]

I am definitely looking for someone to take out a majority of the standing timber on my property, I would guess 8-10 acres. I have been cutting everything down 8" in diameter and removing it, but I am not comfortable cutting down the big stuff and would rather someone take it and use it, or maybe even get a little cash out of it, as opposed to just dropping it and letting it rot. I ran out of room to plant and am trying to get rid of anything that doesn't drop a nut, fruit, deer will browse or creates cover.

pm me and I will get his number tonight.

 

[Troubles Trees]

pm me and I will get his number tonight.

I tried PM you before I commented here and it said you have messages shut off or something similar bud. Message me to start the conversation please :)

 

[Chainsaw]

Jeremy, I'd like Dave's contact info also. I had a great logger on our last cut but a very dishonest forester. Am looking for a forester. I wasn't able to PM you either.

 

[r49740]

Chainsaw, can I ask what made him dishonest? Just want to be on the look out myself based on learnings you may have had. I hired a forester yesterday. Walked my place with him a bit, and was very happy with his ideas and how he saw things much as I did. As we talked, we both made it clear the order of priorities would be stewardship(Leave no trade behind), wildlife, release valueable trees, and last is income. He'll be out to mark and measure trees that we'll review to cut for now. After cutting, he'll be back out for us to walk together and discuss management needed on some trees, and then review again in 3 years.

 

[Chainsaw]

The forester did not follow my very clear instructions on what sections to cut first, he went right for the veneer logs.
He did not hold money for cleaning up the trails as the contract stated.
I have pretty solid evidence that he lied on who we received bids from and gave me numbers of a bid from at least one major player who told me he did not bid nor was he invited to. That either enabled him to steer the sale to who he wanted to for whatever reason or he was just being what turned out to be his lazy incompetent self. He had talked a good game and said all the right stuff up front but did not deliver. There are bums in every field and I was fooled by one, but only ONCE. On all future cuts I'll ask for and follow up on references.

Still I plan to hire a forester for my next cut as an honest and competent one can get more money out of the sale.

 

[chaded]

Anytime you get a forester that has skin in the game in regards to the sale of your timber you need to be careful. There are definitely some good ones out there and well worth their cost but there are also some shady ones. Good ones are going to try to meet your needs the best they can and get you more for your timber. A bad one looks at it as just another timber sale and smiles and nods through your wildlife habitat talk and whatever else but goes in and is solely focused on the sale and will tell you whatever you want to hear.

I believe if you have a good state forestry department that you get one of those guys in to look at it. Here in ohio they will come out for free and look at things with you. Here they aren’t involved in the timber sale but i spent 8-9 hours with mine walking the property and felt like i took some college course by the time we were done. Lol. And, they get paid a salary and really are completely unbiased when it comes to making money off your timber. It doesnt affect them one bit either way.

 

[r49740]

The forester did not follow my very clear instructions on what sections to cut first, he went right for the veneer logs.
He did not hold money for cleaning up the trails as the contract stated.
I have pretty solid evidence that he lied on who we received bids from and gave me numbers of a bid from at least one major player who told me he did not bid nor was he invited to. That either enabled him to steer the sale to who he wanted to for whatever reason or he was just being what turned out to be his lazy incompetent self. He had talked a good game and said all the right stuff up front but did not deliver. There are bums in every field and I was fooled by one, but only ONCE. On all future cuts I'll ask for and follow up on references.

Still I plan to hire a forester for my next cut as an honest and competent one can get more money out of the sale.

That sounds like just about the worst experience possible. Hopefully you don't have to go through that again. I"m sure most are, but I like to stay pretty hands on and the farm is next to my house of which I work from home mainly. So I would plan to stay on top of them as they go for a second set of eyes that if I catch anything wrong, I can communicate with everyone before it spirals.

 

[Chainsaw]

That sounds like just about the worst experience possible. Hopefully you don't have to go through that again. I"m sure most are, but I like to stay pretty hands on and the farm is next to my house of which I work from home mainly. So I would plan to stay on top of them as they go for a second set of eyes that if I catch anything wrong, I can communicate with everyone before it spirals.

It wasn't so bad, just another bump in the road. Luckily the forester got figured out before he did too much damage. Ended up keeping the same logging crew for two more seasons as they weren't too happy when we shared notes. So yes there are honest loggers and there are dishonest foresters. And seller beware; the lumber companies or at least one of the major ones regularly low balls bids in a very convincing and professional manner. That of course may not be dishonest, but it sure was shady. Feel free to send me a PM and I'll give you my phone # if you'd like to hear that part of the story. After all was said and done we made out very well despite all of the scammers.

On the DEC foresters, I agree they can be a great help but I see them as having skin in the game as well. They work for their bosses who work for political people further up the ladder. If the goal is to decrease the deer population to ten deer per square mile, it is unlikely that a government forester is going to recommend that you do new smallish clear cuts every two years spread throughout the property, leaving only fruit and nut trees even if your only goal was to have as many deer as possible on your property. If the DEC forester was to recommend that, it would not be helping them reach their population goal of ten deer per square mile if that is one of their goals. So all players have their interests to deal with.

 

[r49740]

Looks like our forester will be out on the 18th to start walking to mark and measure trees. Although Im still not crazy about cutting any, I am pretty excited to start that part of the habitat work. The amount of work I have done in the 3 years we have had the place has really started to pay off. But hat was mainly all in field work. Got our PH levels increased greatly. First time in over 25 years that all three of my big fields will have actual crops, and with the sprayer, I should be able to keep up on weed control to give them a chance. Currently, we discussed an estimate of only about 300 trees that will be cut. Hoping that will put me in the sweet spot of what I am looking for. I can keep anyone updated on the process, bids and outcome that may be interested for their own learning.

 

[Apple Junkie]

I think you are on the right track.

I logged my property last summer and I am very happy with the results. First, I had a NY State Forester walk the property with me and give me some broad strokes ideas on how to accomplish what I envisioned. I wanted good access roads, responsible timber harvests, and sound habitat management. I selected a private forester to cut the roads, mark the trees for a selective cut, then market the timber to responsible loggers. Mission accomplished on all objectives. Yes, there are tops on the forest floor, but those are good cover themselves and are protecting the regeneration new trees. Rather than looking down on the tops, I look up at the open canopy for the remaining trees to fill. Good luck, keep us posted.

 

[ruskbucks]

Anytime you get a forester that has skin in the game in regards to the sale of your timber you need to be careful. There are definitely some good ones out there and well worth their cost but there are also some shady ones. Good ones are going to try to meet your needs the best they can and get you more for your timber. A bad one looks at it as just another timber sale and smiles and nods through your wildlife habitat talk and whatever else but goes in and is solely focused on the sale and will tell you whatever you want to hear.

I believe if you have a good state forestry department that you get one of those guys in to look at it. Here in ohio they will come out for free and look at things with you. Here they aren’t involved in the timber sale but i spent 8-9 hours with mine walking the property and felt like i took some college course by the time we were done. Lol. And, they get paid a salary and really are completely unbiased when it comes to making money off your timber. It doesnt affect them one bit either way.

I worried about that when I found out that foresters sometimes work on a percentage off timber sale. I didn't like that because I thought they would go after all the best trees to get the most cash now. High grading leaving your woods with just crap left. My forester worked by the hour, which I was really happy with.