Help with my property pleeeeaaaase
- Thread starter Telemark
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j-bird
Moderator
I hope some of the MN, WI, MI or NY guys chime in for you. I think they will have more practical experience and advice for you. I don't have bear or grouse and I don't have any experience with yarding deer behavior or the snow amounts I am sure you deal with.
I would suspect that the "valley" would be where your best soil is going to be located. Any information you can share as far as what types of trees and shrubs you have and the condition of the understory and the ground in general (wet/dry/sandy/clay) will help as well. Do you have anything that produces mast as a foodsource for deer.....nuts, berries, other fruits and the like? Obviously giving those trees/shrubs/plants the best chance would be great projects. Simply giving them more daylight, reducing competition and maybe a dose of fertilizer can help. As far as traditional foodplots are concerned I would suggest looking into what sort of ag crops can and are growing in the general area. The deer should be familiar with those and would take to them faster. Otherwise I would think you might be limited to cool season plantings.....clovers, cereal grains (oats, wheat, rye) and brassica (radish, turnips, rape). These will tolerate cooler soil and air temperatures as well as shorter growing season to reach maturity as well. Looking in the general area tends to tell you what will grow best as those folks are trying to get the most out of that ground. Cover is always important as well as a strong understory. A good understory provides cover as well as browse for deer as well.....so if the trees you have a very mature and your understory is weak you may need to consider some logging. If you want to try planting trees and shrubs stay with native plants as much as possible or those specifically suited for your hardiness zone.....you mentioned the neighbor had fruit trees. You may want to find out what varieties those are and if they do well.
This is all pretty general stuff on my part simply because I am not familiar enough with your area and the like. The basics say look at what works in other areas around you. Look at what cover in your area holds the animals you want to hold and try to replicate that. Find the foods those animals like in your area and try to provide that. In many cases you don't have to "invent" anything. You simply need to provide more or a better quality of what is in your area that those targeted wildlife species like. From a hunting perspective you have to lay those things out as best you can to ensure you can hunt without educating the animals in the process. Sorry I can't be more specific.....
I would suspect that the "valley" would be where your best soil is going to be located. Any information you can share as far as what types of trees and shrubs you have and the condition of the understory and the ground in general (wet/dry/sandy/clay) will help as well. Do you have anything that produces mast as a foodsource for deer.....nuts, berries, other fruits and the like? Obviously giving those trees/shrubs/plants the best chance would be great projects. Simply giving them more daylight, reducing competition and maybe a dose of fertilizer can help. As far as traditional foodplots are concerned I would suggest looking into what sort of ag crops can and are growing in the general area. The deer should be familiar with those and would take to them faster. Otherwise I would think you might be limited to cool season plantings.....clovers, cereal grains (oats, wheat, rye) and brassica (radish, turnips, rape). These will tolerate cooler soil and air temperatures as well as shorter growing season to reach maturity as well. Looking in the general area tends to tell you what will grow best as those folks are trying to get the most out of that ground. Cover is always important as well as a strong understory. A good understory provides cover as well as browse for deer as well.....so if the trees you have a very mature and your understory is weak you may need to consider some logging. If you want to try planting trees and shrubs stay with native plants as much as possible or those specifically suited for your hardiness zone.....you mentioned the neighbor had fruit trees. You may want to find out what varieties those are and if they do well.
This is all pretty general stuff on my part simply because I am not familiar enough with your area and the like. The basics say look at what works in other areas around you. Look at what cover in your area holds the animals you want to hold and try to replicate that. Find the foods those animals like in your area and try to provide that. In many cases you don't have to "invent" anything. You simply need to provide more or a better quality of what is in your area that those targeted wildlife species like. From a hunting perspective you have to lay those things out as best you can to ensure you can hunt without educating the animals in the process. Sorry I can't be more specific.....
sandbur
5 year old buck +
If the property is new to you, walk it and find the places where they are bedding or where they might have bedded earlier in the season. Diagram rubs and look for a rub line. See if you can find feeding areas.
It looks to me like you should have a couple of bedding points or fingers.
Get an idea on what you have got before plunging ahead. It looks like some conifers are there which probably will change Deer movement after leaf fall.
What is the woods made up of? Oaks, popple, birch,fir, spruce, white cedar?
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It looks to me like you should have a couple of bedding points or fingers.
Get an idea on what you have got before plunging ahead. It looks like some conifers are there which probably will change Deer movement after leaf fall.
What is the woods made up of? Oaks, popple, birch,fir, spruce, white cedar?
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Telemark
5 year old buck +
Thanks, jbird. I plan to plant all those things you mentioned in food plots.
The best soil is in the bog. It's 6.8 pH and loaded with nutrients, especially calcium and magnesium. The rest of the hardwood forest is about 5.5 pH and decent nutrients. The whole area is on dolomitic limestone. Understory is nearly nonexistent. Where trees fall naturally, usually maples and a few raspberry bushes pop up. A few areas have grasses, especially the low boggy areas.
