Wind.

Tap, the app is no longer maintained but I still use primos wind checker before every stand. It basically gets NOAA weather from the closest station near you and illustrates it on a Google earth.
The blue dot is where you're sitting and it's pretty accurate. You can go to your stand, save the location and pull it up any time after that. It's always spot on for prevailing wind but doesn't show the affects of structure.
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By any chance were you hunting the leeward side (of that day's prevailing wind) of a ridge or other structure?
And what was the wind speed that day?
Those 2 aspects have a big influence on how stable the wind blows throughout the day.

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I’m not sure of wind speed but it doesn’t seem to matter in my situation.
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I’m not sure of wind speed but it doesn’t seem to matter in my situation.
f6dc65003194b43c793f03d4be37c409.jpg



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That looks like a low pressure trap, to me. Any wind that's not from the North or East is gonna stay sucked into that huge crevice. It's going to swirl around in there just like how water eddies below a bolder in a stream.
And wind speed would play a roll in your situation. Anything but the lightest wind coming over those ridges will create that low pressure area in that box you're in.
A strong wind from the North East would make just the opposite situation. It would pile-up in that box and create a high pressure area with an up-draft. It might seem like it would be blowing into the cover, but I would bet it will be lifting.
This is an example of why I love milkweed floaters so much. No other wind indicator shows intricate air current like mother nature's floaters.

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I have the same situation on my land as some others have stated. Big ridges and hollows, and the wind forecast means nothing other than the wind speed. A normal sit means you notice a big wind shift multiple times an hour. I started smoking my clothes, boots, and myself last year with a bee smoker. So far i am very happy with the results, but i am interested to see if some deer catch on over the years and begin to scare off when they whiff heavy smoke from busting me on the hike in and out.

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That looks like a low pressure trap, to me. Any wind that's not from the North or East is gonna stay sucked into that huge crevice. It's going to swirl around in there just like how water eddies below a bolder in a stream.
And wind speed would play a roll in your situation. Anything but the lightest wind coming over those ridges will create that low pressure area in that box you're in.
A strong wind from the North East would make just the opposite situation. It would pile-up in that box and create a high pressure area with an up-draft. It might seem like it would be blowing into the cover, but I would bet it will be lifting.
This is an example of why I love milkweed floaters so much. No other wind indicator shows intricate air current like mother nature's floaters.

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I have been using milkweed pods too. They really show how the wind is moving.


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For me, it is a two step process that are independent.

Step 1 - Assume wind will carry any scent I produce to the deer. Use appropriate hygiene and scent control methods (see previous post) to minimize any scent I produce. This includes not using masking scents. I want to give off as close to zero scent of any kind as I can.

Step 2 - Assume I've been a total failure at scent control and I stink to high heaven. Then, choose my stand location such that my scent is most likely to carry my scent directly away from the direction I expect to see deer.

I was never any good at Step 2. That is pretty much what I started with when I was young. I was common for me to see deer but very uncommon for one to venture within bow range without blowing me. This was partly due to my inability to predict where my scent would go and partly due to my inability to predict from what direction deer would come.

Once I added Step 1, my success rate when way up. Even when deer were directly and obviously down wind from me I would rarely get blown. On occasion downwind deer might get a little nervous, but the amount of scent was low enough that they would not interpret it as immediate danger.

Thanks,

Jack
 
Well dang boys and girls, look what ai started. We now have visual aids! I use Primos Wind on my phone, but it is only going to give you the predominant wind direction. As I indicated originally, in hill country (far more so than in the flats or even in what I call mountain terrain like the Rockies when elk hunting) the wind direction changes frequently due to a variety of factors including temperature, thermals, eddies as you would have in a trout stream, and factors I don't even claim to appreciate or understand.
I would almost rather hunt in no wind (less than 2MPH or a strong wind (over 12 MPH steady in my neck of the woods) than what they claim to be a constant 6MPH for example. My deer generally lay low in heavy winds because we just don't have them like they do a little further west. But, one of the nicest bucks I have taken if many years was shot on a morning when I kept sending the same text to my buddy - "we should really get down out of these trees this is crazy".


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I use Primos Wind on my phone, but it is only going to give you the predominant wind direction.
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Call them predominant wind, winds aloft, prevailing wind, or whatever you prefer, it's those winds, and it's speed are exactly the info we need in order to predict what the surface wind will be doing at a particular stand site. It's up to us to learn how a given predominant wind effects the surface wind in our hunting area. No website can tell us what the surface wind will be doing at our stand.
It would be great if there was an app or website that could tell us what "our" wind will be doing, but there isn't any such app. Just looking at the hundreds of personal weather stations on Wundermap proves that we can't rely that individual predictions for surface wind direction will match the surface wind at our stand.

For those of you that haven't seen Wundermap, here's a link https://www.wunderground.com/wundermap
Each one of those circles on the map is someone's Personal Weather Station (PWS) that is linked to Weatherunderground. PWS's are located at surface level. It gives current conditions for that precise spot. The line that comes off the circle indicates wind direction...more specifically, surface wind direction for that PWS. Look at how many of them show a different wind direction, some being located right next to another PWS. Very seldom do all of the PWS in a region agree on the direction of surface wind. It seems to indicate surface predictions would be impossible. But the "wind aloft" predictions on most weather sites do agree with each other. They are usually true to the prediction and they don't change constantly like surface wind in some areas on some days.
The winds aloft do change, but they change with the jet stream, and fronts. During most days the winds aloft don't change at all or maybe once. They don't change back and forth throughout the day like surface winds may or may not do.

The chaos or stability of surface winds is created by the combination of terrain and the angle and speed that those winds aloft travel over and above that terrain.
It's our job to study how our surface wind reacts (which will be our prediction) based on winds aloft which is accurately predicted by weather services (someone else's prediction). We can rely on wind aloft forecast to predict what direction or how stable surface flow will be.

Predicting the surface wind at our stand is sometimes pretty easy and other times it can be a crap shoot. Not because of bad wind info from the weather service, it can be a crap shoot because of our specific terrain and how the angle and speed of the winds aloft are on a given day. In time, with a lot of personal observation and milkweed, we learn how wind aloft effects surface wind at a specific location.

Surface wind patterns are so dynamic and complex that it's about impossible any app could show what it's doing in a location. Wind aloft on the other hand, is straight forward and consistent to the predictions.

There's nothing better than boots-on-the-ground experience, but sometimes we can look at a topo map and get a pretty good idea of what surface wind should be doing based on winds aloft.
Look at the image in post #22. It's fairly easy to see that any wind aloft that comes from the West or South would make for swirling winds in that area. Wind aloft from the North East should be much more stable. The reality is that a lot of areas are difficult, if not impossible to hunt under most predominant winds. We need to apply those dependable wind aloft forecast to our specific terrain. Sometimes they match up, but more often they don't. BTW, on days that wind aloft matches up with terrain are usually days with consistent wind. Even better is when thermals match the aloft and surface wind.

And stand height is really only good for very close range encounters. We are still at the mercy of down-drafts or (hopefully) up-drafts. "Our" wind doesn't necessarily stay at stand level. We can be 100 feet high and if there's a down-draft, a high stand only helps for deer almost straight under us, not for deer that are farther down wind. It just depends on the severity of the down (or up) draft. Those days that our stand has an up draft are fantastic. We have deer around us and none ever smell us. We think it's due to our odor control but it's often because the airflow is up and away from the critters. And up draft is not always a thermal flow. Up draft is often created by how the wind aloft flows over the terrain. Which is another reason to use milkweed...so we can understand what is really happening with the wind in order to help us make predictions for future hunts.

There have been some fantastic contributions to this site. I believe that the Windy.com link someone shared just may be the most valuable contribution (for hunting purposes) that any member has made. I've paid close attention to Windy this season. It's been spot-on accurate on wind aloft and speed. I've watched and often been confused by why surface winds aren't doing what I thought they were predicted to do. The great thing about Windy is that you can view the map in an animated, topographic map. It really helps to see how the wind hits the terrain features which helps tremendously in predicting where surface wind will be stable or swirly.
 
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The great thing about Windy is that you can view the map in an animated, topographic map. It really helps to see how the wind hits the terrain features which helps tremendously in predicting where surface wind will be stable or swirly.