The southern part is red oak and beech. The southeastern hardwood patch is mostly red oak. The green bits are mostly cedar, but only the densest patches hold deer during rifle season.
The neighbor has apple trees, and there are a few other apple trees east of the property. One apple tree in particular is amazing and will provide great scion wood in the future. All the wildlife hammers the apples when they are in season. Eve the coyotes/wolves eat up the apples in September.
The best soil is in the bog. It's 6.8 pH and loaded with nutrients, especially calcium and magnesium. The rest of the hardwood forest is about 5.5 pH and decent nutrients. The whole area is on dolomitic limestone. Understory is nearly nonexistent. Where trees fall naturally, usually maples and a few raspberry bushes pop up. A few areas have grasses, especially the low boggy areas.
The southern part is red oak and beech. The southeastern hardwood patch is mostly red oak. The green bits are mostly cedar, but only the densest patches hold deer during rifle season.
The neighbor has apple trees, and there are a few other apple trees east of the property. One apple tree in particular is amazing and will provide great scion wood in the future. All the wildlife hammers the apples when they are in season. Eve the coyotes/wolves eat up the apples in September.
Telemark
5 year old buck +
There are very few deer on the property. Minimal bedding is apparent. Some bedding under the cliffs east of the pinch point circled in white.
Understory regeneration is very weak. I don't mind clearing hardwoods to plant tight pines or cedars for bedding/yard. Will probably plant some berry bushes for grouse.
I was thinking to plant loads of food, since everything responds to the apples, beech, and acorns.
Understory regeneration is very weak. I don't mind clearing hardwoods to plant tight pines or cedars for bedding/yard. Will probably plant some berry bushes for grouse.
I was thinking to plant loads of food, since everything responds to the apples, beech, and acorns.
Telemark
5 year old buck +
Peplin Creek
5 year old buck +
Do you have forest that can be logged off? This would create pockets of bedding/food for deer and also would help the grouse population once regeneration starts. Clovers help both species out a lot as well.
What size food plots do you plan on putting in? I would focus on on fall/winter plots. Hopefully having more food in winter will Help keep them there longer before migrating off your property.
Probably most important is having available browse for them though. Food plots help but having a lot of native browse is better overall. Think of ways to improve the habitat and treat the plots as a 2nd or 3rd food source.
Clovers, oats and rye, turnips and radishes would rate extremely high for me. Deer love my turnips and radishes bulbs in the winter months in Wisconsin. Hopefully they’ll work for you.
What size food plots do you plan on putting in? I would focus on on fall/winter plots. Hopefully having more food in winter will Help keep them there longer before migrating off your property.
Probably most important is having available browse for them though. Food plots help but having a lot of native browse is better overall. Think of ways to improve the habitat and treat the plots as a 2nd or 3rd food source.
Clovers, oats and rye, turnips and radishes would rate extremely high for me. Deer love my turnips and radishes bulbs in the winter months in Wisconsin. Hopefully they’ll work for you.
Telemark
5 year old buck +
I was thinking smaller plots of about an acre or less. Ultimately I would like to do about 3-5 acres total. Plus about 20-30 fruit trees.
Undergrowth regeneration is pathetic. They hammer the mountain maples, but I can't find them for sale anywhere. I was thinking to add some swamp oak, but I don't expect to live to see them produce acorns.
Undergrowth regeneration is pathetic. They hammer the mountain maples, but I can't find them for sale anywhere. I was thinking to add some swamp oak, but I don't expect to live to see them produce acorns.
bueller
Moderator
From the sounds of it some logging could go a long way. If you can get a logger in there I'd consider some 10-20 acre clear-cuts scattered about. This would break up the hardwoods which appear to be fairly even aged, create lots of edge, and on top of that it would provide a great deal of browse and bedding in coming years.
Long term you could do select areas every 10-15 years to transform that mature no understory forest to a wildlife hotspots.
Long term you could do select areas every 10-15 years to transform that mature no understory forest to a wildlife hotspots.
Telemark
5 year old buck +
I can't have it logged. But I can cut trees myself. Where would you recommend I cut trees?
They are very even aged trees. A few patches of smaller trees on the middle elevation.
bueller
Moderator
I think you have to consider where you want to establish bedding areas and food plots before creating either. You are going to want to be able to hunt the areas in between. As far as where to place them on your property, that's above my capabilities with the little known about your place.
bueller
Moderator
You have what appears to be a big blank slate there to work with. Order a copy of Grow Em Right from Craig and Neil Dougherty. Lots of good info. They talk alot about creating browse cuts around food plots and with the acreage you have and the lack of understory you have the room and opportunity to make this design shine.
Telemark
5 year old buck +
I thought about that, but the cold north wind org the lake seems to be a serious issue late in the year. I was thinking I have to make the bedding where it will actually provide thermal cover. Can I just make bedding anywhere?