But the animation doesn't actually show what happens when it hits different terrain. Unless I'm doing something wrong. Downloaded the app and for me it just shows the prevailing wind. Pretty cool to see what it's doing at the surface vs a few hundred meters up.

Now I'm off to weather underground to see what they have.
 
But the animation doesn't actually show what happens when it hits different terrain. Unless I'm doing something wrong. Downloaded the app and for me it just shows the prevailing wind. Pretty cool to see what it's doing at the surface vs a few hundred meters up.

Now I'm off to weather underground to see what they have.
That's exactly my point. To have any chance of predicting the SURFACE wind, (which surface wind is what is actually the key to stand selection), we need to see what the ALOFT wind is doing and then apply that to our specific terrain. And that is something that can't be shown on an app.
Hate to be redundant on my previous points, but the predictions of winds aloft by weather services are pretty much accurate. But the compass direction (and speed) that aloft wind passes over the intricacies of a specific terrain dictates how the surface wind behaves.
Edit:
This post was a lot longer. But I realized the more I tried to make my point, the more confusing it got! Lol.
 
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One thing this post made me realize I need to do is find some milkweed pods next fall. I did have a sit this earlier this season where the cottonwood seeds were floating all around me. No doubt I could easily see where my stink was headed that day.
 
But the animation doesn't actually show what happens when it hits different terrain. Unless I'm doing something wrong. Downloaded the app and for me it just shows the prevailing wind. Pretty cool to see what it's doing at the surface vs a few hundred meters up.

Now I'm off to weather underground to see what they have.
Another thing to look at on weather websites is the prediction for cloud cover. It has another influence on wind.
Take Saturday for example. It was 100% cloudy all day until 3 or so. While it was cloudy, the wind was very light and stable from the north.
But as soon as the cloud cover cleared, the breeze picked up and switched 90 degrees. I'm positive that cage was because of the change in cloud cover.
I've seen that condition happen countless times over the years.
Windy.com also shows cloud-cover predictions. If it predicts a change in clouds during the day, a wind change (speed, direction, or both) usually coincides.

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A lot of guys don't understand how terrain and thermals afffect scent streams as opposed to the actual prevailing winds being inconsistent. Sure every spot is unique and using the milkweed seeds is the best way to see where the wind is going 50+ yards away in each location.

Hill country can actually create very predictable advantageous scenarios that can make a deer think they have the advantage where in reality, a well positioned stand on the leeward side of the hill can blow a hunter's scentstream OVER the thermal wind tunnel and make it almost impossible to be winded. Certainly this advantage changes throughout the day, especially as the temperature drops and the thermals begin to fall. Likely the reason many hunters have watched deer walk "straight down wind" and never got winded, and they want to thank their scentlok/ozone/stealth dust etc as opposed to understanding rising thermals just blew their scent 75 yards over the deer's head.

My opinion is that studying the wind and how it's affected by terrain, thermals, etc is much more effective (and will make you a better hunter) in the long term than saying "whelp, I'm in hill country/flat country and that wind is just gonna swirl randomly. Guess I better just take a green soap shower and hope for the best!".
 
Thanks to every poster in this thread.
I live and hunt in a hundred plus acre draw or bottom.
Narrow and steep with lots of finger ridges.
Thermals and prevailing wind I had finally figured out.
With the information presented here I hope to figure out how to hunt the ridges and hilltop areas that ...never had a good wind........I thought.
Was my good fortune while in eastern Kansas this fall to find some milkweed pods and collect them. When I spotted them in a fencerow I couldn't believe my luck. I have never seen the pods where I am in Mississippi.
Tried releasing some at ground level but they didn't stay aloft. Is there a trick or do I need more elevation?
Thanks again for all the information.
 
Thanks to every poster in this thread.
I live and hunt in a hundred plus acre draw or bottom.
Narrow and steep with lots of finger ridges.
Thermals and prevailing wind I had finally figured out.
With the information presented here I hope to figure out how to hunt the ridges and hilltop areas that ...never had a good wind........I thought.
Was my good fortune while in eastern Kansas this fall to find some milkweed pods and collect them. When I spotted them in a fencerow I couldn't believe my luck. I have never seen the pods where I am in Mississippi.
Tried releasing some at ground level but they didn't stay aloft. Is there a trick or do I need more elevation?
Thanks again for all the information.
Really need to be elevated a little, but if there happens to be an up draft they are okay from the ground.

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I hunt on 40 acres and it's flat land. I don't have the problems that some of you deal with but I too watch the wind and try to "play the wind". This year I started to use Huntstand.com. It's all free. You set it up on your home computer then when that's set up you get their app for your phone, log into your account and it's there. I don't have service where I hunt but with Huntstand you can still pull it up in the field and pull up the info you need. Besides weather and other features, one of the the tabs is called Huntzone. This gives you the wind direction and scent direction, looks like a target and the red in the target is your scent direction. So before I head out to hunt I can see where on the property to set up according to the scent zone from the app. I can't believe how much of a difference this made in the amount of deer I saw this year. Instead of trying to figure out on my own where's the best place to hunt according to the wind which always was confusing, I can check it out using HuntStand. I really recommend trying it and you have nothing to lose since it doesn't cost anything. I'll be glad to answer any questions and I have no affiliation with the company that made this software.
 
I hunt on 40 acres and it's flat land. I don't have the problems that some of you deal with but I too watch the wind and try to "play the wind". This year I started to use Huntstand.com. It's all free. You set it up on your home computer then when that's set up you get their app for your phone, log into your account and it's there. I don't have service where I hunt but with Huntstand you can still pull it up in the field and pull up the info you need. Besides weather and other features, one of the the tabs is called Huntzone. This gives you the wind direction and scent direction, looks like a target and the red in the target is your scent direction. So before I head out to hunt I can see where on the property to set up according to the scent zone from the app. I can't believe how much of a difference this made in the amount of deer I saw this year. Instead of trying to figure out on my own where's the best place to hunt according to the wind which always was confusing, I can check it out using HuntStand. I really recommend trying it and you have nothing to lose since it doesn't cost anything. I'll be glad to answer any questions and I have no affiliation with the company that made this software.
Have you tried that app in hilly terrain?

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Have you tried that app in hilly terrain?

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No I haven't had the chance. In this part of Michigan it's flat and not hilly where I hunt.
 
No I haven't had the chance. In this part of Michigan it's flat and not hilly where I hunt.
I am anxious to try huntstand but I have to say that I'm skeptical that it will work very well in hilly and highly varied terrain.
I'll be comparing it's predictions to the actual conditions created by factors that I understand. Call me doubtful but hopeful.
And thanks for sharing the link. I will be checking it out.

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Wow! Good stuff. I've read all these posts several times as I've tried to incorporate all this great intel into a hunting strategy. Yes, I play the wind, or, to put it truthfully, the wind plays me. So, I don't know what I have to offer to build the conversation. But, that's never stopped me!

Those forecasts you look at before heading to the stand are models, not reality. Wind speeds and directions are collected from point locations, many official NWS point locations of which I think there nearly 100 here in Virginia. Then, some math (a model) is applied to display what the speed and direction might be wherever you are. The accuracy? Some models are better than others. Some work well in certain conditions and not in others.

The National Weather Service reports observed speeds and directions as two-minute averages. If, where you are, the wind is shifty, take a measurement every second and average 120 of those readings. I'm sure you will then find your observations more in line with what you'll find on the web! I'm just kidding....
And just for reference the NWS readings are taken 10 meters above the ground. And that brings up another problem. The reporting stations are, in groups, at different elevations.

I guess my point is, what you see being reported probably isn't exactly what you encounter. Everybody know that, but can we now feel better about it?

Anybody use an anemometer? I hope I get one for Christmas.

Here's my question...If I have a digital elevation model of where I hunt, can I draw some general and/or specific conclusions about what I'm going to experience given whatever factors determine these currents? Temperature? Warming / cooling? Morning / Evening? High pressure / low pressure? I know its hard to think about all of that, and while I'm ready to throw up my hands and wash real good, I'm about to retire. I need something to think about when I'm not doing laundry.

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